fruitvilla Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 8 hours ago, HanoiVillan said: The good thing when politicians do something hard-to-defend is that the attempts to defend them are usually pretty amusing: "This is probably the best thing he could do for the state right now" The wag in me wants to say the best thing he could do is stay there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted February 22, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted February 22, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, villakram said: Quickly? Solar was at ~0 during the Texas event, with wind not far behind. Even had they been winterized, the wind was unreliable due to the chaotic nature of the wind pattern during the weather event. It is quite often the case that when the weather is the worst either one of, or many times, both solar and wind are completely unreliable (see also California). A geographically distributed network might help (modulo losses, not insignificant), but how reliable will this be vs >99% uptime for our current power generation. If tomorrow all US new car sales were mandated electric, it would still take order 20yrs to approach 100%. The big driver will be the off road and delivery crowds, where electric will make a much bigger and more immediate impact if better efficiency (broadly defined, but $$) is demonstrated . Meat? What about large scale mono-crops or that animals can use land that is not usable for crop growth. The anti-meat to save the environment crowd are doing a great job at deflecting attention from large scale industry who is the primary polluter, and swallowing militant-vegan propaganda wholesale. Concrete/steel... oh, we'll start building from balsa wood or plastics (opps), ceramics (opps). Actually if there was full renewable energy every home would have a Tesla power wall (or similar, there are other brands) storing their electricity and every electric car hooked up also becomes a battery. It's the most sure fire way to building resilience into the system. Edited February 22, 2021 by sidcow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted February 22, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted February 22, 2021 (edited) How long does it take to clear snow off solar panels? Edited February 22, 2021 by sidcow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 18 minutes ago, fruitvilla said: "This is probably the best thing he could do for the state right now" The wag in me wants to say the best thing he could do is stay there. Sadly, he returned about 14 hours later Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fruitvilla Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 1 minute ago, HanoiVillan said: Sadly, he returned about 14 hours later The wag in me fails to see the humour in this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted February 22, 2021 Moderator Share Posted February 22, 2021 48 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: It’s not that we need to build out of balsa, it’s that we need to stop building out of concrete that lasts 150 years and then knocking it down 20 years later and building something else that could last 150 years, then knock that down 20 years later. Bingo. It's not that we need to stop using cars - we just need to stop using disposable cars - there's no reason why a car shouldn't last twenty years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fruitvilla Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 1 minute ago, OutByEaster? said: Bingo. It's not that we need to stop using cars - we just need to stop using disposable cars - there's no reason why a car shouldn't last twenty years. Make it out of concrete it will last 150 years God I am in a waggish mood today. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted February 22, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted February 22, 2021 31 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said: Bingo. It's not that we need to stop using cars - we just need to stop using disposable cars - there's no reason why a car shouldn't last twenty years. I was thinking just the other day if people will hold into electric cars longer. They (should) be a lot more reliable. There is so much less to go wrong on them. Really beyond brakes you are probably looking at corrosion. I presume electric motors still have bearings, maybe them wearing out or ageing wiring looms. The main problems with old cars is exhaust systems and all those moving engine parts starting to fail. Take out those who will want a new car every 2 or 3 years regardless of anything else, most people tend to get rid when they start costing money. Because of this I can 100% see built in obsolescence by manufacturers. They won't want anything lasting forever so there are bound to be some deliberately fragile components buried deep inside somewhere, or some sneaky software errors built in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted February 22, 2021 Moderator Share Posted February 22, 2021 4 minutes ago, sidcow said: I was thinking just the other day if people will hold into electric cars longer. I'm sure I remember reading that the main problem with electric cars is that the batteries don't last and that the improvements in battery technology tend to make them obsolete pretty quickly. I might be wrong. Even so, I'd have thought that the base platform and body can be built to last forever and a day and you can slide a new battery or engine in and out. The problem is in the way economics has affected our social response to cars, they're "sexy", they're the clothes we drive around in, so obviously we need one with slightly different bodywork every two years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 41 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said: Bingo. It's not that we need to stop using cars - we just need to stop using disposable cars - there's no reason why a car shouldn't last twenty years. Or make human sized Scalextrics a thing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villakram Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 1 hour ago, chrisp65 said: If we told the Texans there was free warmth under Texas, could they develop the technology to drill for it? It’s not that we need to build out of balsa, it’s that we need to stop building out of concrete that lasts 150 years and then knocking it down 20 years later and building something else that could last 150 years, then knock that down 20 years later. We really really are on a finite planet. It’s a problem that will resolve itself eventually if we choose not to address our suicidal tendencies. Oh, if only something over here were actually built out of concrete. All building are some for of wood/steel framing and designed to need replacing in ~50yrs. Roofs on houses use shingles that deteriorate on 15-20ys timescales, I could go on and on. Everything and her mother for a profit. Growth for growths sake, naughty boy. You know that we're not supposed to talk about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 51 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said: Bingo. It's not that we need to stop using cars - we just need to stop using disposable cars - there's no reason why a car shouldn't last twenty years. Cars are white goods now. Built to a price, leased for 3 years, then disposed of and stored on airfields and raceways. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-northamptonshire-56104281 Quote Aerial pictures show how thousands of used vehicles are being stored at a former motorsport venue. Rockingham Motor Speedway Circuit, near Corby in Northamptonshire, is used to store vehicles, many of which are former hire and ex-lease vehicles. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 As soon as I posted that I thought "I bet that's been done" and lo and behold ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
limpid Posted February 22, 2021 Administrator Share Posted February 22, 2021 4 minutes ago, Brumerican said: Or make human sized Scalextrics a thing. 100 years ago we called those "trams". 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villakram Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 1 hour ago, sidcow said: Actually if there was full renewable energy every home would have a Tesla power wall (or similar, there are other brands) storing their electricity and every electric car hooked up also becomes a battery. It's the most sure fire way to building resilience into the system. and where do the resources for all of this come from? How often do these things have to be replaced? What happens then, because you understand that recycling has a large fraction of bs and most stuff is landfilled to some degree in some other godforsaken place. Complex things are basically impossible to re-cycle. Let's build a mine out the back of your place for starters and take it from there. There is no simple solution here. Profit is how the world works and everything is constrained so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 1 minute ago, villakram said: Oh, if only something over here were actually built out of concrete. All building are some for of wood/steel framing and designed to need replacing in ~50yrs. Roofs on houses use shingles that deteriorate on 15-20ys timescales, I could go on and on. Everything and her mother for a profit. Growth for growths sake, naughty boy. You know that we're not supposed to talk about that. It has struck me as odd for some time, people need homes, and they are built disposably (often with the excuse or being rebuildable after natural events). Then the shops and workspaces, an ever changing environment and subject to fashion and unforeseen change, they get concrete malls and high rise offices. It feels a little counterintuitive. But yeah, it does all encourage the buying of more stuff, even if its just cheap crap to replace other cheap crap. Quality is not the measure, buying is the measure. It’s what the whole system is based on and what our worth is measured by. Buying power and the rate of churn of shit. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 Just now, limpid said: 100 years ago we called those "trams". Then we started going backwards for some reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 Just now, chrisp65 said: It has struck me as odd for some time, people need homes, and they are built disposably (often with the excuse or being rebuildable after natural events). Then the shops and workspaces, an ever changing environment and subject to fashion and unforeseen change, they get concrete malls and high rise offices. It feels a little counterintuitive. But yeah, it does all encourage the buying of more stuff, even if its just cheap crap to replace other cheap crap. Quality is not the measure, buying is the measure. It’s what the whole system is based on and what our worth is measured by. Buying power and the rate of churn of shit. I always enjoyed the designing aspect but the act of persuading people to buy new kitchens who already had perfectly decent kitchens in place left me cold. As you say it's the constant (yet needless) churn that keeps us busy and distracted. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
limpid Posted February 22, 2021 Administrator Share Posted February 22, 2021 1 minute ago, Brumerican said: Then we started going backwards for some reason. Quite. At the start of the 20th century about 40% of cars were electric. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 9 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: It has struck me as odd for some time, people need homes, and they are built disposably (often with the excuse or being rebuildable after natural events). Then the shops and workspaces, an ever changing environment and subject to fashion and unforeseen change, they get concrete malls and high rise offices. It feels a little counterintuitive. But yeah, it does all encourage the buying of more stuff, even if its just cheap crap to replace other cheap crap. Quality is not the measure, buying is the measure. It’s what the whole system is based on and what our worth is measured by. Buying power and the rate of churn of shit. Japan takes this to the extreme with their culture of literal disposable homes. When you buy a house there the common custom is to knock down whatever was built there and build your new house from scratch. Quote It turns out that half of all homes in Japan are demolished within 38 years — compared to 100 years in the U.S. There is virtually no market for pre-owned homes in Japan, and 60 percent of all homes were built after 1980. In Yoshida’s estimation, while land continues to hold value, physical homes become worthless within 30 years. Other studies have shown this to happen in as little as 15 years. https://freakonomics.com/podcast/why-are-japanese-homes-disposable-a-new-freakonomics-radio-podcast-3/ 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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