U.S. Politics

[sidcow]

1 minute ago, Demitri_C said:

Look at their cost of living, immigration and the drug issues there. Its been terrible

My only issue with the top class comment is that if thwy were so top class they would have removed biden way before this election. They have made a right mess of this as timing is so risky

Cost of living issues are no worse than elsewhere in the Western World are they? 

I don't know enough about US Immigration to comment but I'm suspicious this sounds more like a Trump attack line. 

Drugs? Well. Yes, like most Western Nations there is a drugs problem. Is it worse now than it was under say Obama or Trump? 

[Demitri_C]

16 minutes ago, sidcow said:

Cost of living issues are no worse than elsewhere in the Western World are they? 

I don't know enough about US Immigration to comment but I'm suspicious this sounds more like a Trump attack line. 

Drugs? Well. Yes, like most Western Nations there is a drugs problem. Is it worse now than it was under say Obama or Trump? 

But then if we are using that reason then we shouldnt be blaming the tories for the cost of living either?

I dont agree with your assessment on this one sid governments are responsible for making things better. If that was trumps administration he would be getting pelters. Has to be fair criticism for all no matter what side of the political spectrum you are on

[bickster]

13 minutes ago, sidcow said:

 

Drugs? Well. Yes, like most Western Nations there is a drugs problem. Is it worse now than it was under say Obama or Trump? 

The drugs problem in America is the opioid crisis, which isn’t quite the same as other countries issues as it’s partly a problem of prescribed drugs in a private healthcare model. Not far off a million people have died in the US of drug overdoses this century

[nick76]

15 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Look at their cost of living, immigration and the drug issues there. Its been terrible

My only issue with the top class comment is that if thwy were so top class they would have removed biden way before this election. They have made a right mess of this as timing is so risky

I think you are missing so much context on the first line in response to Sidcow’s question. I think you are a bit off on many of those topics, additionally all the good things this administration has got through.

As for the second paragraph, I don’t think they’ve made a mistake.  Bizarrely in most of the polls it hasn’t impacted his numbers, in fact Biden in some polls has improved.  I don’t think there is a natural replacement even if this was done last year because as I discussed in previous comments on this thread there is nobody that doesn’t have issues.  Even the right wing have no natural placement for Trump either.  I think it would’ve been more of a risk to replace Biden to be honest.  It’s also very risky to replace the incumbent in a party.

We obviously don’t agree on this topic but I’m staying behind Biden because he showed the following night after the debate he’s still got it and maybe it was just his cold affecting him on debate night.  Who knows!

[nick76]

26 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Look at their cost of living, immigration and the drug issues there. Its been terrible

Also you can’t place the majority of blame of the immigration issue on Biden as it’s a historical issue plus, as you will point out it’s getting worse, that Biden has tried to fix it.  

They even had a bi-partisan senate agreement but Trump got his sycophants in the House and Senate to block any attempts to pass it as Trump has publicly told everybody.  

As co-equal branch of government they have just as much power as the Excutive branch/Biden so he hasn’t been able to get anything through, so you can blame that one on Trump.

[Demitri_C]

2 minutes ago, nick76 said:

I think you are missing so much context on the first line in response to Sidcow’s question. I think you are a bit off on many of those topics, additionally all the good things this administration has got through.

As for the second paragraph, I don’t think they’ve made a mistake.  Bizarrely in most of the polls it hasn’t impacted his numbers, in fact Biden in some polls has improved.  I don’t think there is a natural replacement even if this was done last year because as I discussed in previous comments on this thread there is nobody that doesn’t have issues.  Even the right wing have no natural placement for Trump either.  I think it would’ve been more of a risk to replace Biden to be honest.  It’s also very risky to replace the incumbent in a party.

We obviously don’t agree on this topic but I’m staying behind Biden because he showed the following night after the debate he’s still got it and maybe it was just his cold affecting him on debate night.  Who knows!

I think there is a bit of biased opinions on here to be honest as most are left wing supporters [the few centralists like how i consider myself criticise both the left and the right parties] but alot of left leaning supporters will not accept when the left isnt doing things great. Its the same with the right they wont accept when their parties are doing shit. Thats poltics for you and VT is mainly left wing so you dont really get anyone from the right telling their side of the argument. Dont take it as a attack as its not intended to be its just my own observation.

With regards to polls its closer than ever nick. I think if you see how much biden won at the last election to trump for it to be this close that speaks volumes and shows how badly biden is doing.

Yep we dont agree on this subject and thats absolutely fine. we having a good respectful debate. I welcome that its better to have different opinions otherwise this would be a rather boring place!

 

[Jareth]

Trump represents a strong man, power, greed and selfishness. Biden is supposed to represent some sort of moral leadership and competency. Which side best represents America these days? I think it's Trump's version. 

[Genie]

1 hour ago, Demitri_C said:

Bidens been as big a disaster as trump was.

[nick76]

8 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

I think there is a bit of biased opinions on here to be honest as most are left wing supporters [the few centralists like how i consider myself criticise both the left and the right parties] but alot of left leaning supporters will not accept when the left isnt doing things great. Its the same with the right they wont accept when their parties are doing shit. Thats poltics for you and VT is mainly left wing so you dont really get anyone from the right telling their side of the argument. Dont take it as a attack as its not intended to be its just my own observation.

With regards to polls its closer than ever nick. I think if you see how much biden won at the last election to trump for it to be this close that speaks volumes and shows how badly biden is doing.

Yep we dont agree on this subject and thats absolutely fine. we having a good respectful debate. I welcome that its better to have different opinions otherwise this would be a rather boring place!

 

I’m not left wing.  I’m a floater and swing between either line of the political line and probably voted 50/50 over the years.  My opinion is purely based on Trump and his intentions, I really think he’s a danger and not just him but his support network.  Any traditional Republican I would’ve agreed with you but Trump and allies, take this from a political ideology discussion to a pure anybody but Trump for me.

[Panto_Villan]

The irony is that in America the ‘cost of living crisis’ was smaller than in Europe, because they weren’t exposed to the Russian gas market supply shock like Europe was.

But much of inflation they has was absolutely caused by Biden and the enormous amounts of money they handed out to everyone during covid.

Thing is, they’ve also had good economic growth and strongly rising wages, so people haven’t really lost out. It’s just that people really dislike high inflation even if their wages are also increasing at similar rates, and count it as economic mismanagement.

[maqroll]

1 hour ago, sidcow said:

Cost of living issues are no worse than elsewhere in the Western World are they? 

I don't know enough about US Immigration to comment but I'm suspicious this sounds more like a Trump attack line. 

Drugs? Well. Yes, like most Western Nations there is a drugs problem. Is it worse now than it was under say Obama or Trump? 

Biden is a poor candidate because of the optics of him moving and speaking like he's got one foot in the grave. But his cabinet officials, aides and advisors are more or less competent America Inc. types that Wall St., G7, NATO etc. can depend on, for better or worse depending on your outlook. For me it's a mixed bag, but if the alternative is Trump, Biden remains the superior option. Unfortunately, most voters base their vote on superficial criteria.

If Biden was not lost in space as he is now, he'd be able to run effectively on his accomplishments, but he can't even articulate what they are. 

Despite what the Fox News-GOP-Trump Axis of Lies says, the United States recovered from the Covid years faster than most industrial nations, and the economy here is doing well despite lingering inflation. Violent crime is down, jobs are up. If this was 20th century America, it would be considered a normal, peaceful period. But in the early 1970's, Roger Ailes and Rupert Murdoch planted the seeds of the harvest we've been reaping for the last 25 years.

If all you did was watch and listen to right wing media, you'd think we are in another Great Depression, the southern border is being "invaded" by an "army", children everywhere are being abducted by Trans drag queens, crime is rampant (in cities with Democrat mayors), Democrats are demonic communists, etc.

There is a generalized false narrative that has been conjured up by right wing media and it's become so entrenched in this country that it may as well be 100% true at this point.

Even though he is a colossal idiot, Trump is a shrewd operator in some ways, and he was shrewd enough to know he could seize upon these false narratives and use them to his advantage, and he has done just that, with sparkling success. And now he wants to finish what he and Steve Bannon started, which is the stripping down of the federal government to a handful of departments that are under complete submission to MAGA. 

You'll see the USA imploding from within, (with Putin's tacit approval), you'll see us pull out of NATO and you'll see Putin given the green light to invade the Baltics, Poland and maybe even Finland. 

There is NOTHING good about another Trump term, unless it's a prison term.

 

 

[maqroll]

1 hour ago, nick76 said:

I’m not left wing.  I’m a floater

[maqroll]

1 hour ago, Panto_Villan said:

The irony is that in America the ‘cost of living crisis’ was smaller than in Europe, because they weren’t exposed to the Russian gas market supply shock like Europe was.

But much of inflation they has was absolutely caused by Biden and the enormous amounts of money they handed out to everyone during covid.

Thing is, they’ve also had good economic growth and strongly rising wages, so people haven’t really lost out. It’s just that people really dislike high inflation even if their wages are also increasing at similar rates, and count it as economic mismanagement.

The obscene tax cut Trump showered upon corporations and the super-rich has done nothing for Americans who feel the pinch right now. 

Trump's 2017 dismantling of Obama's pandemic task force set the stage for Covid devastation here and the financial upheaval that followed.

Biden sent out $1000 checks give or take to families on the precipice, and if that's considered the cause of inflation, I can't think of one that is better justified.

 

 

[nick76]

25 minutes ago, maqroll said:

I’ve been called a piece of shit many times in my life so it’s appropriate

[DCJonah]

3 hours ago, Demitri_C said:

I think its a disaster if either wins. Bidens been as big a disaster as trump was.

Both shouldn't be running

Insane. 

Trump tried to end democracy. He's done more to cause insane conspiracy theories and divide in that country than anything Biden has done.

[Panto_Villan]

20 minutes ago, maqroll said:

The obscene tax cut Trump showered upon corporations and the super-rich has done nothing for Americans who feel the pinch right now. 

Trump's 2017 dismantling of Obama's pandemic task force set the stage for Covid devastation here and the financial upheaval that followed.

Biden sent out $1000 checks give or take to families on the precipice, and if that's considered the cause of inflation, I can't think of one that is better justified.

 

 

Actually, yeah, you’re correct. It was Trump that signed the covid aid package that was worth 10% of GDP into law.

[Rds1983]

38 minutes ago, Genie said:

I’m starting to think @Demitri_C’s account is run by a Russian bot farm.

A bot would make fewer spelling mistakes. 

I might not agree with his all of his opinions, but at least he's engaged and is actively discussing and questioning. 

Trump has also recently shown cognitive degeneration, the trouble is that with Biden, the difference seems stark, whereas with Trump he's always been a confused, bumbling imbecile. 

Neither of them should be running. Both are older and seemingly more infirm than my FIL and he finds using a smartphone incredibly difficult as he's that out of touch with the modern world and struggling to keep up. It's a ridiculous scenario and choice of candidates. 

[Genie]

Just now, Demitri_C said:

I am defensive because i am not a right winger or a conspiracy theorist. I dont want to be labelled that.  My position is centralist. I am on the side of praising whichever side is doing well. I have voted labour, conservative and lib dems in the past. Unlike some die hard labour and conservative voters i do not just vote for same party every election like they do.

Everyone  knows i am against ulez but no conspiracy theory about it dont need to go over this again

Thanks for apology and im sorry too if i over reacted. I dont mind disagreeing with me but i prefer if we just stay on subject without making judgements on people you dont agree with. I like a good debate as iwas having with nick earlier. Lets have more of that

You said that Biden’s time as president was as bad as Trump’s, it’s complete nonsense. 

People had the news on series link when Trump was president as every day he said or did something insane.

[Demitri_C]

4 minutes ago, Genie said:

You said that Biden’s time as president was as bad as Trump’s, it’s complete nonsense. 

People had the news on series link when Trump was president as every day he said or did something insane.

Thats a matter of opinion if its nonsensical genie as thats just your opinion. If it was as good as you say biden will win by a landslide wont he ?

The polls suggest otherwise 

I do agree with you though about trump spouting something insane

The original point about biden getting a pass for the problems because its a  global problem sorey im not having that. If that was the case the tories would get a pass and they are no way getting a pass for **** up the country. The same applies to bidens administration with the cost of living.

Edited Sunday at 15:37 by Demitri_C

[Genie]

14 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Thats a matter of opinion if its nonsensical genie as thats just your opinion. If it was as good as you say biden will win by a landslide wont he ?

The polls suggest otherwise 

I do agree with you though about trump spouting something insane

The original point about biden getting a pass for the problems because its a  global problem sorey im not having that. If that was the case the tories would get a pass and they are no way getting a pass for **** up the country. The same applies to bidens administration with the cost of living.

Everyone in the world suffered an inflation shock after covid and into the war in Ukraine. In the US it was much less severe than the rest of the developed world. They got inflation down much quicker than Europe. The UK was worse than others in the G7.

Thats why it’s not fair to say Biden is to blame for cost of living. It’s also not fair to diminish our leaders from the mess here as they handled it worse than orhers.

Trump was impeached twice as president. Plus a load of allegations of sexual assaults. Then also at 48 other potentially criminal offences.

Quote

Donald Trump has been credibly accused of committing at least 48 criminal offenses while he was serving as President of the United States or campaigning for that office. Those offenses are listed in the table below, which includes possible offenses that were investigated by the Department of Justice while President Trump was in office as well as possible offenses that have not been the subject of any confirmed reported investigation. While he was in office, President Trump was protected by the DOJ’s policy of not indicting a sitting president, but that policy of course does not apply to a former president. The table does not include potential crimes being investigated by authorities in New York relating to the Trump Organization.  

Table in the Link

Don’t forget how he claimed the election was stolen, threatening judges, threatening vote counters and a small matter of inciting an insurrection. Remember the riots in Washington too (when he had a path cleared through the rioters so he could have a photo taken outside a closed church).

To suggest Biden’s years are as bad as Trumps is ridiculous and nothing to do with a difference of opinion.

Its like saying the last 5 years for Villa have been just as bad as Sha’s.

 

Edited Sunday at 15:50 by Genie