legov Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 What would happen in china and russia if a civil servant leaked sensitive stuff like this? ...Well...The American government would be up in arms about it. They're all pretty much as bad as each other, the main difference with America is that their citizens have swallowed all of the 'land of the free' bullshit, whereas the Russians are more aware of what their government is up to. Don't you think it's a bit hypocritical for the Russians and Chinese to be complaining about the spying, anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCforever1991 Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted June 23, 2013 Moderator Share Posted June 23, 2013 What would happen in china and russia if a civil servant leaked sensitive stuff like this? ...Well...The American government would be up in arms about it. They're all pretty much as bad as each other, the main difference with America is that their citizens have swallowed all of the 'land of the free' bullshit, whereas the Russians are more aware of what their government is up to. Don't you think it's a bit hypocritical for the Russians and Chinese to be complaining about the spying, anyway? I do, but I think what's different is that this time, they aren't spying on each other, they're spying on us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 The only thing that pisses me off about this snowden is a hero stuff is all the countries that are supporting him are probably doing the same thing, also china and russia trying to take the moral high ground is ridiculously amusing. What would happen in china and russia if a civil servant leaked sensitive stuff like this? Not saying i agree with it by the way but if you break the law whatever your motives then you should deal with the consequences. But what if the law you break exposes a deeper, more sinister crime? Yes, China will use him for their own propaganda, but that would have been predictable from the start. Snowden knew he was breaking the law (or at least the terms of the forms he signed), that's why he went to HK before sitting down with Greenwald. The reason people are calling him a hero is because he knew that by airing out this dirty laundry, he risks a lifetime behind bars, which is nothing to shrug at when you are just 27 years old. He also gave up a comfortable lifestyle in Hawaii for a life on the run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Ecuador have received an asylum request from Snowden. They'll get invaded at this rate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCforever1991 Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Yeah I imagine the US is already drawing up plans to create some kind of new war that involves Ecuador... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted June 23, 2013 Moderator Share Posted June 23, 2013 The Ecuadorian spring will be upon us before too long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 How is it going down in the American media? Are they outraged at the ubiquitous surveillance and the Obama administration's apparent disregard for their constitution, or do they see Snowden as an enemy and should rightly be charged with 'espionage'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 (edited) How is it going down in the American media? Are they outraged at the ubiquitous surveillance and the Obama administration's apparent disregard for their constitution, or do they see Snowden as an enemy and should rightly be charged with 'espionage'? The usual Military Industrial Complex whores are calling for his head, but most politically engaged Americans (roughly 10% of the population) view him in a positive light. Disgust at an unchecked surveillance state is one of the only things the left and right can agree on here. Edited June 23, 2013 by maqroll 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 That said, if a Republican was in the White House most dissenting right wing voices would be cheering on this Orwellian nightmare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Case in point- 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffy Biro Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 The only thing that pisses me off about this snowden is a hero stuff is all the countries that are supporting him are probably doing the same thing, also china and russia trying to take the moral high ground is ridiculously amusing. What would happen in china and russia if a civil servant leaked sensitive stuff like this? Not saying i agree with it by the way but if you break the law whatever your motives then you should deal with the consequences. But what if the law you break exposes a deeper, more sinister crime? Yes, China will use him for their own propaganda, but that would have been predictable from the start. Snowden knew he was breaking the law (or at least the terms of the forms he signed), that's why he went to HK before sitting down with Greenwald. The reason people are calling him a hero is because he knew that by airing out this dirty laundry, he risks a lifetime behind bars, which is nothing to shrug at when you are just 27 years old. He also gave up a comfortable lifestyle in Hawaii for a life on the run. Oh i understand all that, not sure i really have an opinion on what he did but just pointing out the countries that are so desperate to help are some of the worst for freedom of speech and democracy yet label him a hero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 The only thing that pisses me off about this snowden is a hero stuff is all the countries that are supporting him are probably doing the same thing, also china and russia trying to take the moral high ground is ridiculously amusing. What would happen in china and russia if a civil servant leaked sensitive stuff like this? Not saying i agree with it by the way but if you break the law whatever your motives then you should deal with the consequences. But what if the law you break exposes a deeper, more sinister crime? Yes, China will use him for their own propaganda, but that would have been predictable from the start. Snowden knew he was breaking the law (or at least the terms of the forms he signed), that's why he went to HK before sitting down with Greenwald. The reason people are calling him a hero is because he knew that by airing out this dirty laundry, he risks a lifetime behind bars, which is nothing to shrug at when you are just 27 years old. He also gave up a comfortable lifestyle in Hawaii for a life on the run. Oh i understand all that, not sure i really have an opinion on what he did but just pointing out the countries that are so desperate to help are some of the worst for freedom of speech and democracy yet label him a hero. I'm not sure that the governments of China and Russia have made statements to the effect that Snowden is a hero...I have seen activists in Hong Kong calling him a hero, because he's exposed a system that turns out to be not unlike the one they live under. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffy Biro Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 (edited) Well yea they arent going to publicly say it but by helping him get away they are pretty much supporting what he did/dont think its wrong or it could just be to piss of the mighty america Edited June 23, 2013 by Cliffy Biro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 NBC (The Democrat Party Propaganda Network) trying to smear Greenwald this morning, absolutely farcical: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xObacZAPk8w 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrackpotForeigner Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 How is it going down in the American media? Are they outraged at the ubiquitous surveillance and the Obama administration's apparent disregard for their constitution, or do they see Snowden as an enemy and should rightly be charged with 'espionage'? The usual Military Industrial Complex whores are calling for his head, but most politically engaged Americans (roughly 10% of the population) view him in a positive light. Disgust at an unchecked surveillance state is one of the only things the left and right can agree on here. I hope you don't feel bad about this. It's about 10% of any population Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Probably, but we get 100% of the stick for it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Where is Greenwald based? p.s. This isn't a worry about his house getting targeted by a drone, btw. Though perhaps it ought to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leviramsey Posted June 24, 2013 VT Supporter Share Posted June 24, 2013 Where is Greenwald based? p.s. This isn't a worry about his house getting targeted by a drone, btw. Though perhaps it ought to be. Brazil, IIRC. Easier for him to get a visa there than to get a visa for his lover to the US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tarjei Posted June 25, 2013 Share Posted June 25, 2013 (edited) A few days ago, Michael Hastings died. He worked for Rolling Stone. He's the guy who wrote the story about General McChrystal which resulted in the General's forced resignation. He was later threatened, with people saying if they didn't like what he wrote, they would kill him. It wasn't the first death threat he'd had. Shortly before his death, he emailed people to say he had a big story, if people came to interview them they should have legal representation present, and he was going off the radar. He then contacted a Wikileaks lawyer to say the FBI were investigating him. The FBI have since denied this. His last article was on the NSA story. Then he died. His car crashed into a tree at (estimates vary) maybe 120mph, at 4.30 am, nothing else on the road. An eye witness described seeing sparks and flames coming from the car before the crash. The engine and transmission were found 100 feet from the car. The police say there is no suspicion of foul play. You can see the engine here at the end of the video... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3LSY3wVuASg Eye-witness interview http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fweyFCFKcp0 Edited June 25, 2013 by tarjei Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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