colhint Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 well I did a quick google and found on the FT website that unite has lost about 260,000 in the last 5 years. Now that report was 6 months old, but I doubt it could have risen by that much even at all. And their website banner suggests it hasn't risen at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 The way I see it is, as Union membership itself is falling, then it would be difficult for me to believe that support for unions amongst the general public, wouldn't follow the same trend. Without going in to the difficulties in the correlation of the two (union membership and wider public support), declining public support does not equal very little public support. As far as declining union membership goes, I'd say that there were many more factors than just whether individuals had support for the idea of collective bargaining/representation, &c. These may include a couple of things like: existing presence of a union (I'd imagine that people are less likely to go and join a union if they had to go in search of one to join, get it recognized in their workplace and so on) and the change in the utilities sector that has happened over the last decade or two. National Statistics"] Between 2002 and 2010, union density grew in the professional & admin services and wholesale, retail trade and motor repair sectors but fell in all other sectors with water supply, electricity and gas supply sectors recording the sharpest fall of over 15 percentage points each. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 The way I see it is, as Union membership itself is falling, then it would be difficult for me to believe that support for unions amongst the general public, wouldn't follow the same trend. Without going in to the difficulties in the correlation of the two (union membership and wider public support), declining public support does not equal very little public support. yes you are right. but as I say, I would find it hard to believe that if one is falling the other wouldn't follw the same trend. That said, is it very little support, I dont know? but I believe it is falling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 yes you are right. but as I say, I would find it hard to believe that if one is falling the other wouldn't follw the same trend. Have you asked why union membership may be falling? You have made the assumption that it is falling because of a decrease in support for unions whereas it may be falling to a level where it better represents the actual support for the idea of unions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 not sure I follow that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloBarnesi Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 To be fair Harriet “I want to St Pauls” Harman has rounded on the idea. Len Murray, Norman Willis, John Monks or William “Bill” Morris wouldn’t have tried this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 To be fair Harriet “I want to St Pauls” Harman has rounded on the idea. Len Murray, Norman Willis, John Monks or William “Bill” Morris wouldn’t have tried this. guess she won't be getting Unites backing at the labour leadership election later in the year :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloBarnesi Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I was watching Ed at PMQ today and in the brief five minutes I watched before heading out on a run he seemed nervous, and not confident at all. To be honest I ve not seen him at the dispatch box before, but was worried for him. Is it also true that Brown in his time as PM also damaged the dispatch box??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Is it also true that Brown in his time as PM also damaged the dispatch box??? he used to get rattled quite easily and had a tendency to thump it but I think the damage you are referring to was marker pen marks caused by Brown scribbling his notes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I was watching Ed at PMQ today and in the brief five minutes I watched before heading out on a run he seemed nervous, and not confident at all. To be honest I ve not seen him at the dispatch box before, but was worried for him. I've seen rabbits caught in my full beams that have exuded more confidence than Milliband to be honest. He really isn't cut out to lead his party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I was watching Ed at PMQ today and in the brief five minutes I watched before heading out on a run he seemed nervous, and not confident at all. To be honest I ve not seen him at the dispatch box before, but was worried for him. I've seen rabbits caught in my full beams that have exuded more confidence than Milliband to be honest. He really isn't cut out to lead his party.Personally I think he is absolutely ideal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 And yet recent polls have Labour ahead of the conservatives. Imagine the kind of lead they would have with a decisive leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted February 29, 2012 Author Moderator Share Posted February 29, 2012 By the time this government have finished it wouldn't matter if Mickey Mouse was in charge of the Labour Party Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I doubt that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunRickyRun Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 And yet recent polls have Labour ahead of the conservatives. Imagine the kind of lead they would have with a decisive leader. Aren't the opposition usually in front in the polls at this sort of time? From memory, Kinnock had a far bigger lead at that time and I feel the press will lead a similar campaign against Milliband come the election. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 i think the fact that the polls showed Cameron in front the other week over something like the "veto" v the economy , tells you that the public have very short memories few bits of good news nearer the election would seem to be all that's required these days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted March 1, 2012 Author Moderator Share Posted March 1, 2012 i think the fact that the polls showed Cameron in front the other week over something like the "veto" v the economy , tells you that the public have very short memories few bits of good news nearer the election would seem to be all that's required these days Not after they've forced the NHS to bend over and take one up the wrong un. Some things are untouchable. Oh and does anyone think Cameron actually understands what the term Trotskyite actually means? Or is he just using it in a Thatcher-esque 80's retro fear tactic. See the only Trotskyite party around these days is the S.W.P. who aren't really Trotskyite at all as they have a rather different definition of what Trotsky said about entryism, so much so that they have never tried to enter the Labour Party. And as such can't really be used as a stick to beat Labour with. It's like attacking the Liberal party by blaming the Green Party. I did find his brand of retro name calling rather amusing in a "I've seen this somewhere before" kind of way, this time however it is rather more transparent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted March 1, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted March 1, 2012 Lazy name calling never needs to understand actual political philosophies. If you're left of centre, everybody to right of centre is a "fascist". If you're right of centre, everybody to left of centre is a "bolshevik" or a "Trotskyite". If you're an American, a socialist is a communist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 i think the fact that the polls showed Cameron in front the other week over something like the "veto" v the economy , tells you that the public have very short memories few bits of good news nearer the election would seem to be all that's required these days Not after they've forced the NHS to bend over and take one up the wrong un. Some things are untouchable. Oh and does anyone think Cameron actually understands what the term Trotskyite actually means? Or is he just using it in a Thatcher-esque 80's retro fear tactic. See the only Trotskyite party around these days is the S.W.P. who aren't really Trotskyite at all as they have a rather different definition of what Trotsky said about entryism, so much so that they have never tried to enter the Labour Party. And as such can't really be used as a stick to beat Labour with. It's like attacking the Liberal party by blaming the Green Party. I did find his brand of retro name calling rather amusing in a "I've seen this somewhere before" kind of way, this time however it is rather more transparent. It showed perfectly Cameron in true Flashman style. Paul "moans" about Milliband (interesting how Cameron escapes such scrutiny) but personally I prefer any politician, leader or whatever "rank" to at least have a bit of social conscience. Cameron often resorts to bully boy tactics when he is proven wrong. Ironically his misuse of the Trotsky thing was in response to people like Barnardo's questioning this god awful Gvmt and their slave labour tactics. Barnardo's are trotskites are they? Laughable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 Not after they've forced the NHS to bend over and take one up the wrong un. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts