All-Purpose Religion Thread

[Rugeley Villa]

1 minute ago, bickster said:

Thought you were more of a Sabbath man than a Funkadelic man?  

On a Sunday I’m an anything type of man

[mjmooney]

2 hours ago, Rugeley Villa said:

Prey with me

I see what you did there. 

I think. 

[Rugeley Villa]

7 hours ago, mjmooney said:

I see what you did there. 

I think. 

Nah Mike just me being thick as mince 

[Xann]

[mjmooney]

[fruitvilla]

On 02/12/2023 at 11:14, blandy said:

I think it's called the placebo effect. But whatever, good for them. It's fine.

They had a big study on the efficacy of prayer in the States, regarding people recovering from a particular heart op.  They divided the patients into three groups:
1) People who were not prayed for
2) People who were prayed for, but were not told.
3) People who were prayed for and were told they were being prayed for.

The first two groups had similar outcomes, but the third group had statistically significantly worse outcomes. More of a Nocebo effect in this case.

[fruitvilla]

A coincidence, came across this today ... link

Conclusion

The study findings indicate that intercessory prayer had no significant effect on the primary outcome of mortality or the secondary outcomes, including the length of hospitalization, ICU stay, and the need for and duration of mechanical ventilation.

Well, there's a surprise.

[fruitvilla]

Not to sully the political threads ... I would argue religion has no place in our politics and resulting policies/laws, in our judicial system and its implementation, and perhaps in our social services and the provision. 

Bearing in mind, that a likely small proportion of various faiths would like their societies to be less secular, or even theocratic, it would be wise, I think, to limit or even eliminate the creep of faith into secular institutions.

Edited June 29 by fruitvilla

[Rugeley Villa]

@bickster and the first Jews arrived 700 years before Muslims arrived in England. Judaism does run much deeper in England but it’s irrelevant as I have the same view on both courts . 

Edited June 29 by Rugeley Villa

[fruitvilla]

Elsewhere it has been suggested, it is up to people whether they participate in Sharia 'councils'. While I suspect this is true up to a point, I suspect there will be familial pressure to do so and coming out as an apostate (if asked for a reason) may have some undesirable consequences.

[bickster]

46 minutes ago, fruitvilla said:

Elsewhere it has been suggested, it is up to people whether they participate in Sharia 'councils'. While I suspect this is true up to a point, I suspect there will be familial pressure to do so and coming out as an apostate (if asked for a reason) may have some undesirable consequences.

Same applies to most religions who sort stuff out within their culture.There’s loads of people will tell you that family pressures made them get married in church. In Liverpool it’s really hard to send your kids to a decent school without having to play at being religious and getting letters from your vicar or priest. What point are you making?
If it’s religions a load of bollocks, I'm right up there. But here’s the thing, you either remove religion's insidious interference in everyone's lives or you let people get on with their own life as they chose to live it for whatever reason and accept the good and bad or you fix it for everyone.

Sharia councils may be bad (no clue to be honest) but so may Jewish one’s be, the Catholic Church is definitely bad (family experience on the missus' side). The problem is, if you try to do something about Sharia courts, you have to do the same for all the other religions and their ways of sorting things out, otherwise there’s a danger that you, me, the state, whoever are doing it because… Muslims

And whenever you see people complaining about “Sharia Courts” there’s a 99% chance it’s someone white, very probably racist and they'll never mention ANY of the other religions that do similar things. That there is Islamophobia.

 

[fruitvilla]

1 minute ago, bickster said:

Same applies to most religions who sort stuff out within their culture. <snip>

See my post from yesterday

And we can add education to social services.

[bickster]

8 minutes ago, fruitvilla said:

See my post from yesterday

And we can add education to social services.

Yep, you won’t find me arguing with a completely secular approach. Not remotely easy to implement though

[Rds1983]

[Rugeley Villa]

@bobzy I think all kinds of people believe in a god/creator . Unfair to say it’s a right wing thing. 

[bobzy]

1 minute ago, Rugeley Villa said:

@bobzy I think all kinds of people believe in a god/creator . Unfair to say it’s a right wing thing. 

Good thread move

I don’t think it’s solely a right-wing thing, but it seems to be the majority? Certainly looking at American politics. Also anecdotally, although I don’t know that many people who believe in (a) God, the ones who do are on the right-hand side of things with the exception of the MIL who is a leftie Catholic.

Also realised as I’ve typed this out that I’m referring to “white” beliefs and left/right rather than, say, Asian communities which are much more likely to be heavily religious and mixed politics.

[Rugeley Villa]

2 minutes ago, bobzy said:

Good thread move

I don’t think it’s solely a right-wing thing, but it seems to be the majority? Certainly looking at American politics. Also anecdotally, although I don’t know that many people who believe in (a) God, the ones who do are on the right-hand side of things with the exception of the MIL who is a leftie Catholic.

Also realised as I’ve typed this out that I’m referring to “white” beliefs and left/right rather than, say, Asian communities which are much more likely to be heavily religious and mixed politics.

I could see why you think that of right wing movements in the US but I think in the UK god is usually left out of it.  The teachings of Jesus go against right wing evangelicals. 

[Davkaus]

I wonder if a significant part of that is that in modern Britain, the young are less and less religious, and more likely to be lefties, and so the correlations are between age and politics, and age and religion, rather than a direct link between politics and religion.

[bobzy]

Just now, Rugeley Villa said:

I could see why you think that of right wing movements in the US but I think in the UK god is usually left out of it.  The teachings of Jesus go against right wing evangelicals. 

Left out of politics, yes, but what I mean is the link between those on the right being… maybe “more likely” to have a faith?

Maybe not though. 

[Rugeley Villa]

3 minutes ago, bobzy said:

Left out of politics, yes, but what I mean is the link between those on the right being… maybe “more likely” to have a faith?

Maybe not though. 

It comes across that way but I do have to wonder if some of these right wingers actually believe in god. Even in the states there’s some pretty sick people doing gods work and making a lot of money which tells you a lot .