Popular Post snowychap Posted November 10, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) 1 hour ago, StefanAVFC said: How dare they protest against democracy failing! I don't know that they are protesting about 'democracy failing'. are they? They're protesting because they have such strong objections to the person who has won the presidency. They are showing their dismay at the result and I don't see why that's a problem. When it becomes violent and criminal then it becomes a problem but up until that time then surely they're free to continue to express their political views as is everyone else? That last bit isn't aimed at you as you've already indicated your position, that I share, about democracy being an ongoing process rather than something which merely revolves around the ballot box. Edited November 10, 2016 by snowychap 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 10, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted November 10, 2016 3 minutes ago, snowychap said: I don't know that they are protesting about 'democracy failing'. are they? They're protesting because they have such strong objections to the person who has won the presidency. They are showing their dismay at the result and I don't see why that's a problem. When it becomes violent and criminal then it becomes a problem but up until that time then surely they're free to continue to express their political views as is everyone else? I think there's definitely an element of it. But also people protesting somebody with such openly bigoted views can get into power. Whether that just boils down into 'someone they don't like' I don't know. I agree with you on all of your post btw. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 11 minutes ago, sexbelowsound said: It definitely should. That was my point at the end. It's actually a bizarre system when you think about it. A lot of things about the U.S. are just downright bizarre when you think about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted November 10, 2016 Author Share Posted November 10, 2016 3 hours ago, Awol said: Concealed carry FTW. Filth. Or the loss when it's taken from you when you're knocked to the ground and used against you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexbelowsound Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 2 minutes ago, Keyblade said: A lot of things about the U.S. are just downright bizarre when you think about it. I try not to. Makes my head hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 38 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: Hillary getting more votes and losing. It isn't difficult. It isn't Trump's fault but is a fundamental failure of democracy. I'd say the same if it went the other way. and FWIW I didn't particularly want Hillary to win. that's still not a failure of democracy though , that's just a failure of the college system that America uses If I was to argue that in England at the 2005 election the Tories received more votes in England than Blair did but Blair became PM , so it was a failure of democracy you'd be one of the first to laugh at me .... However , we could argue about the system that elected Blair , but thanks to Ed Miliband we don't have to have that argument any more * yes I'm aware it wasn't his fault Scotchland bailed on the party Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikantcpell Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) 45 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: Hillary getting more votes and losing. It isn't difficult. It isn't Trump's fault but is a fundamental failure of democracy. I'd say the same if it went the other way. and FWIW I didn't particularly want Hillary to win. So what are you doing hiding in lodz? travel over there and show them how real democracy is done. Edited November 10, 2016 by Ikantcpell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 10, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted November 10, 2016 1 minute ago, Ikantcpell said: So what are you doing hiding in lodz, travel over there and show them how real democracy is done. What's me "hiding" in another country got to do with anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 19 minutes ago, sexbelowsound said: It definitely should. That was my point at the end. It's actually a bizarre system when you think about it. I suppose defenders would say it tries to equal out representation across geography, otherwise rural voters would just get hammered every time, there'd be no focus at all in going to any state which didn't have a big city in it. The cracked article posted would probably support that sense of being forgotten. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexbelowsound Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 1 minute ago, Rodders said: I suppose defenders would say it tries to equal out representation across geography, otherwise rural voters would just get hammered every time, there'd be no focus at all in going to any state which didn't have a big city in it. The cracked article posted would probably support that sense of being forgotten. Where we looking? I'm lazy but like to read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 A few pages back. By BoF or further back by Stefan Cant link to it as on phone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 10, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted November 10, 2016 Just now, Rodders said: A few pages back. By BoF or further back by Stefan Cant link to it as on phone. Post it again. Why not! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikantcpell Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 Just now, StefanAVFC said: What's me "hiding" in another country got to do with anything? Maybe Hillary had won if you had explained to them before the election started that their voting system is wrong. Maybe they are not as clever as you are..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexbelowsound Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 2 minutes ago, Rodders said: A few pages back. By BoF or further back by Stefan Cant link to it as on phone. 1 minute ago, StefanAVFC said: Post it again. Why not! You lazy buggers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 10, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted November 10, 2016 1 minute ago, Ikantcpell said: Maybe Hillary had won if you had explained to them before the election started that their voting system is wrong. Maybe they are not as clever as you are..... ...what 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 2 minutes ago, Ikantcpell said: Maybe Hillary had won if you had explained to them before the election started that their voting system is wrong. Maybe they are not as clever as you are..... It's not about Hillary. No matter who won, the system is obviously flawed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 10, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted November 10, 2016 1 minute ago, Keyblade said: It's not about Hillary. No matter who won, the system is obviously flawed. I thought that was clear with the three times I said it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexbelowsound Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 2 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: I thought that was clear with the three times I said it. Clearly wasn't. You booked your flight to D.C yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) 4 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: I thought that was clear with the three times I said it. I'm also lazy so not going back to check but fairly sure you said democracy was failing , not the system Edited November 10, 2016 by tonyh29 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) There's some good reasons for the electoral colleges being set up. When you consider a state like California, which is culturally distinct from most of the rest of the US, and has a population that was well over a quarter of the voter turnout of the whole US, there is a worry that candidates that ignore most of the country and pander just to CA, and maybe NY, and win from those alone. If you look back in to the formation of the US, you can see why there was historically a massive concern about a couple of huge states dominating the others, which is what the electoral colleges help prevent. It's a pretty difficult problem to solve, and while on paper it looks wrong that a candidate can win the popular vote but lose the election, I'm not so sure than a pure popular vote for the president is necessarily the right option. Of course, what it's actually done is stopped california being a problem, and created the swing state battlegrounds. It's a pretty tough problem. Edited November 10, 2016 by Davkaus 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts