Manager Paul Lambert

[Kwan]

 

We are a mid table club with a mid table board currently only willing and prepared to fund at lower table levels.  We have a manager who is working on a long term plan to have the club perform to a higher level than that consistently and to be honest given the funding and the fact that clubs around us have spent large sums more than us the fact that we are at this place in the league with as many points as we have is pretty admirable.

 

Note the long term by the way.  Sort of signifies more than 16 months despite the supporter frustration and impatience that pervades this site.

 

But we're not lower table in terms of funding at all, you're believing the nonsense peddled by some.  We've spent £43m, and according to Paul Faulkner and Robin Russell it was Lambert's decision on how he spent it.  The fact that he has spent that amount of money, and has turned us into the dreariest team in the Premier League is why I want him gone.

 

 

43m in transfers but on what wages?

[Big_John_10]

you're believing the nonsense peddled by some

How is our wage limits nonsense?

What convinces a player to join a club, the fee we pay his club or the wages we pay him?

[Risso]

 

 

We are a mid table club with a mid table board currently only willing and prepared to fund at lower table levels.  We have a manager who is working on a long term plan to have the club perform to a higher level than that consistently and to be honest given the funding and the fact that clubs around us have spent large sums more than us the fact that we are at this place in the league with as many points as we have is pretty admirable.

 

Note the long term by the way.  Sort of signifies more than 16 months despite the supporter frustration and impatience that pervades this site.

 

But we're not lower table in terms of funding at all, you're believing the nonsense peddled by some.  We've spent £43m, and according to Paul Faulkner and Robin Russell it was Lambert's decision on how he spent it.  The fact that he has spent that amount of money, and has turned us into the dreariest team in the Premier League is why I want him gone.

 

 

Since when have we spent £43 million?

Also, if you want him gone, who do you want as a replacement?

 

 

Since Paul Lambert started.

 

As for who I'd like as a replacement, Lucien Favre.

[AVFCforever1991]

I doubt he would leave Gladbach.

[jon_c]

It was confirmed by Lambert that Bacuna cost £800,000 and that Lowton and Westwood were both less than that. With that in mind I can't work out it any where near £43 million. 

[Risso]

It was confirmed by Lambert that Bacuna cost £800,000 and that Lowton and Westwood were both less than that. With that in mind I can't work out it any where near £43 million. 

 

Unfortunately, the accounts confirm in a factual sense that they (Lowton and Westwood) must have cost more than that, unless other players cost more than their reported values.

[Risso]

I doubt he would leave Gladbach.

 

Well, that's entirely possible, but the question was "who would you like to replace Lambert".  Until McLeishbert is actually given the tin tack, we won't know who would fancy it.

[AVFCforever1991]

According to transfermarket.co.uk,  Lowton was 3.3m and Westwood was 2.2m

 

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/aston-villa/transfers/verein_405_2012_default_default_alle_a_default.html

Edited December 16, 2013 by AVFCforever1991

[jon_c]

 

It was confirmed by Lambert that Bacuna cost £800,000 and that Lowton and Westwood were both less than that. With that in mind I can't work out it any where near £43 million. 

 

Unfortunately, the accounts confirm in a factual sense that they (Lowton and Westwood) must have cost more than that, unless other players cost more than their reported values.

 

Does anyone have a link to these accounts? I would like a gander, thanks. 

[Risso]

 

 

It was confirmed by Lambert that Bacuna cost £800,000 and that Lowton and Westwood were both less than that. With that in mind I can't work out it any where near £43 million. 

 

Unfortunately, the accounts confirm in a factual sense that they (Lowton and Westwood) must have cost more than that, unless other players cost more than their reported values.

 

Does anyone have a link to these accounts? I would like a gander, thanks. 

 

 

I linked to a page confirming last year's spend.  Other than that, spend a quid at Companies House.

[jon_c]

According to transfermarket.co.uk,  Lowton was 3.3m and Westwood was 2.2m

 

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/aston-villa/transfers/verein_405_2012_default_default_alle_a_default.html

 

I was just going off this article, straight from the horses mouth (as it were)

http://goo.gl/50Of2Y

 

Birmingham Mail

 

Paul Lambert claims many of his bargain buys were cheaper than he is given credit for – but the manager was unable to disclose why Villa’s transfer fees remain undisclosed.

Lambert reckons Leandro Bacuna, Ashley Westwood, Matt Lowton and Antonio Luna cost less than the million-plus figures reported when they arrived at the club.

He fears the inflated fees that come from the failure to disclose figures gives a distorted sense of the amount he has spent at Villa.

Asked if Leandro Bacuna represented one of the best bargains of his management career after his recent free kick heroics , Lambert tried to set the record straight about some of his other cut-price captures.

It has emerged that Bacuna cost around £800,000 from Groningen after previous indications suggested he arrived for more.

“Yes, Leo was a bargain but Westwood was probably cheaper,” said Lambert.

“Matt Lowton was around the same mark. Luna was the same – around that mark.”

“When you look at it, I see figures that are bandied about with some of my players

“I think somebody must be getting a backhander because they’re nowhere near that level of money!

“So I don’t know where the figures come from. It makes me laugh because it’s nowhere near that.

Edited December 16, 2013 by jon_c

[VillaCas]

 

 

 

 

The Spurs thing is interesting. Surely if Lambert is as good as many are saying then his name would be in the frame for that job?

I think you're confusing 'I don't want Lambert sacked' with 'Lambert is amazing'.

Carry on creating strawmen to argue against though

- Strawman - got to love a bit of abuse

How is pointing out the type of argument you are using abuse? You misrepresent people's arguments and then proceed to taking them down. That's what a straw man argument is. Nobody is saying Lambert is amazing, sorry.

 

thanks for the like at first (quick edit was it? - thank you VT app for notifying me) - any chance of not concentrating on the poster and more on the points being raised? - cheers

 

 

Nobody was??

[StanBalaban]

According to transfermarket.co.uk,  Lowton was 3.3m and Westwood was 2.2m

 

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/aston-villa/transfers/verein_405_2012_default_default_alle_a_default.html

I'd take a quote from the manager over a third party guess on 'undisclosed' transfer fees.

 

 

In the recent pre-Baggies press conference Paul Lambert admitted that transfer fees for some of his players were far less than had been reported by the press. Obviously, undisclosed fees do lead to guess work and the press do like to inflate prices to amp up the story (take the case of Darren Bent, constantly reported as Villa’s £22 million man, when £18 million and add-ons was more realistic).

Lambert hinted that Leandro Bacuna, Ashley Westwood, Matt Lowton and Antonio Luna all cost less than the million-plus figures reported when they joined the club.

 The fee for Bacuna was always pitched at around £880,000, so Lambert’s following remarks, when he compared a trio of players to that price, made for interested reading in yesterday’s papers.

“Yes, Leo was a bargain but Westwood was probably cheaper,” said Lambert.

“Matt Lowton was around the same mark. Luna was the same – around that mark.”

“When you look at it, I see figures that are bandied about with some of my players

“I think somebody must be getting a backhander because they’re nowhere near that level of money!”

What? Like the potential backhanders on the Villa transfers involving Bosko Balban and Juan Pablo Angel?!

Staying on topic, here are the prices that were reported to be the prices of the Villa trio mentioned:

Ashley Westwood – £2,200,000 (£1.4 million above actual fee?)

Matt Lowton – £3,300,000 (£2.4 million above actual fee?)

Antonio Luna – £1,760,000 (£800,00 above actual fee?)

If we take these figures supplied by the website Transfermarkt, which tend to mirror press reports at the time of the transfer and offer a decent ballpark figure, then Villa would now have roughly £4,600,000 more in the bank than expected.

http://www.myoldmansaid.com/aston-villa-transfer-fees-paul-lambert-confession/

[Risso]

This was the bit that confirmed that last year we spend £21.7m, which bar a few hundred grand, agrees to the reported total cost of Lowton and Westwood etc:

 

http://www.villatalk.com/index.php/topic/10285-last-set-of-accounts/page-2#entry1135591

[VillaCas]

 

 

From a Spurs website.....

 

Chiriches - bit early to tell, and to be fair he's missed all their worst drubbings

Paulinho - technically limited midfield workhorse of the kind Brazil have feted since 1994 ("Brazilian 'water carriers' from Dunga onwards" would be a good feature for one of the writers on tactics). Suspect he might look ok if his only job were to close down opposing players and quickly give the ball to someone with an iota of attacking ability when he receives it. Unfortunately, at Tottenham he has no teammate who meets that description and instead subjects the paying public to his own hapless attempts to be a playmaker

Capoue - another midfield plodder. Looks slightly drunk when running with the ball

Chadli - just bizarre that he is playing for a Premier League team with theoretical top 4 ambitions. Lacks pace, passing ability, skill... any attribute that might enable him to prise open a defence

Holtby - Little bit more craft than Chadli, but compare him to the number 10/winger type players at the clubs Spurs are supposedly competing with eg Hazard, Cazorla, David Silva... He is nowhere near. What's the point of having dross like this filling squad places? Just get a smaller number of better players, like Arsenal

Soldado - knocking on 30 million euros for a striker already in his late 20s who seems to have nothing to set him apart from players of the level of Gary Hooper or Shane Long. Suspect he will prove the worst buy of a very bad bunch

Eriksen - Might turn out ok, but utter madness to expect a 21 year old in a new country moving from a much weaker league to be sole creative outlet for a team aiming for the top 4

Lamela - As above. Not such a weak league, but he just seems such a tragic figure destined not to fit in England. I'd wager he'll be back in Italy by the start of next season.

 

Not just Lambert who can't pick up these budding Roy Keanes that are apparently out there waiting to be spotted

 

At least we didn't waste £100m + and the same again  in wages

 

Capoue - looks slightly drunk when running.....classic line! very funny

We'll at least they're not trying to excuse defeat by the opposing team earning more.

 

 

what does that even mean?

 

 

I pointed out that my expectations of a win on Sunday were low given the clear disparity in the standard of the squads, and used Rooney as an example of a player who probably earns more than our entire team as an illustration of that.  

 

Morpheus obviously and predictably (mis)interpreted that as me saying "no team could ever beat another team if that team earns more"

 

Edited December 16, 2013 by VillaCas

[StanBalaban]

This was the bit that confirmed that last year we spend £21.7m, which bar a few hundred grand, agrees to the reported total cost of Lowton and Westwood etc:

 

http://www.villatalk.com/index.php/topic/10285-last-set-of-accounts/page-2#entry1135591

I have no idea, so just a guess here, but could that include signing on bonuses, agents fees and other extras?

[darrenm]

 

Genuinely intrigued at why people are not worried that he will be "poached"

 

 

I am. I think he's the best of what spurs could get at the moment. Premier League experience, kept us up last season with comparatively little investment, overachieving with us considering the wages and transfer budget.

 

I think it'd be a low risk choice for them and I hope they don't see that.

[StanBalaban]

 

 

Genuinely intrigued at why people are not worried that he will be "poached"

 

 

I am. I think he's the best of what spurs could get at the moment. Premier League experience, kept us up last season with comparatively little investment, overachieving with us considering the wages and transfer budget.

 

I think it'd be a low risk choice for them and I hope they don't see that.

 

I think Spurs are more likely to look to Laudrup if they're looking within the Prem, but I agree with the rest of your statement. 

[darrenm]

 

According to transfermarket.co.uk,  Lowton was 3.3m and Westwood was 2.2m

 

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/aston-villa/transfers/verein_405_2012_default_default_alle_a_default.html

I'd take a quote from the manager over a third party guess on 'undisclosed' transfer fees.

 

 

In the recent pre-Baggies press conference Paul Lambert admitted that transfer fees for some of his players were far less than had been reported by the press. Obviously, undisclosed fees do lead to guess work and the press do like to inflate prices to amp up the story (take the case of Darren Bent, constantly reported as Villa’s £22 million man, when £18 million and add-ons was more realistic).

Lambert hinted that Leandro Bacuna, Ashley Westwood, Matt Lowton and Antonio Luna all cost less than the million-plus figures reported when they joined the club.

 The fee for Bacuna was always pitched at around £880,000, so Lambert’s following remarks, when he compared a trio of players to that price, made for interested reading in yesterday’s papers.

“Yes, Leo was a bargain but Westwood was probably cheaper,” said Lambert.

“Matt Lowton was around the same mark. Luna was the same – around that mark.”

“When you look at it, I see figures that are bandied about with some of my players

“I think somebody must be getting a backhander because they’re nowhere near that level of money!”

What? Like the potential backhanders on the Villa transfers involving Bosko Balban and Juan Pablo Angel?!

Staying on topic, here are the prices that were reported to be the prices of the Villa trio mentioned:

Ashley Westwood – £2,200,000 (£1.4 million above actual fee?)

Matt Lowton – £3,300,000 (£2.4 million above actual fee?)

Antonio Luna – £1,760,000 (£800,00 above actual fee?)

If we take these figures supplied by the website Transfermarkt, which tend to mirror press reports at the time of the transfer and offer a decent ballpark figure, then Villa would now have roughly £4,600,000 more in the bank than expected.

http://www.myoldmansaid.com/aston-villa-transfer-fees-paul-lambert-confession/

 

Yeah there's been a fair bit of toing and froing on here recently with the discrepancy between the official accounts and what Lambert claims he has spent on certain players. Faulkner appears to support the official accounts.

 

I'm not an accountant and I don't work in finance but it would certainly appear obvious to me that the differences could quite easily be attributed to the headline up front transfer figure against extra money that would need to be taken into account but what a manager wouldn't normally need to be concerned with, such as add-ons, bonuses etc. Lambert may agree to pay £800,000 as a transfer fee to the selling club (after being ratified by the Villa hierarchy), but then contract negotiations with both the selling club and the player will add figures onto that. It's probably convenient for the manager to not be concerned about those extras when showing how he's got good deals, but historically no other managers have either.

Edited December 16, 2013 by darrenm

[StanBalaban]

Whichever way we look at it, I think we can all agree that it's not enough money for a club with any kind of aspirations in this league.