Zatman Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 23 minutes ago, HongKongVillan said: Voted but off topic, who at the BBC was in the right frame of mind to include Stevie G alongside with the likes of Poch and Tuchel? Unless he is on a wind up In fairness Stevie Me is more likely to be a realistic name for the job than Tuchel or Poch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Steve Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 29 minutes ago, Zatman said: In fairness Stevie Me is more likely to be a realistic name for the job than Tuchel or Poch Totally. Stevie would be great at getting them organised… For the Championship Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwi1890 Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 1 hour ago, Zatman said: Could say the same when Unai joined us. Rayo are in a false position compared to other La Liga rivals and sadly don't have the means to fight up the table long term At Leeds he will probably have 10 times the budget he has now maybe even more But he’d be sacked within the year, he probably has a better chance of landing a bigger La liga job staying at Rayo. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Steve Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 6 minutes ago, gwi1890 said: But he’d be sacked within the year, he probably has a better chance of landing a bigger La liga job staying at Rayo. Rayo have rich owners (very right wing though) and have made some good signings like RdT. They retain a great record against the likes of Barca. If they can get Europe this year it would be a massive achievement. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thug Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 1 hour ago, The_Steve said: Totally. Stevie would be great at getting them organised… For the Championship I know we don’t like leeds… But wishing Stevie G on them is taking things a bit far, no? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwi1890 Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 11 minutes ago, The_Steve said: Rayo have rich owners (very right wing though) and have made some good signings like RdT. They retain a great record against the likes of Barca. If they can get Europe this year it would be a massive achievement. Yes RDT was something of a coup I suppose, pity he’s been injured for the majority of the season, Camello looks good too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest av1 Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 I think the Leeds fan’s expectations might be a little high BBC We need an established manager who can manage personalities and attract new players in the summer...if we stay up! Pochettino and Bielsa is the dream team! Re: next Leeds manager. NOT an unknown. We've been there, done that this past 20 years, never works. Go all in and get Tuchel or Poch; modern thinkers, modern tactics, respected by the players. Another learner like Marsch and we're down. Next Leeds Manager should be Marcelo Gallardo. After 8 successful years at River Plate he won't be fazed by the PL or a relegation scrap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Steve Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 33 minutes ago, gwi1890 said: But he’d be sacked within the year, he probably has a better chance of landing a bigger La liga job staying at Rayo. Bit of an ageing squad tbh. But there’s some exciting young talent like Camello, plus players in their peak years like Isi. Certainly punching above their weight but they can certainly build up I feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomav84 Posted February 7, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted February 7, 2023 5 minutes ago, av1 said: I think the Leeds fan’s expectations might be a little high BBC to be fair, most of us were calling for tuchel or poch too and we didn't get either...though apparently it was the most tempting offer poch has had and he genuinely considered it, he still didn't join us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Zatman Posted February 7, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted February 7, 2023 7 minutes ago, tomav84 said: to be fair, most of us were calling for tuchel or poch too and we didn't get either...though apparently it was the most tempting offer poch has had and he genuinely considered it, he still didn't join us We got a better manager than Poch 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 39 minutes ago, av1 said: I think the Leeds fan’s expectations might be a little high Gallardo isn't beyond the realms of possibility. He would be paid ten times what he's earning now if he comes to the premier league. I suspect he will hold out for a job in Spain though. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted February 7, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted February 7, 2023 Forget a manager and just get Pablo hernandez back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Zen Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 6 hours ago, The_Steve said: Rayo have rich owners (very right wing though) and have made some good signings like RdT. They retain a great record against the likes of Barca. If they can get Europe this year it would be a massive achievement. I just want to emphasise how this is true for the owner(s) but not for the club, as I’m sure you know, btw. The club and its fans especially are very much staunchly left wing. Now, back to Leeds. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterwithethewinner Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 I’d really love it to be Stevie G, if not then anyone to get them relegated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marka Ragnos Posted February 7, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted February 7, 2023 (edited) On 06/02/2023 at 12:49, DJBOB said: Marsch just doesn't have the experience to move onto anything besides a lackluster Plan A. It was enough to save them last season and catch a few teams off guard to start the season, but it became very obvious what they were trying to do each game and similar to other inexperienced managers, had no tactical nuance to alter the strategy game by game and then the killer - no idea what to do in game in response. Like many an inexperienced and stubborn English managers (Deano, Gerrard, Lampard) - it's not enough to have your 'style' and then just say, "Fight and run the channels! Win your duels!" Only a shame that he didn't reach the last phase of dogmatic managers who eventually become Steve Bruce - play super defensive and just try to win some set pieces and get lucky. Not sure about the first part of what you say here, but I like the second bit. I think the notion that Marsch has no "tactical nuance" is just flat wrong. I think it's more accurate to say he wasn't able to recreate what he did in Austria with "gegenpressing" etc. He was out of his depth partly, I think, because he bought too much into the wrong kind of nuances, if that makes sense? Or maybe I'm full of shit lol. Very well said, the part I bolded. A lot has been made about Marsch's "American" vibe, but honestly, that's all bollocks. Impotent, "stubborn" coaching can and does happen all over the place. I guess I'm just saying that the wrong kind of tactical nuance can be just as bad as having no nuance. I think his ideological "system" thing is what undoes him because he believes too much in his own BS. That BS works really well in the right conditions with the right players, but the PL has a way of unraveling systems, doesn't it? What I love about English football. It's very cutting edge -- even chops up and pisses all over the systems made to dominate it. Quote Marsch is part of a growing list of managers who speak less about formations and more about player roles within a certain style of play. This allows Salzburg to be more flexible in adjusting their system, personnel and player roles depending on the opposition. Although Marsch has used what would be described as a 4-3-1-2 or 4-4-2 Diamond structure in the past, the 4-2-2-2 seems to make the most sense for the style of play and the pressing mentality he encourages. A 4-2-3-1 or 4-3-2-1 can also be options for Salzburg, but these may be reserved more for Champions League or Europa League matches in which they are playing against higher quality opposition. When in the Austrian Bundesliga, they typically switch between the 4-2-2-2 and 4-3-1-2, which can change on a game by game basis. In fact Marsch’s team are so flexible within these two systems that they might use one as their shape with the ball and the other as their shape without the ball. These systems are also the two that the American coach tends to use as the basis for his presentations at conferences, which he has been very open to delivering to coaches around the world. While other managers might shy away from sharing their tactics with the world, Jessie Marsch fully embraces all of his ideologies and frequently shares his ideas and stories with whoever is willing to listen. Edited February 7, 2023 by Marka Ragnos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJBOB Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 41 minutes ago, Marka Ragnos said: Not sure about the first part of what you say here, but I like the second bit. I think the notion that Marsch has no "tactical nuance" is just flat wrong. I think it's more accurate to say he wasn't able to recreate what he did in Austria with "gegenpressing" etc. He was out of his depth partly, I think, because he bought too much into the wrong kind of nuances, if that makes sense? Or maybe I'm full of shit lol. Very well said, the part I bolded. A lot has been made about Marsch's "American" vibe, but honestly, that's all bollocks. Impotent, "stubborn" coaching can and does happen all over the place. I guess I'm just saying that the wrong kind of tactical nuance can be just as bad as having no nuance. I think his ideological "system" thing is what undoes him because he believes too much in his own BS. That BS works really well in the right conditions with the right players, but the PL has a way of unraveling systems, doesn't it? What I love about English football. It's very cutting edge -- even chops up and pisses all over the systems made to dominate it. I understand what you're saying and we're probably saying the same thing. When I say tactical "nuance" it is more in how top managers like Unai, Pep, Arteta, Klopp, etc. target certain individual opposing players, certain parts of the field and then crucially - adjust in-game with a myriad of smaller instructions/formation changes/different passing rhythms. Similar to how Gerrard had his "system", Marsch had his "system" as well. He loved his system, and deployed it no matter the opponent, the game situation, and even his personnel (Ayling still starts!). Same with Stevie in that he had that god awful narrow 4321 and his diamond formation and mostly stuck with that formation and then the same in-game tactics the whole game save for maybe saying "be more defensive" if they had the lead. Contrast that with Unai and the other top prem managers who regularly deploy certain styles of play per opponent and even in-game will change the shape and smaller tactics depending on the game state. Point being that you're right in that stubborn coaches are not relegated to just being American. Gerrard is actually a really good analog because of that god awful "formation" that all Villa fans came to hate and that he stuck to it all the way to the end even though the end had us looking like the dregs of Steve Bruce and Alex McLeish combined. Marsch - much like Berhalter had a Plan A and just kept pushing hoping that Plan A would work. He just didn't get to the Plan B part where they become more defensive and say things like "we have to be solid at the back and take our chances when they come." Now I heard Leeds is seeking a more defensive-minded coach who can shepherd them away from relegation for a more long term plan. See sawing back and forth between extremes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Steve Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 4 hours ago, El Zen said: I just want to emphasise how this is true for the owner(s) but not for the club, as I’m sure you know, btw. The club and its fans especially are very much staunchly left wing. Now, back to Leeds. Rayo are my Spanish team. Proud of their working class, left-wing roots. Just very sad the ownership gives seats the racist VOX Party. But you're right, I wouldn't want to give the impression the club or fans reflect these people. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StewieGriffin Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 Corberan signing a new contract at West Brom, so it wont be him 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwivillan Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 40 minutes ago, The_Steve said: Rayo are my Spanish team. Proud of their working class, left-wing roots. Just very sad the ownership gives seats the racist VOX Party. But you're right, I wouldn't want to give the impression the club or fans reflect these people. First I knew about them was Rumasa owner with connections to Opus Dei owning Rayo in early 90s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBlack Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 On 30/07/2022 at 04:14, Marka Ragnos said: The article is good, but the ranking seems too low. Guardian writers pegging Leeds at finishing at 18th doesn't surprise me, but I think Leeds are going to do much better than last year. Marsch's system is going to be fun to watch in the PL. Marsch will grow on the fans with some wins. Just came back to this topic for the first time since July... this post did not age well 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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