Stevo985 Posted October 17, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted October 17, 2015 Oh I completely agree with all of that.I just think that stats in football are much more effected by other variables. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Zen Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Oh I completely agree with all of that.I just think that stats in football are much more effected by other variables.And you're right, of course. I'm sure someone far smarter than I (or an American, they somehow seem to have a stats gene over there) will find a way, though :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 The Moneyball approach only works if your scouting system is up to snuff, in either sport. And even then, in baseball, it's an approach typically only really used by ball clubs with small payrolls as a means to stay competitive, and maybe hit stride at the right time and win the title. The major difference being is if it fails in football, you're relegated. So in football, playing Moneyball, is a very dangerous roll of the dice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 I dont think it could work in football, stats are a lot different than say baseball which is more stat oriented. Except pass completion, tackles made and shots on target. Not much could go on to sign a playerCant imagine signing a player on corners won(probably not even a stat for it) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 I agree, the notion that we spotted and signed Amavi because he had a sky high interception stat just doesn't seem to work for me, football is a far more multi faceted sport than baseballMy understanding of money ball (admittedly from the film) was that they stopped picking players who were average at everything and used stats to build a team of players that each had one very good skill, football simply doesn't work like that, you can't carry players in the same way a sport like baseball can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 I tried it in football manager but didnt work by signing players with good set pieces and interceptions but it didnt work. was sacked after 10 defeats in a row Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 I tried it in football manager but didnt work by signing players with good set pieces and interceptions but it didnt work. was sacked after 10 defeats in a row Yeah, but did your assistant manager laugh and hug the opposition's manager while you were losing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 I tried it in football manager but didnt work by signing players with good set pieces and interceptions but it didnt work. was sacked after 10 defeats in a row Yeah, but did your assistant manager laugh and hug the opposition's manager while you were losing? wouldnt get any of that from Roy Keane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted October 18, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted October 18, 2015 The problem with stats in football is they're so dependant on the rest of the team. A baseball player's home run average will stay pretty constant regardless of what team he plays for. He's still facing the same pitchers over a season, more or less. In football, a player might have an amazing goal tally or assist tally or whatever, but it's because he's playing for a team that he's perfectly suited to. Put that guy in a different team and if the team doesn't play the same way then his stats are totally different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 I tried it in football manager but didnt work by signing players with good set pieces and interceptions but it didnt work. was sacked after 10 defeats in a row Rory Delap built a career out of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Rev Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 Passes in football are so much more difficult to place a value on too, for example central defenders in good teams will often have a high passing accuracy because they are rarely under pressure and will lay simple balls off to their fellow central defender, nearest full back or a defensive midfielder and those passes will almost always be completed. Key passes are hard to define too, does a 20 yard pass to a winger which cuts two defenders out of the game have the same value as a 20 yard pass to a winger which doesn't? I think there is something in a more analytical value of the game but over the last three or four years it's almost as if a bunch of chief executives saw 'Moneyball' and decided it was the answer to everything, it's not, we don't have the means to measure everything that is important in a football match yet and we may never have because the game can often be decided by creativity and improvisation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troon_villan Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 I tried it in football manager but didnt work by signing players with good set pieces and interceptions but it didnt work. was sacked after 10 defeats in a row [emoji14]Rory Delap built a career out of this. Who? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted October 18, 2015 Author VT Supporter Share Posted October 18, 2015 I tried it in football manager but didnt work by signing players with good set pieces and interceptions but it didnt work. was sacked after 10 defeats in a row [emoji14]Rory Delap built a career out of this. Who?Singer for Radiohead. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 Is it bad form to go around the house of my sons school mate (aged 10 ) who greeted me last week with "I'm glad the English are out of the rugby because we hate the English" and shout a big **** you to him and laugh now that the Jocks have been knocked out by a poor call in the dying moments Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choffer Posted October 19, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted October 19, 2015 I keep seeing the term "moneyball" in relation to football but have no idea what it means It's a very good concept. But the problem in football is that you can't base the game purely on statistics, so use of the concept has had very limited success. FC Midtjylland says hi! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted October 19, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted October 19, 2015 I keep seeing the term "moneyball" in relation to football but have no idea what it means It's a very good concept. But the problem in football is that you can't base the game purely on statistics, so use of the concept has had very limited success. FC Midtjylland says hi! Hence the word "limited" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
limpid Posted October 26, 2015 Administrator Share Posted October 26, 2015 Is "Collymore's match day column" like the one in Trafalgar Square? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 I have a match day column if u know wot i mean 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunRickyRun Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 I've always viewed 'Moneyball' with a fair bit of skepticism. The A's success around that period was mostly down to three of their best pitchers in franchise history (Mulder, Hudson & Zito) playing and maturing together at the same time in a fairly weak division. The footballing equivalent would be Manchester United's golden generation of the 90s. It was a very successful team but certainly not a defining blueprint for repeated success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troon_villan Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 No no no keep that shit in the other forum or even better, website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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