Jon Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 When the Yorkshire Post, quite a staunch Tory supporter leads with a headline of One in 10 from region jobless as Cameron ‘betrays’ young it shows that something is very wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted December 15, 2011 Moderator Share Posted December 15, 2011 perhaps that is why they have invested in those infastructure projects to get them started sooner and quicker. But that is only going to be what another 15k jobs MAX? Without a doubt it is, because they have perhaps realised their error. That they are moving to correct it is to their credit but it doesn't detract from the initial mistake in the first place. If it is the case that this is them correcting their own error I find it ironic that their answer to unemployment and the lack of growth is in fact to increase public spending. Perhaps they are going to admit that maybe just maybe they cut far too much too quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 perhaps that is why they have invested in those infastructure projects to get them started sooner and quicker. But that is only going to be what another 15k jobs MAX? Without a doubt it is, because they have perhaps realised their error. That they are moving to correct it is to their credit but it doesn't detract from the initial mistake in the first place. If it is the case that this is them correcting their own error I find it ironic that their answer to unemployment and the lack of growth is in fact to increase public spending. Perhaps they are going to admit that maybe just maybe they cut far too much too quickly. Isn't the infrastructure stuff just bringing forward some projects which would otherwise have taken place a couple of years later, without increasing the planned overall spending total? I don't think they will admit they got it wrong - I don't think they even realise it. Right and wrong don't come into it - it's just what they are programmed to do. The government is on a mission. It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted December 15, 2011 Moderator Share Posted December 15, 2011 You could well be right, in fact you probably are but I don't honestly know. I had just assumed they were projects that had previously been mothballed, indefinately postponed or even cancelled I wasn't aware they were already committed to and as such budgeted for. If so that is slightly different I guess. I don't for one minute think they just dreamed these projects up to kick start growth I just assumed that they were perhaps suddenly more receptive to them than they perhaps were previously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amsterdam_Neil_D Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 I don't think they will admit they got it wrong - I don't think they even realise it. Right and wrong don't come into it - it's just what they are programmed to do. The government is on a mission. Economy: Shall we play a game? David Cameron: Oh! Osbourne: [giggles] I think I love you ! Economy: Shall we play a game? David Cameron: Yeah. Weird isn't it? Osbourne: Yeah. David Cameron: [typing] Love to. How about Global Thermonuclear War? Economy: Wouldn't you prefer a nice game of chess? [Osbourne laughs, can we make the poor even poorer ? David Cameron: [typing] Later. Let's play Global Thermonuclear War. Economy: Wouldn't you prefer a nice game of chess? David Cameron: "that's just not cricket old boy !" David Cameron: [typing] Later. Let's play Global Thermonuclear War. Economy: Fine. Sometimes the programming is wrong ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 You could well be right, in fact you probably are but I don't honestly know. I had just assumed they were projects that had previously been mothballed, indefinately postponed or even cancelled I wasn't aware they were already committed to and as such budgeted for. If so that is slightly different I guess. I don't for one minute think they just dreamed these projects up to kick start growth I just assumed that they were perhaps suddenly more receptive to them than they perhaps were previously. I thought I read a few weeks ago that these projects had been brought forward from planned future years' capital programmes. This more recent piece says the funding is now coming from extra cuts in this year's current spending. It seems to be within the overall envelope of what they had already intended to spend. Doing it like this will create some extra demand from the extra spending, and also reduce demand by means of the cuts in people's income they are making to pay for it. He really doesn't get it. ...The chancellor announced a three-year spending programme to boost the long-term growth potential of the economy, but said fresh deterioration in public finances meant the extra £5bn for infrastructure – an additional £1.2bn for education, £400m for house-building and the £1bn cost of scrapping January's increase in fuel duty and limiting rail fare increases to 6% – had to be found from savings elsewhere. He caused anger among welfare campaigners by scrapping an increase in child tax credits that will result in an additional 100,000 children dropping below the government's poverty line, and was accused of provoking unions by setting a two-year 1% ceiling on public sector pay increases – well below the current inflation rate. He also signalled the end of national pay bargaining within two years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 While you should never read too much into bi-election results, interesting that yesterday there was a significant swing to Labour in the Feltham and Heston election. The LibDems look totally dead in the water now, and maybe for all the triumphalist bulldog crap that Cameron encouraged the voters are not really buying that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mykeyb Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 I must admit to only dipping in and out of this thread when I need a little light relief. Some of the blinkered & biased posts are absolutely comedy gold which is sad because these politicians are paid to run our country in a fit and proper manner. Labour under Brown proved totally useless and Blair knew where Labour was taking us and jumped ship to avoid the blame. The Tories while left with a sinking ship appear to be taking the stance of whatever Labour would do we will do the opposite. All of which means that while there is a path that will see us out of these financial woes I dont think that any of the current parties would be able to set us on the right course, maybe the last 20 years has shown us that there should be a much better alternative than the one we currently have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 and maybe for all the triumphalist bulldog crap that Cameron encouraged the voters are not really buying that. Labour minister Jim Fitzpatrick analysis of the result: "Not spectacular, but steady and significant progress" was how he put it. There was no real change. Labour won, like last time, the Conservatives were second, like last time and the Liberal Democrats were third, like last time. I suspect the Lib Dems are the happiest with the result , at least they managed to finish 3rd .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidlewis Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 Lib Dems finished 6th last time in that constituency they said on 5 live. so third is pretty decent considering. low turn out though, so not much can be read into a result of 28.8% turnout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 You know I wouldn't mind guessing that there was a large majority of the country who didn't even realise there was a by-election in Feltham and Heston I would even suspect that a majority of the people in Feltham and Heston didn't even know there was a by-election Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted December 16, 2011 Moderator Share Posted December 16, 2011 You know I wouldn't mind guessing that there was a large majority of the country who didn't even realise there was a by-election in Feltham and Heston I would even suspect that a majority of the people in Feltham and Heston didn't even know there was a by-election We could organise a poll to guage this but I don't think anyone would bother to vote. I'm inclined to agree to be honest, I consider myself relatively politically aware perhaps not as much as some in here but more than the average Joe and I wasn't aware about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted December 16, 2011 VT Supporter Share Posted December 16, 2011 There was a by-election? :shock: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 Lib Dems finished 6th last time in that constituency they said on 5 live. so third is pretty decent considering. low turn out though, so not much can be read into a result of 28.8% turnout. No, the Libs were third in the 2010 election as well. But this time, their vote was about a fifth of what it was a year ago. And last time, the fourth-placed candidate got about 25% of the vote the Libs got. Yesterday, it was 93%, showing just how close they came to being pushed into fourth place. A pretty appalling result whichever way you look at it. The low turnout is the big point, for me. To have such a low turnout at a time of economic crisis with such a completely clueless government suggests that people really don't have much faith in what Labour is offering, which is barely distinguishable from the government. It's not the weather that kept them at home. Both sets of results here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 But we are being led to believe that the "bulldog" spirit and all that other bollox meant that the Tory party were representing the nations views. As said before one of these elections can never be a true indication of what the whole of the country is thinking, but there was a significant drop in the Tory part of the vote (note: I am sure boundary changes will sort that mess out!). The LibDems are paying for their cosying up to Tory policies and Labour increase its majority. Despite what people like Mykeyb says, which personally I think is totally wrong, the Tory party are showing that for all of their hot air before the election they had no answers and now have resorted to taking out some of their long term targets like the NHS, like the Public Sector while maintaining a support for their backers in the finance world - ironically the same people who are still to blame for so much of the issues the world faces. If I were a LibDem (shudder) I would seriously start to ask questions of the leadership and what exactly they are gaining from being the Tory party fall guys. It's obvious that the people are not happy with that approach and are quick to dump any sort of support for them. Basically they are now a party with no policies, no leadership and are seen as nothing more than Tory Lite. When the version of Toryism is the one we are seeing now, i.e. the nasty one with little regard for key values such as the NHS etc, supporting attacks on that will not get favour with voters who look beyond headlines in the Sun, Mail and soundbites in the HOC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 Ian how is the NHS being targetted? Where are the "little regard for key values such as the NHS" ? In terms of this by election when the turnout is so low then you usually find that the party who had the seat, holds the seat. They get out their vote and that is what they concentrate on This result means next to nothing Be good if you could answer my questions though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mykeyb Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 :Despite what people like Mykeyb says, which personally I think is totally wrong, the Tory party are showing that for all of their hot air before the election they had no answers and now have resorted to taking out some of their long term targets like the NHS, like the Public Sector while maintaining a support for their backers in the finance world - ironically the same people who are still to blame for so much of the issues the world faces. . If ever there is a case of putting words in peoples mouths....... Labour werent fit to govern, Tories arent fit to govern nd Libdems arent fit to govern. So I agree with you Drat...the country is **** with these people in the HOC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted December 17, 2011 VT Supporter Share Posted December 17, 2011 So what do we think about Dave's latest pronouncements on Christianity and the nation's moral collapse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted December 17, 2011 VT Supporter Share Posted December 17, 2011 Haven't seen the comments, but taking a stab in the dark just on what you've said -he's talking out of his arse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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