villa-revolution Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 You are not the Chairman & you have still not come up with one single positive reason as to why you're a better man than Randy. Well i have no failed marriages, i haven't spent a fortune of my families money and struggle to get it all back and i haven't pissed off thousands of people in two different countries. Yet another classic case of character assassination & negative spin on Randy Lerner thus confirming every point I have raised about your attitude towards him. Big John can't stand the guy and I agree with every point he has made about Lerner. Are we not allowed to be unhappy with the clubs owner? Are not others allowed to be happy with the owner? Only some kind of Villa masochist would be happy with what Lerner is doing to our club. Are you for real? & only some kind of masochist would continually keep having a go at Randy Lerner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa-revolution Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 incapable of defending your self & proving your credentials in direct comparison vis a vis Randy Lerner. What on earth are you on about? Like I said this stupid point could be made to anyone who is critical about the manager or player. Did you say this to people who questioned or were critical of heskey? Doug? McLeish? Of course you didn't. Just confirming my original point which is given all your perfect hindsight why aren't you the Chairman. If this point is so stupid why can't you come up with a valid answer? You started with the utterly ludicrous argument of why people who criticise chairmen aren't in that position themselves. It's precisely because your point is so stupid that he can't come up with a valid answer. No. I basically asked the question that given John's perfect hindsight why isn't he Chairman? He knows the answer to every thing so surely that shouldn't be too difficult a poser for him. Also, it is a question for him not you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc1982 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Well you must be posting from some kind of parallel universe where Villa are in the top 6 playing scintillating football. Meanwhile the rest of us are having to put up with a Villa team who over the last year or so have seen some of the most humiliating defeats in our entire history. You're having a laugh mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 & only some kind of masochist would continually keep having a go at Randy Lerner. Why? Lerner has made balls up after balls up, and has proved to be a truly dismal owner. I honestly fear we will now never recover from his mis-management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa-revolution Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Well you must be posting from some kind of parallel universe where Villa are in the top 6 playing scintillating football. Meanwhile the rest of us are having to put up with a Villa team who over the last year or so have seen some of the most humiliating defeats in our entire history. You're having a laugh mate. I've been putting up with `The Villa` since 1968. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc1982 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Well you must be posting from some kind of parallel universe where Villa are in the top 6 playing scintillating football. Meanwhile the rest of us are having to put up with a Villa team who over the last year or so have seen some of the most humiliating defeats in our entire history. You're having a laugh mate. I've been putting up with `The Villa` since 1968. Yes, like a nodding dog. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa-revolution Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Well you must be posting from some kind of parallel universe where Villa are in the top 6 playing scintillating football. Meanwhile the rest of us are having to put up with a Villa team who over the last year or so have seen some of the most humiliating defeats in our entire history. You're having a laugh mate. I've been putting up with `The Villa` since 1968. Yes, like a nodding dog. Actually No. I am a child of the original Villa Revolution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) Well you must be posting from some kind of parallel universe where Villa are in the top 6 playing scintillating football. Meanwhile the rest of us are having to put up with a Villa team who over the last year or so have seen some of the most humiliating defeats in our entire history. You're having a laugh mate. but surely the owner is not directly responsible for the quality of football, indirectly maybe....in so much as sanctioning funds , but that is no guarantee as we have proved. The overall business performance -yes I will grant you that the managers are his appointments, so indirectly he has a responsibility, but hey if you want to go down that road..... we won the league with a duff owner and plenty of top managers have had notsogood owners. Edited January 13, 2014 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozvillafan Posted January 13, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2014 but surely the owner is not directly responsible for the quality of football, indirectly maybe....in so much as sanctioning funds , but that is no guarantee as we have proved. The overall business performance -yes I will grant you that the managers are his appointments, so indirectly he has a responsibility, but hey if you want to go down that road..... we won the league with a duff owner and plenty of top managers have had notsogood owners. Randy is not responsible for team selections, transfer targets, formations, substitutions, our "style of play" (if we even have one), picking the squad or coaching. What we are seeing on the pitch is the direct responsibility of Lambert and his staff. However, Randy is responsible for setting budgets, profit/loss, player contracts, appointing managers and providing infrastructure (training grounds, club shop and merchandise, ground facilities etc). There are very few clubs that have no budget, he has provided better infrastructure and he's learning on player contracts (though he will need to increase them now the big earners are gone). I'll leave profit/loss for those better equipped to understand the figures. His biggest weak spot is in appointing managers. The jury is out (imo) for Lambert.... ... but our recent history of managers doesn't garner much confidence (including MON - although I would have liked to see Houllier remain over McLeish). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nazvfc Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Well you must be posting from some kind of parallel universe where Villa are in the top 6 playing scintillating football. Meanwhile the rest of us are having to put up with a Villa team who over the last year or so have seen some of the most humiliating defeats in our entire history. You're having a laugh mate. I've been putting up with `The Villa` since 1968. I was putting up with Villa around 6 years before that too. The times between 1962 and 68 were much much worse than this - then it was an even playing field - no rich owners - but we were bankrupt (nearly) - the fans came and helped restore the ground by painting the stadium and tending the pitch. I really do wonder what some of the 'modern day' fan would do if we were in that situation. IF and this is a BIG IF we got relegated I am sure some would disappear into the internet ether and only return when we are successful. Not having a go but my opinion based on lurking and only just string to post. Think some of those with the loudest voices are those who have only followed Villa post 1981/2 (or since the Preeemeirship) came into being - not having witnessed what to me personally were much worse times than these. Not having a go but I read about getting banners and leaflets out - well myself and quite a few others got up off our arses and put our money where our mouth was - the £ signs galvanised the fans and we managed to get Angel. The Ellis Out stuff may not have been successful but kept the pressure on the 'owner' (or the man who thought he was the owner). If you feel so much hate or animosity against Lerner - do something - don't fight amongst yourselves - you all have something in common - a love of the Villa. But I think you feel safer in moaning on the boards and fighting amongst each other than putting your head above the parapet. Times are not as bad as you think (It's great in hindsight to point to everything). Things can only get better and mark my words after all the shit since the revolution of 68 - this is nothing. We came back stronger and we will again. Flame me all you want but I have been through worse shit than the last 3 odd years. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 incapable of defending your self & proving your credentials in direct comparison vis a vis Randy Lerner. What on earth are you on about? Like I said this stupid point could be made to anyone who is critical about the manager or player. Did you say this to people who questioned or were critical of heskey? Doug? McLeish? Of course you didn't. Just confirming my original point which is given all your perfect hindsight why aren't you the Chairman. If this point is so stupid why can't you come up with a valid answer? You started with the utterly ludicrous argument of why people who criticise chairmen aren't in that position themselves. It's precisely because your point is so stupid that he can't come up with a valid answer. No. I basically asked the question that given John's perfect hindsight why isn't he Chairman? He knows the answer to every thing so surely that shouldn't be too difficult a poser for him. Also, it is a question for him not you. Are you aware of how Lerner became chairman? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrees Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 If Randy Lerner sells today, he leaves the club in better shape than when he arrived. Unfortunately that is in terms of the facilities, both at VP and BH, and of course the (apparent) debt free financial position, rather than any improvement on the pitch. The £ sign protests that we had against Ellis could never be levelled at Lerner, as he has backed all of his managers with substantial amounts of cash for players. With O'Neill he was unlucky and foolish, with Houllier unlucky, and with McLeish just plain foolish. When he goes, which I think is a foregone conclusion, and I will be happy for him to do so, it is he who will be licking his wounds. I worry about what will follow..... 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DelboyVilla Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 If Randy Lerner sells today, he leaves the club in better shape than when he arrived. Unfortunately that is in terms of the facilities, both at VP and BH, and of course the (apparent) debt free financial position, rather than any improvement on the pitch. The £ sign protests that we had against Ellis could never be levelled at Lerner, as he has backed all of his managers with substantial amounts of cash for players. With O'Neill he was unlucky and foolish, with Houllier unlucky, and with McLeish just plain foolish. When he goes, which I think is a foregone conclusion, and I will be happy for him to do so, it is he who will be licking his wounds. I worry about what will follow..... Rubbish! If he left today he would leave it in the exact same position as Ellis had with a very poor squad on the pitch who will struggle with relegation for the foreseeable future mainly due to a lack of investment/very poor investment. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houlston Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Or you have to be able to bring on new channels of revenue, Lerner has failed doing both. Hasn't the club increased non tv revenue at almost the same % increase as tv revenue? No. The May 2012 accounts show that every single line of income decreased. TV money was down, match day income was down, commercial income was down, So it still could be in line with tv revenue? Either way to say new channels of revenue hasn't been bought in is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dn1982 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I'm not sure what some people want. We haven't got the financial power to compete year in year out so I see it like this. When Lerner came we had a go at the top four spent heavily as we all know and it never came off. Unfortunately the people in charged never seemed to have a plan if we never made it and we found ourself spending virtually all our income on wages. That has now been rectified so IMO the time to truly judge Lerner is in the coming seasons. The excuses will have gone just because we have had 3 bad years doesn't doesn't wipe out the 3 good years but would you have swapped 3 good and 3 bad for 6 mediocre? Personally? No. We had a go it never worked now it's time to go again or let some some one else be our custodian! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Or you have to be able to bring on new channels of revenue, Lerner has failed doing both. Hasn't the club increased non tv revenue at almost the same % increase as tv revenue? No. The May 2012 accounts show that every single line of income decreased. TV money was down, match day income was down, commercial income was down, I'm actually totally shocked at this. I remember Lerner being quoted as saying that he wanted our club to run like a self sufficient business. Well if that is the case the whole board is failing miserably to put us in a position to do that when you consider the income which can be generated from football today. An utterly terrible indictment of how our club is currently being run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted January 13, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2014 If Randy Lerner sells today, he leaves the club in better shape than when he arrived. Unfortunately that is in terms of the facilities, both at VP and BH, and of course the (apparent) debt free financial position, rather than any improvement on the pitch. The £ sign protests that we had against Ellis could never be levelled at Lerner, as he has backed all of his managers with substantial amounts of cash for players. With O'Neill he was unlucky and foolish, with Houllier unlucky, and with McLeish just plain foolish. When he goes, which I think is a foregone conclusion, and I will be happy for him to do so, it is he who will be licking his wounds. I worry about what will follow..... Rubbish! If he left today he would leave it in the exact same position as Ellis had with a very poor squad on the pitch who will struggle with relegation for the foreseeable future mainly due to a lack of investment/very poor investment. If you believe that no wonder we are accused of having unfair expectations. The whole of football has moved on massively over Learners ownership, if we had not improved we would be in real trouble. What happens on the pitch is not the whole story! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 & only some kind of masochist would continually keep having a go at Randy Lerner. Why? Lerner has made balls up after balls up, and has proved to be a truly dismal owner. I honestly fear we will now never recover from his mis-management. You just enjoy wallowing in negativity Risso - you never really make an appearance when things are going well. Well using that logic Risso has been posting constantly on here over the last three years so that should tell you a lot. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrees Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 If Randy Lerner sells today, he leaves the club in better shape than when he arrived. Unfortunately that is in terms of the facilities, both at VP and BH, and of course the (apparent) debt free financial position, rather than any improvement on the pitch. The £ sign protests that we had against Ellis could never be levelled at Lerner, as he has backed all of his managers with substantial amounts of cash for players. With O'Neill he was unlucky and foolish, with Houllier unlucky, and with McLeish just plain foolish. When he goes, which I think is a foregone conclusion, and I will be happy for him to do so, it is he who will be licking his wounds. I worry about what will follow..... Rubbish! If he left today he would leave it in the exact same position as Ellis had with a very poor squad on the pitch who will struggle with relegation for the foreseeable future mainly due to a lack of investment/very poor investment. So you agree with my post, but it's 'Rubbish!'!? And you cite 'lack of investment' (Ellis) with 'very poor investment' (Lerner). There's a clue there. One did, one didn't. I think that you and I would get on 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DelboyVilla Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 If Randy Lerner sells today, he leaves the club in better shape than when he arrived. Unfortunately that is in terms of the facilities, both at VP and BH, and of course the (apparent) debt free financial position, rather than any improvement on the pitch. The £ sign protests that we had against Ellis could never be levelled at Lerner, as he has backed all of his managers with substantial amounts of cash for players. With O'Neill he was unlucky and foolish, with Houllier unlucky, and with McLeish just plain foolish. When he goes, which I think is a foregone conclusion, and I will be happy for him to do so, it is he who will be licking his wounds. I worry about what will follow..... Rubbish! If he left today he would leave it in the exact same position as Ellis had with a very poor squad on the pitch who will struggle with relegation for the foreseeable future mainly due to a lack of investment/very poor investment. So you agree with my post, but it's 'Rubbish!'!? And you cite 'lack of investment' (Ellis) with 'very poor investment' (Lerner). There's a clue there. One did, one didn't. I think that you and I would get on Maybe we could go plane spotting together Trees? It's always good to find a like mind? It's amazing really how two very different people both have got to the same position in two such different ways. One was an old fool who couldn't be parted from any money and the other just a fool who spent lots of money on rubbish! Both have left us with a substandard team on the pitch but hey ho that's not everything when we have a scarf and a flag!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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