Next leader of the Labour Party should be.....

[Gringo]

...Worth pointing out Ed is from a millionaire property family and followed the traditional Labour route of: Oxford: LSE: Party researcher: working for Brown. Swap Brown for Thatcher and you've got Cameron Mk2, but expect to see Ed M spun as some kind of working class hero in the near future

It is indeed very sad that there is no opportunity for people outside the wealthy class to make an impression in politics. The closest anyone has got is prescott - people may mention major, but he was an ineffectual puppet managed from behind.

The Labour party are broke and the only thing keeping them afloat is union cash. Just like with any other walk of life, if you want to know who is pulling the strings you follow the money*. In this case it leads back to Derek Simpson, Paul Kenny and Dave Prentis - radical Trots' to a man.

Well left of blair, but yes, probably traditional labour supporters.

With regards to union donations - every single member has to opt in to political contributions. So those donations are honest, and belong to individuals. Whereas a major corporation can (and do) make donations to the blue tory party without any similar regard to the company owners/shareholders - a much less democratic process I'm sure you would agree.

If I had been tony bliar it would have been one of the first discrepancies I would have closed, but hey, tony was a tory and it wouldn't have suited (rupert) his friends.

[Mantis]

tony was a tory

You're joking, right?

Also, you lefties do love a class war don't you?

[CarewsEyebrowDesigner]

Class isn't a problem if you earnt your status through hard work rather than being born into it.

[Gringo]

tony was a tory

You're joking, right?

Why else would rupert have supported him? blair took the party to the right, dave has tried to take his party towards the centre.

[Mantis]

Class isn't a problem if you earnt your status through hard work rather than being born into it.

I agree to an extent, but I don't think it's right how people from the upper class are automatically demonised for coming from that kind of background.

[Gringo]

Class isn't a problem if you earnt your status through hard work rather than being born into it.

Name the members of the political elite that have earned their status through hard work outside of the political sphere. These people join the political groups at university and only leave when they are found out and join boards of ftse 100 companies.

[Awol]

...Worth pointing out Ed is from a millionaire property family and followed the traditional Labour route of: Oxford: LSE: Party researcher: working for Brown. Swap Brown for Thatcher and you've got Cameron Mk2, but expect to see Ed M spun as some kind of working class hero in the near future

It is indeed very sad that there is no opportunity for people outside the wealthy class to make an impression in politics. The closest anyone has got is prescott - people may mention major, but he was an ineffectual puppet managed from behind.

I seem to recall a grocers' daughter doing quite well but she didn't really fit the model :winkold:

[Gringo]

Mervyn King recently spoke how the current crisis was none of the unions fault, but they make a good kicking bag.

The union leaders will be ok though:

.....edited....

We are all equal, but some are more equal than others.

But nothing compared to the salaries and pensions of the bank owners who did help create the crisis.

There's no point kicking the unions when the financial services and the govt created the problem.

[Gringo]

...Worth pointing out Ed is from a millionaire property family and followed the traditional Labour route of: Oxford: LSE: Party researcher: working for Brown. Swap Brown for Thatcher and you've got Cameron Mk2, but expect to see Ed M spun as some kind of working class hero in the near future

It is indeed very sad that there is no opportunity for people outside the wealthy class to make an impression in politics. The closest anyone has got is prescott - people may mention major, but he was an ineffectual puppet managed from behind.

I seem to recall a grocers' daughter doing quite well but she didn't really fit the model :winkold:

Married into a rather rich family. Wealth helped her a lot.

[Mantis]

Who cares how much the bankers earn?

[Gringo]

Who cares how much the bankers earn?

Who cares what the union leaders earn?

[tonyh29]

Whereas a major corporation can (and do) make donations to the blue tory party

whereas individuals made donations to the labour party in exchange for peerages ... but that's another thread :-)

but corporations also made donations to the labour party tbf .. i.e BAE systems ,Tesco

not to mention that Labour have taken over £10 million from eight ‘non-dom’ donors since 2001 .. oops don't recall that one coming up very often when Ashcroft gets mentioned

[Mantis]

Who cares how much the bankers earn?

Who cares what the union leaders earn?

The difference there is that these fat cats who are at the top of the unions pretend to be helping hard working people and protecting their jobs yet at the same time they're getting huge paychecks.

[Gringo]

Whereas a major corporation can (and do) make donations to the blue tory party

but corporations also made donations to the labour party tbf .. i.e BAE systems ,Tesco

Didn't they make donations to both sides?

whereas individuals made donations to the labour party in exchange for peerages ... but that's another thread :-)

The case for the defence was this always happens, it happened under the tories and under labour, but it was only because of the courage of gordo (lol) it came to light.

[Awol]

Gringo,

I think the real issue is that if Ed M takes Labour back to its roots on the Left then as others have stated, it will screw any chance they have of regaining power in the near future. The desire for scoialism in the real Labour sense just doesn't exist in England outside of a few core areas and is electoral suicide.

Whether it is in fact entirely accurate or not, the Coalition will paint him as a creature of the Unions and given the showdown that is in the post that will not play well with the floating middle class voters Labour need to win back in order to achieve victory. I also wouldn't guarantee that the PLP will be entirely happy with his win and they are the masters of back stabbing, having recently had 13 years practical experience.

Tough times ahead for the red flag brigade imo.

[Gringo]

Who cares how much the bankers earn?

Who cares what the union leaders earn?

The difference there is that these fat cats who are at the top of the unions pretend to be helping hard working people and protecting their jobs yet at the same time they're getting huge paychecks.

But when you consider that the annual wage for the highest paid union leader is less than one days wage for the highest paid bank boss it puts a bit of perspective upon the situation.

[Mantis]

Who cares how much the bankers earn?

Who cares what the union leaders earn?

The difference there is that these fat cats who are at the top of the unions pretend to be helping hard working people and protecting their jobs yet at the same time they're getting huge paychecks.

But when you consider that the annual wage for the highest paid union leader is less than one days wage for the highest paid bank boss it puts a bit of perspective upon the situation.

What's your point? Banks are businesses. They're quite entitled to pay their bosses that much.

[CarewsEyebrowDesigner]

Entitled, yes. Right? No.

Wage caps please.

[Mantis]

Entitled, yes. Right? No.

Wage caps please.

Why should bosses of PRIVATE businesses have wage caps imposed on them?

I can see the case for wage caps on bosses of the nationalised banks but that's it.

[Gringo]

Gringo,

I think the real issue is that if Ed M takes Labour back to its roots on the Left then as others have stated, it will screw any chance they have of regaining power in the near future. The desire for scoialism in the real Labour sense just doesn't exist in England outside of a few core areas and is electoral suicide.

Yep, a lot of that is true. The tories have murdoch on side and the decline of unions in the times that people most need them when the economy has moved to flexible working practices (ie temps that we hire for 23 months and then replace) means that labour have lost their base

And they lost a lot to lib dems over the wars, and a lot to the BNP due to the economic issues. That can be recovered.

Whether it is in fact entirely accurate or not, the Coalition will paint him as a creature of the Unions and given the showdown that is in the post that will not play well with the floating middle class voters Labour need to win back in order to achieve victory. I also wouldn't guarantee that the PLP will be entirely happy with his win and they are the masters of back stabbing, having recently had 13 years practical experience.

They will. Murdoch will attack, and PMQs are going to be very interesting to see how he stands up. But maybe labour have skipped the hague and IDS episodes and jumped straight to the howard failure.

Tough times ahead for the red flag brigade imo.

That sounds like fox news promoting the palin tea party adventure.

.