Bolitics The New Condem Government

[tonyh29]

Am I missing something here? 

 

The Border Agency (part of whose job is to find and remove illegal immigrants) are stopping people who they believe may be illegal immigrants (its not a huge surprise that they may have been "foreign looking") and asking them a few questions?  As a result of the action they detained three people (none of whom I assume where black based on the report)  It is not an enormous surprise even in an area with a high % of non white residents that in a search for illegal immigrants the BA stopped people that looked non white is it? I am therefore completely convinced that a disproportionate number of non whites were stopped since I would imagine that a disproportionate number of illegal immigrants also happen to be non white. 

 

I would imagine that if I moved to say Lagos illegally, I would try and base myself in the area with the highest % of white people so as not to stick out like the bollocks on a bulldog.  Looking for illegals in leafy Surrey villages is likely to be somewhat of a fruitless venture. 

 

 

There is quite literally nothing to see here beyond the rather comforting story of "Border Agency does its job" 

 

 

well that was how I saw it as well  .....

 

We have illegals here in leafy Surrey though ..or Labour voters as we call them

[tonyh29]

more bad news for the Unite funded leader

 

Labour's poll lead has been slashed to three points despite Britons declaring a dislike for coalition government, a new survey has revealed.

Ed Miliband's party is on 37%, ahead of the Tories on 34%, the Lib Dems on 10% and the UK Independent Party (Ukip) on 12%, according to a ComRes poll.

The current standings, based on a survey for the Independent conducted between 25-27 July, would still give Mr Miliband a majority of 32 at the next election.

But Labour's lead has halved in a month, which will deepen concerns in Labour ranks about a revival in Tory fortunes as signs grow of economic recovery.

[Eames]

The challenge for the Tories is clear in 2015. They have to either do a deal with or totally discredit UKIP. Any split in the vote puts Labour into power unless the Lib Dem's agree en mass to another coalition which I can't see happening.

 

If the economy continues to grow and people perceive that they are better off as a result I think it will be a really close one because Labour's message of savage cuts and unfairness will slowly get diluted.

[tonyh29]

I don't think the Lib Dems will have any power in 2015 to blackmail the main 2 with this time around ....

[Eames]

I don't think the Lib Dems will have any power in 2015 to blackmail the main 2 with this time around ....

 I think your right..... it will be that twunt in the Barbour jacket from UKIP

[drat01]

 

more bad news for the Unite funded leader

 

 

Labour's poll lead has been slashed to three points despite Britons declaring a dislike for coalition government, a new survey has revealed.

Ed Miliband's party is on 37%, ahead of the Tories on 34%, the Lib Dems on 10% and the UK Independent Party (Ukip) on 12%, according to a ComRes poll.

The current standings, based on a survey for the Independent conducted between 25-27 July, would still give Mr Miliband a majority of 32 at the next election.

But Labour's lead has halved in a month, which will deepen concerns in Labour ranks about a revival in Tory fortunes as signs grow of economic recovery.

 

That is like saying it's looking bad Man Utd because your lead at the top of the premiership is only a few points now. A desperate headline from some source - where was that quote from?

 

Still leading and considering the way that the Tory party is funded by it's somewhat secretive ways I find is very funny how you Tony try and use any sort of link to Unite as a bad thing, especially as you were claiming the other day that they would no longer support Milliband and the Labour party.  Wasn't it you also that said before about opinion polls having little to no value?

[drat01]

The challenge for the Tories is clear in 2015. They have to either do a deal with or totally discredit UKIP. Any split in the vote puts Labour into power unless the Lib Dem's agree en mass to another coalition which I can't see happening.

 

If the economy continues to grow and people perceive that they are better off as a result I think it will be a really close one because Labour's message of savage cuts and unfairness will slowly get diluted.

 

Interesting viewpoint, basically admitting that the Tory party needs it's "allies" in UKIP? We all know that many in the Tory ranks actually relate to UKIP - as we have seen they have been invited to speak at the next conference. We also see things like the VT "right wing" element who are very vocal and quick to jump and defend the Tory gvmt (and attack Labour at any chance - even when not even relevant) but have said that they have voted UKIP in the past. Cameron has been (for one of the few times in his life) correctly summing up UKIP as "fruit-cakes, nutters and closet racists", so it's interesting now how much the Tory party will have to rely on them for any sort of success in the future.

 

The next election will be a dirty nasty one, and you can already see evidence of that type of political bun fight occurring. I suspect that quite a few skeleton's in cupboards are looking forward to their re-emergence into the real world. The Lib Dems have been killed off by Cuckold Clegg which sort of leaves the middle ground as up for grabs and key - as it always has been. Extreme views may not be the best way to try and win that vote

[Risso]

 

The challenge for the Tories is clear in 2015. They have to either do a deal with or totally discredit UKIP. Any split in the vote puts Labour into power unless the Lib Dem's agree en mass to another coalition which I can't see happening.

 

If the economy continues to grow and people perceive that they are better off as a result I think it will be a really close one because Labour's message of savage cuts and unfairness will slowly get diluted.

 

Interesting viewpoint, basically admitting that the Tory party needs it's "allies" in UKIP? We all know that many in the Tory ranks actually relate to UKIP - as we have seen they have been invited to speak at the next conference. We also see things like the VT "right wing" element who are very vocal and quick to jump and defend the Tory gvmt (and attack Labour at any chance - even when not even relevant) but have said that they have voted UKIP in the past. Cameron has been (for one of the few times in his life) correctly summing up UKIP as "fruit-cakes, nutters and closet racists", so it's interesting now how much the Tory party will have to rely on them for any sort of success in the future.

 

The next election will be a dirty nasty one, and you can already see evidence of that type of political bun fight occurring. I suspect that quite a few skeleton's in cupboards are looking forward to their re-emergence into the real world. The Lib Dems have been killed off by Cuckold Clegg which sort of leaves the middle ground as up for grabs and key - as it always has been. Extreme views may not be the best way to try and win that vote

 

 

Pretty much what I said a page or two back Ian.  Since 1979, the two main parties have averaged around 35% of the vote each, and they've both lost share to the Liberals.  I think both parties probably have a stable 30% of the vote who are dyed-in-the-wool supporters, so the floating voters, disgruntled Liberal supporters and UKIP are going to be key, in a few key marginal seats.  All most undemocratic really.

[Jon]

Red Ed really does need to pull his finger out of his arse.

 

Up to now, the Tories have done all his work for him. He's just lingered quietly in the background as they alientate everyone.

 

But in order to be seen as a vilable and strong leader/PM, at some point he has to prove himself, and show some leadership and strength. At the moment, he just looks like a slightly older 6th former who got the job by default and who lacks any sort of gravitas.

 

Dave may be a smarmy, evil, elitist, but he does at least exude an air of confidence and authority.

[colhint]

I still think the Libdems will be the king makers. I think for all the moaning about them, either  side might need to jump in bed with them

[tonyh29]

 

 

more bad news for the Unite funded leader

 

 

Labour's poll lead has been slashed to three points despite Britons declaring a dislike for coalition government, a new survey has revealed.

Ed Miliband's party is on 37%, ahead of the Tories on 34%, the Lib Dems on 10% and the UK Independent Party (Ukip) on 12%, according to a ComRes poll.

The current standings, based on a survey for the Independent conducted between 25-27 July, would still give Mr Miliband a majority of 32 at the next election.

But Labour's lead has halved in a month, which will deepen concerns in Labour ranks about a revival in Tory fortunes as signs grow of economic recovery.

 

That is like saying it's looking bad Man Utd because your lead at the top of the premiership is only a few points now. A desperate headline from some source - where was that quote from?

 

Still leading and considering the way that the Tory party is funded by it's somewhat secretive ways I find is very funny how you Tony try and use any sort of link to Unite as a bad thing, especially as you were claiming the other day that they would no longer support Milliband and the Labour party.  Wasn't it you also that said before about opinion polls having little to no value?

 

 

taking into account what I do for a living I suspect if I did it was very firmly tongue in cheek

 

worrying though that despite you constantly posting here how awful this govt are labour have lost 12 points in the polls to a government that by and large are unpopular 

 

I wasn't claiming Unite would stop supporting the party , the claim was that it was now opt in rather than you buying votes for Ed without knowing about it

[tonyh29]

Red Ed really does need to pull his finger out of his arse.

 

Up to now, the Tories have done all his work for him. He's just lingered quietly in the background as they alientate everyone.

 

But in order to be seen as a vilable and strong leader/PM, at some point he has to prove himself, and show some leadership and strength. At the moment, he just looks like a slightly older 6th former who got the job by default and who lacks any sort of gravitas.

 

Dave may be a smarmy, evil, elitist, but he does at least exude an air of confidence and authority.

 

 

very well put

 

(apart from the evil bit )

[Jon]

 

 

The challenge for the Tories is clear in 2015. They have to either do a deal with or totally discredit UKIP. Any split in the vote puts Labour into power unless the Lib Dem's agree en mass to another coalition which I can't see happening.

 

If the economy continues to grow and people perceive that they are better off as a result I think it will be a really close one because Labour's message of savage cuts and unfairness will slowly get diluted.

 

Interesting viewpoint, basically admitting that the Tory party needs it's "allies" in UKIP? We all know that many in the Tory ranks actually relate to UKIP - as we have seen they have been invited to speak at the next conference. We also see things like the VT "right wing" element who are very vocal and quick to jump and defend the Tory gvmt (and attack Labour at any chance - even when not even relevant) but have said that they have voted UKIP in the past. Cameron has been (for one of the few times in his life) correctly summing up UKIP as "fruit-cakes, nutters and closet racists", so it's interesting now how much the Tory party will have to rely on them for any sort of success in the future.

 

The next election will be a dirty nasty one, and you can already see evidence of that type of political bun fight occurring. I suspect that quite a few skeleton's in cupboards are looking forward to their re-emergence into the real world. The Lib Dems have been killed off by Cuckold Clegg which sort of leaves the middle ground as up for grabs and key - as it always has been. Extreme views may not be the best way to try and win that vote

 

 

Pretty much what I said a page or two back Ian.  Since 1979, the two main parties have averaged around 35% of the vote each, and they've both lost share to the Liberals.  I think both parties probably have a stable 30% of the vote who are dyed-in-the-wool supporters, so the floating voters, disgruntled Liberal supporters and UKIP are going to be key, in a few key marginal seats.  All most undemocratic really.

 

Yes. If only we could have had a say in the way this country elects in MP's. Some form of referendum perhaps. Something a bit fairer.

 

Pure Proportional Representation FTW. Every vote should count, and the people's voice should be equally and fairly heard in the H of C. AS much as I dislike the lib dems for what they have done, and UKIP etc for what they stand for, any party that gets a decent share of the public vote should have a voice/seat(s) in parliament. The lib dems have actaully been severely shafted, seats wise, in the H of C for many years, due to the god awful FPTP system.

[drat01]

I still think the Libdems will be the king makers. I think for all the moaning about them, either  side might need to jump in bed with them

Absolutely, in terms of their vote share certainly. I think they will struggle enormously to get the same number of MP's as they have done previously and that is mainly down to how their core voters have been royally screwed (and watched by Clegg and Alexander) by the Tory bed partners.

 

Maybe the whole debate will re-occur about vote systems?

Red Ed really does need to pull his finger out of his arse.

 

Up to now, the Tories have done all his work for him. He's just lingered quietly in the background as they alientate everyone.

 

But in order to be seen as a vilable and strong leader/PM, at some point he has to prove himself, and show some leadership and strength. At the moment, he just looks like a slightly older 6th former who got the job by default and who lacks any sort of gravitas.

 

Dave may be a smarmy, evil, elitist, but he does at least exude an air of confidence and authority.

"Red Ed"? - really? ........ shame

[Eames]

 

The challenge for the Tories is clear in 2015. They have to either do a deal with or totally discredit UKIP. Any split in the vote puts Labour into power unless the Lib Dem's agree en mass to another coalition which I can't see happening.

 

If the economy continues to grow and people perceive that they are better off as a result I think it will be a really close one because Labour's message of savage cuts and unfairness will slowly get diluted.

 

Interesting viewpoint, basically admitting that the Tory party needs it's "allies" in UKIP? We all know that many in the Tory ranks actually relate to UKIP - as we have seen they have been invited to speak at the next conference. We also see things like the VT "right wing" element who are very vocal and quick to jump and defend the Tory gvmt (and attack Labour at any chance - even when not even relevant) but have said that they have voted UKIP in the past. Cameron has been (for one of the few times in his life) correctly summing up UKIP as "fruit-cakes, nutters and closet racists", so it's interesting now how much the Tory party will have to rely on them for any sort of success in the future.

 

The next election will be a dirty nasty one, and you can already see evidence of that type of political bun fight occurring. I suspect that quite a few skeleton's in cupboards are looking forward to their re-emergence into the real world. The Lib Dems have been killed off by Cuckold Clegg which sort of leaves the middle ground as up for grabs and key - as it always has been. Extreme views may not be the best way to try and win that vote

 

I think given the challenge the Government have faced I'm surprised the Tories haven't split further. In times of turmoil every party has elements that charge to the extremes. On the left you have the Union's attempting to move the Labour party to the left by sneaking their own preferred candidates in, on the right you have the rise of UKIP. A split RW vote will cripple the Tories at the next election with margins so tight even giving 5% over to UKIP will put them back in opposition. They have to find a way to work with the more reasonable elements whilst isolating the nutters and that won't be easy, particularly given the europhobic elements within the Tory party itself. Its pretty clear I am conservative in my outlook on life but any attempt to remove the UK from the EU is a deal breaker for me and I would happily vote Labour to prevent that from happening. (A futile gesture given that you could shave a chimp down here give him a blue suit and he'd get in - I'm not ruling out the possibility they have already done this tbh)

 

Labour's strategy must attempt to take every advantage of this split. Alas, I don't think they have the right leader to do it. Eddy boy is not strong or dynamic enough. Balls would be a far better bet, but we can't seriously have Prime Minister Balls so unfortunately for him it will never happen. Its going to be a nasty fight, especially when the Government have been actively making changes in some very emotive areas eg. NHS and welfare reform. Another hung parliament is a pretty good bet I reckon. 

[snowychap]

...labour have lost 12 points in the polls to a government that by and large are unpopular

On what basis do you say Labour have lost 12 points to the government? In what timeframe?

Have you just randomly selected an opinion poll that shows Labour with a 15 point lead and then taken this current one as accurate?

Why didn't you take either of the other two polls done on the same day?

[tonyh29]

 

The challenge for the Tories is clear in 2015. They have to either do a deal with or totally discredit UKIP. Any split in the vote puts Labour into power unless the Lib Dem's agree en mass to another coalition which I can't see happening.

 

If the economy continues to grow and people perceive that they are better off as a result I think it will be a really close one because Labour's message of savage cuts and unfairness will slowly get diluted.

 

Interesting viewpoint, basically admitting that the Tory party needs it's "allies" in UKIP? We all know that many in the Tory ranks actually relate to UKIP - as we have seen they have been invited to speak at the next conference. We also see things like the VT "right wing" element who are very vocal and quick to jump and defend the Tory gvmt (and attack Labour at any chance - even when not even relevant) but have said that they have voted UKIP in the past. Cameron has been (for one of the few times in his life) correctly summing up UKIP as "fruit-cakes, nutters and closet racists", so it's interesting now how much the Tory party will have to rely on them for any sort of success in the future.

 

The next election will be a dirty nasty one, and you can already see evidence of that type of political bun fight occurring. I suspect that quite a few skeleton's in cupboards are looking forward to their re-emergence into the real world. The Lib Dems have been killed off by Cuckold Clegg which sort of leaves the middle ground as up for grabs and key - as it always has been. Extreme views may not be the best way to try and win that vote

 

lets hope we don't get a return to the dark days of extreme views and  slogans like British jobs for British workers

[tonyh29]

 

...labour have lost 12 points in the polls to a government that by and large are unpopular

On what basis do you say Labour have lost 12 points to the government? In what timeframe?

Have you just randomly selected an opinion poll that shows Labour with a 15 point lead and then taken this current one as accurate?

Why didn't you take either of the other two polls done on the same day?

 

 

it wasn't random I selected the one that suited my argument

 

 

  spoilsport

[Eames]

 

 

 

 

 

Yes. If only we could have had a say in the way this country elects in MP's. Some form of referendum perhaps. Something a bit fairer.

Pure Proportional Representation FTW. Every vote should count, and the people's voice should be equally and fairly heard in the H of C. AS much as I dislike the lib dems for what they have done, and UKIP etc for what they stand for, any party that gets a decent share of the public vote should have a voice/seat(s) in parliament. The lib dems have actaully been severely shafted, seats wise, in the H of C for many years, due to the god awful FPTP system.

 

It would make sense and 5 years of coalition will show that it will work on a long term basis and does water down some of the more nutty policies that any single party may try and push into law. 

[Jon]

 

 

The challenge for the Tories is clear in 2015. They have to either do a deal with or totally discredit UKIP. Any split in the vote puts Labour into power unless the Lib Dem's agree en mass to another coalition which I can't see happening.

 

If the economy continues to grow and people perceive that they are better off as a result I think it will be a really close one because Labour's message of savage cuts and unfairness will slowly get diluted.

 

Interesting viewpoint, basically admitting that the Tory party needs it's "allies" in UKIP? We all know that many in the Tory ranks actually relate to UKIP - as we have seen they have been invited to speak at the next conference. We also see things like the VT "right wing" element who are very vocal and quick to jump and defend the Tory gvmt (and attack Labour at any chance - even when not even relevant) but have said that they have voted UKIP in the past. Cameron has been (for one of the few times in his life) correctly summing up UKIP as "fruit-cakes, nutters and closet racists", so it's interesting now how much the Tory party will have to rely on them for any sort of success in the future.

 

The next election will be a dirty nasty one, and you can already see evidence of that type of political bun fight occurring. I suspect that quite a few skeleton's in cupboards are looking forward to their re-emergence into the real world. The Lib Dems have been killed off by Cuckold Clegg which sort of leaves the middle ground as up for grabs and key - as it always has been. Extreme views may not be the best way to try and win that vote

 

. Eddy boy is not strong or dynamic enough. Balls would be a far better bet, but we can't seriously have Prime Minister Balls so unfortunately for him it will never happen.

 

Agree with that Eames. Gonads exudes far more authority and strength of character. If only gonads has thought about changing his name some time ago, to a more electorally beneficial one. There must be a precedent for that ....