The club's relationship with the fans

[TRO]

12 hours ago, markavfc40 said:

The BS remark was in reference to you stating the above. I haven't a clue where that impression has come from, that some think their grievances are shared by all, as I haven't got the impression anyone thinks that.

The wading through piss issue is just one I have mentioned and certainly doesn't take centre stage. In fact I'd say in the grand scheme of things it is the least of most supporters worries which is quite the statement in itself I suppose and says a lot about the issues at the moment. Far bigger issues are pricing out supporters, splitting up some supporters from family/friends, selling season tickets for seats that don't exist, having fans pay through the nose to find that even arriving early, 40 minutes plus before kick off, still doesn't get you entry in time for kick off. As I've said before all the above isn't even close to covering everything but is enough on its own.

Probably my biggest issue though is that shit happens and things can go wrong. It is the lack of communication and contrition that pisses me off. Apologise for splitting up families/friends, apologise for selling seats that don't exist,  apologise for creating a situation where by fans who arrive in plenty of time can't access the ground in time for kick off, apologise for not fixing over the 3 month summer period toilets that were leaking out piss at the end of last season. 

I personally feel as disconnected with the club now as at any time during my 40 odd years following us/36 years as a season ticket holder. It is soul destroying, given the years of shit many of us endured, seeing long term really loyal supporters priced out and/or moved away from family/friends during a rare glimmer of shine for us. It is just simply not right. Justifying it by saying that is the way things are so suck it up isn't the answer. It hasn't been the answer for many clubs supporters, including Liverpool a club who unlike us as actually had success over the last 3 decades and successfully protested against price rises in 2016, and to meekly accept any shit, or perhaps in our case piss , thrown at us isn't the answer for us. 

I guess we all get annoyed through our own lens.....my biggest gripe is the shoddy defending we seem to have landed with.....but hey ho, we all have our thing.

[TRO]

10 hours ago, markavfc40 said:

You know this but you are not even scratching the surface of making that gap up by increasing ticket prices to extortionate levels. At best you could probably squeeze 5% out of that gap.

The answer to getting up to anywhere near the income levels of Liverpool,Arsenal, Chelsea, Man Utd, Spurs etc is to increase commercial revenue, sponsorships etc etc. We're also 15-30k behind a number of other teams in terms of our stadium capacity. It is also of course reliant on sustained success. We fail to get Champions League next season and that is likely to be a loss of around £40-50 million.

I don't get this pricing out of some supporters. The financial gains, which are pretty insignificant in the grand scheme of things, certainly don't mitigate the moral issue of disregarding supporters that stuck by the club through thin and thinner. 

This thread though and the overall relationship with supporters, certainly regular match day goers, as has been shown goes beyond just the ticket prices. It is the overall arrogant attitude of some at the club and the lack of contrition around a number of issues they have created. A short period of upturn on the pitch, thanks in the main to an exceptional manager, has meant that some fans have been happy to turn a blind eye to/tolerate many things they otherwise wouldn't have. Some things can't/shouldn't be ignored though. If things do drop off on the pitch though, which is certainly not beyond the realms, then tolerance really will be tested. 

Maybe when the plumber fixes the leaky toilets, he can tend to the defence at the same time.

[Tomaszk]

2 hours ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Why do we keep doing this?

The worst part is I know that you and the other lads know this... But just refuse to accept it due to the narrative

Yes... It's " unrealistic" wanting to consistently compete on the same playing field with less than half and one third ( in some cases ) of the revenue.

It's nowhere near rocket science.

Liverpool

" Commercial revenue for the Premier League giants in 2022-23 came to £272 million, up £25 million. Liverpool, heavyweights from English soccer's top-tier Premier League, saw their overall revenue for 2022-23 remain static compared to the previous season, at £594 million ($753 million). "

 

Aston Villa 

" Revenue increased to £217.7m, up from £178.4m in the previous year. “It was a good year in terms of finishing seventh, which meant they got well over £20m extra coming in with the way the Premier League allocates money between clubs,” says Maguire. _

 

 

WTF is this?

There's only one 'side' to this argument that is refusing to acknowledge valid points due to the narrative.

Villa UCL ticket prices:

 

Liverpool UCL ticket prices:

Which ones cost more please?

[ThunderPower_14]

The reality of PSR makes charging more necessary for us. This isn't just a greedy cash grab, we have to raise our revenue if we want to compete and every pound counts.

Liverpool are an established CL club with enormous global revenues. The tickets from 4 CL home games makes far less of a difference for them than it does for us. £30 extra is £1.27mil that we earn in tickets over Liverpool's prices for a single home game. That's £5mil over our 4 home games. It make a difference. Yes, there are other places we need to increase revenue, but that wouldn't stop this revenue from being important.

It sucks, the people who are getting squeezed for ever penny are the fans, and quite often the most devoted fans, but until the rules change, we either do stuff like this or we go back to being a mid-table also-ran for the rest of our existence. I fully appreciate that this is very easy for me to say as an Australian based fan who doesn't have to pay the extra money, but I can assure you I would if I was there.

[sidcow]

4 hours ago, ThunderPower_14 said:

I fully appreciate that this is very easy for me to say as an Australian based fan who doesn't have to pay the extra money, but I can assure you I would if I was there.

Yes, yes it is easy. And good for you. But unfortunately many of the 26,000 who were sat there on 14 February 2017 watching us lose to Barnsley cannot afford those tickets you would be happy to pay for if you were here. Do you get it now? 

[delboy54]

8 minutes ago, sidcow said:

Yes, yes it is easy. And good for you. But unfortunately many of the 26,000 who were sat there on 14 February 2017 watching us lose to Barnsley cannot afford those tickets you would be happy to pay for if you were here. Do you get it now? 

Yep and seeing us lose at home to Ipswich 0 - 1 albeit in front of 30796.

I am 66 now and will only be able to justify the cost of 1 home CL game and that's at a concession price for Upper Holte.

Unfortunately modern football is leaving me behind, its maybe my last season as a ST holder, I am struggling now to justify the cost of it all including a 200 mile round trip to VP....

[sidcow]

Just now, delboy54 said:

Yep and seeing us lose at home to Ipswich 0 - 1 albeit in front of 30796.

I am 66 now and will only be able to justify the cost of 1 home CL game and that's at a concession price for Upper Holte.

Unfortunately modern football is leaving me behind, its maybe my last season as a ST holder, I am struggling now to justify the cost of it all including a 200 mile round trip to VP....

Ah well. You can still bask in the warm glow that you helped the club to survive in it's darkest hour even if they've no interest in you going now. 

[villa4europe]

6 hours ago, Tomaszk said:

WTF is this?

There's only one 'side' to this argument that is refusing to acknowledge valid points due to the narrative.

Villa UCL ticket prices:

 

Liverpool UCL ticket prices:

Which ones cost more please?

which one has 20+ years of CL football?

its a shit excuse but its an excuse non the less, we're making hay while the sun shines, you'd like to think that if we become CL regulars and we weren't playing the likes of bayern and juve for the first time in 40 years then a bit more sensibility would be added

we've been taken advantage of in a way that the likes of Liverpool and city cant, city didn't even sell out vs inter did they? i obviously dont agree with what the club are doing but i can see why they're doing it

edit - i've also seen nothing on bundles for the home games? that seems weird to me, that they arent charging £100 x 4 for the games but then on the side have say a £350 package for the 4

Edited 5 hours ago by villa4europe

[Stevo985]

6 hours ago, Tomaszk said:

WTF is this?

There's only one 'side' to this argument that is refusing to acknowledge valid points due to the narrative.

Villa UCL ticket prices:

 

Liverpool UCL ticket prices:

Which ones cost more please?

And like I said earlier in the thread, Liverpool fans are openly moaning about the atmosphere at Anfield. That they've turned into a tourist club. The fans that go week in and week out and create the atmosphere are being priced out and replace by day trippers. And it's to the detriment of the team.

It used to piss off Klopp (apparently)

That's exactly where we're headed.

 

I'll probably get told I'm living in a bubble after posting that

[Stevo985]

59 minutes ago, delboy54 said:

Yep and seeing us lose at home to Ipswich 0 - 1 albeit in front of 30796.

I am 66 now and will only be able to justify the cost of 1 home CL game and that's at a concession price for Upper Holte.

Unfortunately modern football is leaving me behind, its maybe my last season as a ST holder, I am struggling now to justify the cost of it all including a 200 mile round trip to VP....

Everyone defending the prices and saying it's supply and demand and all that bollocks should really read posts like this.

A fan for decades, waited 40 years to see us back at the top table of club football whilst supporting us through thick and thin.

 

And can only afford to watch us in one of those games.

Don't want to pick on you @delboy54, but your situation is shared by many many other fans. And it's really really sad.

And it's even sadder that a section of fans (most of who don't go to games so never have to pay those prices) see no issue with it

[bobzy]

16 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

And like I said earlier in the thread, Liverpool fans are openly moaning about the atmosphere at Anfield. That they've turned into a tourist club. The fans that go week in and week out and create the atmosphere are being priced out and replace by day trippers. And it's to the detriment of the team.

It used to piss off Klopp (apparently)

That's exactly where we're headed.

 

I'll probably get told I'm living in a bubble after posting that

It's absolutely where we're heading.

And I'd wager very good money that those fans who are on the "this is what we need to do to compete" "It's a shame but ticket prices need to increase" side of things have also very openly slagged off the shite atmosphere at the Emirates/Etihad/any other stadium.

[turvontour]

It feels to me, on average, attending all Villa home games will cost double this season compared to the 2022/23 season. Last season was a bridging season to the sky high costs. Obviously depends how deep we go in the champions league, but 5 game plus is probably the tipping point for double the costs of the season before last. 

Surely this is the maths that should be put to the club. This is crippling the majority of the fanbase. It isnt a minority anymore at this point. 

 

Edited 5 hours ago by turvontour

[andycv]

18 hours ago, sidcow said:

But what if Aliens landed and stole all our money with a ray gun. I mean it's very very unlikely,but you never no. 

That's not really an answer to the question.  What if £5m does make a material difference?

[sidcow]

11 minutes ago, andycv said:

That's not really an answer to the question.  What if £5m does make a material difference?

It is an answer.  £5m is exceptionally unlikely to make a difference.  It's miniscule, an irrelevant sum of money in the scheme of things.  You're living in a world of "what if's" if you think it's absolutely essential to charge the fans.

[sidcow]

I wonder how empty Villa Park has to be to cross the line.  is a 70% full Villa Park still making more money at CL prices than a full VP as standard Premier League prices for example?

[Stevo985]

51 minutes ago, bobzy said:

It's absolutely where we're heading.

And I'd wager very good money that those fans who are on the "this is what we need to do to compete" "It's a shame but ticket prices need to increase" side of things have also very openly slagged off the shite atmosphere at the Emirates/Etihad/any other stadium.

Exactly.

We take the piss out of Man City fans for having empty seats at Champions League games

 

Yet here we are with empty seats in a Midland derby and (probably) empty seats in our second EVER Champions League home game.

All because it's been priced ridiculously high

 

It'll be optimal pricing. They'll have calculated they'll make more money by having the ground 90% full at £95 a ticket than they would by a full house at £75 a ticket. So it'll please the accountants and the "supply and demand, this is what we need to do to compete, and I'm alright from my armchair in another country" fans.

But it's a damn shame

[bobzy]

15 minutes ago, andycv said:

That's not really an answer to the question.  What if £5m does make a material difference?

There's a small chance it could be the difference between failing to meet PSR obligations or otherwise, but if we're that close to the bone then the club is being run terribly.

£5m in the grand scheme of things (we receive £130m or so just for existing in the Premier League) is "nothing" and won't have any bearing on any success or failure that may occur.

[bobzy]

Just now, Stevo985 said:

Exactly.

We take the piss out of Man City fans for having empty seats at Champions League games

 

Yet here we are with empty seats in a Midland derby and (probably) empty seats in our second EVER Champions League home game.

All because it's been priced ridiculously high

 

It'll be optimal pricing. They'll have calculated they'll make more money by having the ground 90% full at £95 a ticket than they would by a full house at £75 a ticket. So it'll please the accountants and the "supply and demand, this is what we need to do to compete, and I'm alright from my armchair in another country" fans.

But it's a damn shame

It'll be an absolute embarrassment if the Bayern game isn't sold out.

[Stevo985]

2 minutes ago, sidcow said:

I wonder how empty Villa Park has to be to cross the line.  is a 70% full Villa Park still making more money at CL prices than a full VP as standard Premier League prices for example?

As above, it's "optimal pricing".

They'll have worked out the optimal price to make the most money, and it probably doesn't involve a sold out Villa Park.

 

They'd rather make £3million with a 85% full ground than £2.9million with a full ground

[Stevo985]

4 minutes ago, bobzy said:

It'll be an absolute embarrassment if the Bayern game isn't sold out.

That game will sell out. Apart from maybe some of the higher priced GA+ offerings.

But Bologna I'm having serious doubts about, after previously being certain it would still sell out. There's shit loads of tickets left

 

Our second home game in the Champions League/European Cup for 42 years. And we'll have empty seats

 

Like you said, if that was the Emirates or the Etihad we'd be ripping them to pieces. And they've got years of CL football behind them

Edited 4 hours ago by Stevo985