The club's relationship with the fans

[thabucks]

I only care really about the fact we can go top tomorrow if we win … we are also playing Bayern Munich in the champions league. That’s what’s is important to me 

if you’re feeling disconnected from the club then that’s for you to deal with. Like it or not you’re just a number , a consumer and you have been for many years to the club. They have to pay lip service but overall they don’t care about you that much. We are owned by hard nosed billionaires or got to where they are by sheer determination and focus on one thing and that’s the money and bottom line and not the human aspect of their decisions.  They’ve transformed our club from the brink of oblivion to champions league in 5 years without saddling us with debt and now it’s the fans turn to pay up. Fair enough imo. 

Hard calls had to be made in order to raise revenues - they’ve done that efficiently and coldly and that’s how big successful businesses operate.

Do you really think they care if you cannot afford it as there is someone just as much a fan as you out there who can. It’s horrible for those who have been priced out. But they have to operate on maximising every revenue stream possible due to rules which are set out to cement the elite.

I don’t care much for the politics of modern football which is corrupt but I also understand my place in it which is just a number and someone who can either afford it or not - they don’t care about much else. It’s modern football finances and you either have to accept that and get over it or not but it’s not going away anytime and it’s not some evil plan by Heck & co it’s the inevitability of success. 

[TRO]

2 hours ago, Andy_10 said:

My career is graphic design.

I have been fortunate enough for recent roles within the industry to have worked within the sports industry too, so my career wasn't just a job. It's something that I am very passionate about, especially when it revolves around my other big passion in Villa.

So, yes, to me the crest is a very important issue.

Granted, it's not to everybody. That message I get loud & clear & I respect that.

But, when I talk about the crest, I am only highlighting certain areas because due to my career experiences, I am confident enough to know that some of these excuses given by Heck are utter nonsense. And that bothers me more than the fact that the new design is, in my humble opinion, utter garbage. I have never actually mentioned that on here before, other than the odd side comment about something like the drop shadow being ridiculous. They might as well have used comic sans as well, lol.

And the thing is, the crest is actually a lot more important than a lot of people realise. From a branding perspective, it is the first impression that any current & potential new customers get to see of our business. I accept that its not that important to you, & others, but branding wise it IS important. So to have three in two years, is ridiculous. It's also bad branding, confusing, & would have cost us money. Mostly with merchandise, but if we look disjointed enough as a company to need three brand logos in two years, what does that say to potential partners? And if some people think that it's not important, then why change it again at all? It has never made sense to me from any perspective for Heck to come in & retroactively destroy something just created, & created with fan input. I think we win an award for the process, but I may be mistaken. The whole thing, including the communication has been a debacle.

But I digress, I do not actually understand the owners with how they have given the green light for Purslows fan driven crest & then the next season given the green light for Hecks, in my humble opinion, crest abomination.

So how the owners have reacted to the crest, I obviously have no clue, but I just assume that they are trusting Heck & his sales pitch for the future. Just like they did with Purslow.

Andy, I am no position to question your expertise…and nor would I.

You could well be better than anything they have, but that’s not my point.

My point is, I don’t think it’s our job, to tell them how to do things, unless they ask.

I suspect there are many folk in the fan base, who have a skill set of excellence,in all sorts of aspects,  but the club have to do things for themselves.

Just as an example, Think of how many scouts in the crowd who feel they could do a better job…..blimey some think they are better players lol.

rightly or wrongly, they have to survive on their decision making, and the owners will give them enough latitude to prove that, until they are satisfied it’s not working, and only then will they take action.

Look, We all love the club, but we can’t tell them how to run it…..even if we see  things we think we could do better.

Edited Saturday at 18:10 by TRO

[TRO]

30 minutes ago, thabucks said:

I only care really about the fact we can go top tomorrow if we win … we are also playing Bayern Munich in the champions league. That’s what’s is important to me 

if you’re feeling disconnected from the club then that’s for you to deal with. Like it or not you’re just a number , a consumer and you have been for many years to the club. They have to pay lip service but overall they don’t care about you that much. We are owned by hard nosed billionaires or got to where they are by sheer determination and focus on one thing and that’s the money and bottom line and not the human aspect of their decisions.  They’ve transformed our club from the brink of oblivion to champions league in 5 years without saddling us with debt and now it’s the fans turn to pay up. Fair enough imo. 

Hard calls had to be made in order to raise revenues - they’ve done that efficiently and coldly and that’s how big successful businesses operate.

Do you really think they care if you cannot afford it as there is someone just as much a fan as you out there who can. It’s horrible for those who have been priced out. But they have to operate on maximising every revenue stream possible due to rules which are set out to cement the elite.

I don’t care much for the politics of modern football which is corrupt but I also understand my place in it which is just a number and someone who can either afford it or not - they don’t care about much else. It’s modern football finances and you either have to accept that and get over it or not but it’s not going away anytime and it’s not some evil plan by Heck & co it’s the inevitability of success. 

It reminds me of that Ricky Gervais moment when he was doing stand up.

A heckler at the front was talking to him…..Ricky bent over and said” I can’t do one on one mate, there’s too many in the theatre, but If I was in a room alone with you,  I would still ignore you, you ****.

I am not suggesting we get treated accordingly, but it does have a sobering effect.

Ps personally, I have never felt disconnected, by the club, because I have never felt entitled to be connected in a way that some folk do.

Edited Saturday at 17:16 by TRO

[nick76]

34 minutes ago, thabucks said:

I only care really about the fact we can go top tomorrow if we win … we are also playing Bayern Munich in the champions league. That’s what’s is important to me 

if you’re feeling disconnected from the club then that’s for you to deal with. Like it or not you’re just a number , a consumer and you have been for many years to the club. They have to pay lip service but overall they don’t care about you that much. We are owned by hard nosed billionaires or got to where they are by sheer determination and focus on one thing and that’s the money and bottom line and not the human aspect of their decisions.  They’ve transformed our club from the brink of oblivion to champions league in 5 years without saddling us with debt and now it’s the fans turn to pay up. Fair enough imo. 

Hard calls had to be made in order to raise revenues - they’ve done that efficiently and coldly and that’s how big successful businesses operate.

Do you really think they care if you cannot afford it as there is someone just as much a fan as you out there who can. It’s horrible for those who have been priced out. But they have to operate on maximising every revenue stream possible due to rules which are set out to cement the elite.

I don’t care much for the politics of modern football which is corrupt but I also understand my place in it which is just a number and someone who can either afford it or not - they don’t care about much else. It’s modern football finances and you either have to accept that and get over it or not but it’s not going away anytime and it’s not some evil plan by Heck & co it’s the inevitability of success. 

What a load of horseshit.  

Alienating your match going fans only causes problems.  

Maximising revenue through CL ticket prices dramatically increases well over and above any other northern club comparatively is plain dumb and causes friction with the average match going fans.

The reason those clubs are better revenue wise isn’t through the average joe’s ticket price as Newcastle £55 and Liverpool £61 CL prices showed.  The issue is past commercial revenue and Heck not getting more in the door commercially since he took over.

The owners have been brilliant there is no doubt about it and have put their hands in their pockets but I’d also argue us fans have put our hand in our pockets with the massive increases in season ticket prices, losing free cup game and continuing to pay for ever increasing shirts and merch.  

Heck needs to do his job now and get the commercial revenue in to hit the £450m revenue mark through big revenue channels and not pull further on the weakest and easiest channel (the fans) because that’s just poor business for short term gain but causing a divide that’s always hard to pull back.  

Owners done their job,  fans have done their job, Emery done his job, Heck now needs to do his job without further pushing the fans away.  Emery’s credit with the fans is covering pressure Heck would have if we weren’t doing so well on the field.

Edited Saturday at 17:18 by nick76

[TRO]

1 hour ago, markavfc40 said:

They haven't created a good team. They have employed an extremely gifted manager that has done that. The appointment before that was the complete opposite. 

We have a hell of a lot to be thankful for these owners for. Exploiting/disregarding supporters that were there through thin and thinner, off the back of a very short period of upturn, isn't something I'll be thanking them for. We are now paying top dollar, and some in comparison to other clubs certainly in terms of CL, and the arrogance for me comes in via the fact that the communication is diabolical, that many of us are having to wade through piss when using the toilets, that even getting to the ground 40 minutes early doesn't guarantee you'll make kick off due to the digital ticketing issues, that many long term loyal supporters have been split up from family/friends and that some supporters are arriving to find they have purchased seats that don't exist. All those issues, and more I haven't mentioned, and little, if anything, by way of apology is arrogance. 

No Mark, they made a mistake with SG, but NS had the foresight, ambition and wherewithal to sign up one of the best…..so I do credit the club with that….and they do have an indirect effect on our on field enjoyment.

Let me make my position clear, I am not a masochist, and I will join in with you, regarding my disappointment of the ticket pricing.  As for the first game , the conditions were unacceptable but since then I have seen no repeat.

 I am not defending the poor communication, but I remain unsure what they would be apologising to me personally for….and I would guess that many others have been only moderately inconvenienced too…..those that have legitimate gripes, would be entitled to take it up with the club……It’s hard to make general comments for c42,000 people.

I get all is not great off the field in comparison to on it….but I remain patient to see it catch up.

 

[thabucks]

12 minutes ago, nick76 said:

What a load of horseshit.  

Alienating your match going fans only causes problems.  

Maximising revenue through CL ticket prices dramatically increases well over and above any other northern club comparatively is plain dumb and causes friction with the average match going fans.

The reason those clubs are better revenue wise isn’t through the average joe’s ticket price as Newcastle £55 and Liverpool £61 CL prices showed.  The issue is past commercial revenue and Heck not getting more in the door commercially since he took over.

The owners have been brilliant there is no doubt about it and have put their hands in their pockets but I’d also argue us fans have put our hand in our pockets with the massive increases in season ticket prices, losing free cup game and continuing to pay for ever increasing shirts and merch.  

Heck needs to do his job now and get the commercial revenue in to hit the £450m revenue mark through big revenue channels and not pull further on the weakest and easiest channel (the fans) because that’s just poor business for short term gain but causing a divide that’s always hard to pull back.  

Owners done their job,  fans have done their job, Emery done his job, Heck now needs to do his job without further pushing the fans away.  Emery’s credit with the fans is covering pressure Heck would have if we weren’t doing so well on the field.

Again you believe you represent the fan base and your opinion counts - it doesn’t. Nor does mine as we are dispensable and replaceable. This fan nonsense that the club owes you anything needs to be gotten over. Fans I sat with recently were all praising the club and its off field progress and were saying it’s about time too - but that doesn’t mean anything it’s not representational nor is this place. The truth will always be somewhere in the middle. 

if you don’t like the prices of something no one has a gun to your head to pay it - there will be others who will happily pay and that’s all they care about. It’s not right but it is the modern reality of football. 

[Mark Albrighton]

23 minutes ago, TRO said:

It reminds me of that Ricky Gervais moment when he was doing stand up.

A heckler at the front was talking to him…..Ricky bent over and said” I can’t do one on one mate, there’s too many in the theatre, but If I was in a room alone with you,  I would still ignore you, you ****.

I am not suggesting we get treated accordingly, but it does have a sobering effect.

Ps personally, I have never felt disconnected, by the club, because I have never felt entitled to be connected in a way that some folk do.

Just as an aside, if Gervais spoke to the heckler then he clearly didn’t ignore him.

Stupid, Ricky. Stupid.

[sne]

5 minutes ago, thabucks said:

Again you believe you represent the fan base and your opinion counts - it doesn’t. Nor does mine as we are dispensable and replaceable. This fan nonsense that the club owes you anything needs to be gotten over. Fans I sat with recently were all praising the club and its off field progress and were saying it’s about time too - but that doesn’t mean anything it’s not representational nor is this place. The truth will always be somewhere in the middle. 

if you don’t like the prices of something no one has a gun to your head to pay it - there will be others who will happily pay and that’s all they care about. It’s not right but it is the modern reality of football. 

Looking at the number of empty seats I'm not sure that's correct.

[Stevo985]

18 minutes ago, thabucks said:

Again you believe you represent the fan base and your opinion counts - it doesn’t. Nor does mine as we are dispensable and replaceable. This fan nonsense that the club owes you anything needs to be gotten over. Fans I sat with recently were all praising the club and its off field progress and were saying it’s about time too - but that doesn’t mean anything it’s not representational nor is this place. The truth will always be somewhere in the middle. 

if you don’t like the prices of something no one has a gun to your head to pay it - there will be others who will happily pay and that’s all they care about. It’s not right but it is the modern reality of football. 

Basically you’re saying we’re all getting bent over and **** but that we shouldn’t give a shit about it

 

Cool story

[tinker]

13 minutes ago, sne said:

Looking at the number of empty seats I'm not sure that's correct.

What game? 39000 for wolves , that's how many empty? 3000, hardly loads. I think the Crystal Palace Cup game will show us how well Heck pricing policy will do .......they should have attached it to the Bologna game or something like that but time will tell, if he's wrong, he will pay with his job, as Purslow, SG and Dean Smith did. Failure is not an option. 

Edited Saturday at 17:57 by tinker

[thabucks]

14 minutes ago, sne said:

Looking at the number of empty seats I'm not sure that's correct.

Let’s judge at the end of the season when the ticket revenue and attendance % vs capacity can be analyzed - then a fair assessment can be made.  It’s is sad some loyal fans can no longer attend when there are empty seats but that’s  modern football whether you like it or not … 

[TRO]

38 minutes ago, nick76 said:

What a load of horseshit.  

Alienating your match going fans only causes problems.  

Maximising revenue through CL ticket prices dramatically increases well over and above any other northern club comparatively is plain dumb and causes friction with the average match going fans.

The reason those clubs are better revenue wise isn’t through the average joe’s ticket price as Newcastle £55 and Liverpool £61 CL prices showed.  The issue is past commercial revenue and Heck not getting more in the door commercially since he took over.

The owners have been brilliant there is no doubt about it and have put their hands in their pockets but I’d also argue us fans have put our hand in our pockets with the massive increases in season ticket prices, losing free cup game and continuing to pay for ever increasing shirts and merch.  

Heck needs to do his job now and get the commercial revenue in to hit the £450m revenue mark through big revenue channels and not pull further on the weakest and easiest channel (the fans) because that’s just poor business for short term gain but causing a divide that’s always hard to pull back.  

Owners done their job,  fans have done their job, Emery done his job, Heck now needs to do his job without further pushing the fans away.  Emery’s credit with the fans is covering pressure Heck would have if we weren’t doing so well on the field.

But Nick, we have to be clear here…..The owners who remain revered, are responsible for Heck’s actions. It may appear ambiguous to some, buts it’s a fact.Heck reports to them and I would be staggered if they was unaware of the fans mood towards Heck.

[thabucks]

5 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

Basically you’re saying we’re all getting bent over and **** but that we shouldn’t give a shit about it

 

Cool story

Yep and the quicker you accept that the better it’s shit but again you choose to pay or not and your opinions about it doesn’t really matter. Nor do they care. End of the season it will no doubt end with both  record shirt sales and revenue and record gate receipts - do you think they’ll give two shits about the loyal fan of x years who couldn’t afford it ? 

Edited Saturday at 18:01 by thabucks

[nick76]

17 minutes ago, sne said:

Looking at the number of empty seats I'm not sure that's correct.

Exactly

[MattVillaPortsmouth]

A saying I used to hear a lot in the military was “you are only happy when your moaning” rings so true, don’t get me wrong the tickets prices are crazy and maybe slightly out of touch - BUT the club have completely shifted both on and off the pitch, we HAVE TO increase revenue streams on all fronts to keep unai - he is delivering on his promises, I am sure the club want to on theirs. The lower holte at the Arsenal game was a disgrace but we weren’t swimming in piss as some would have you believe, but both games since have seen a marked improvement, and there are some really good additions (LEDs, store, fan zone) and more to come that will hopefully mean going forward we can price UCL games more in line with the other established teams whilst keeping season tickets where  people aren’t priced out,

A common theme I have heard and seen in media, is the ‘Loyal’ ‘Real’  “Working man” fan is more deserving than others and are being priced out - I would dearly love to be in the position where I have a season ticket but job/family commitments have meant I couldn’t and only recently have I been able to attend games, but that doesn’t mean I don’t bleed claret and blue as much as the next person, I understand the arguement we have been there through thick and thin but that doesn’t entitle you to anything and it certainly doesn’t make your voice more important than others, generally people moan about everything these days which imo stems from some form of entitlement and the want of everything free or to be handed on a plate.  If we haven’t noticed, the whole world is **** and stuck in a cost of living crisis - to quote the fat Aussie “chill and do some yoga or something” 

Maybe, as I have had zero problems purchasing tickets on the website or getting into the ground means I have a slight sunnier disposition in regards to might relationship with the club  but there are far more important things in life that we should focus on changing. Let’s enjoy the journey (it really could be worse)

[Stevo985]

2 minutes ago, thabucks said:

Yep and the quicker you accept that the better it’s shit but again you choose to pay or not and your opinions about it doesn’t really matter. Nor do they care. End of the season it will no doubt end with both  record shirt sales and revenue and record gate receipts - do you think they’ll give two shits about the loyal fan of x years who couldn’t afford it ? 

Pathetic attitude to be honest 

[TRO]

4 minutes ago, tinker said:

What game? 39000 for wolves , that's how many empty? 3000, hardly loads. I think the Crystal Palace Cup game will show us how well Heck pricing policy will do .......they should have attached it to the Bologna game or something like that but time will tell, if he's wrong, he will pay with his job, as Purslow, SG and Dean Smith did. Failure is not an option. 

The sad thing is, no data is available for how deep the pockets are of the match by match fans……only trial and error will suffice.

[thabucks]

Just now, Stevo985 said:

Pathetic attitude to be honest 

a realism one based on working commercially in football and understanding  the sad realities … 

[sne]

2 minutes ago, thabucks said:

Let’s judge at the end of the season when the ticket revenue and attendance % vs capacity can be analyzed - then a fair assessment can be made.  It’s is sad some loyal fans can no longer attend when there are empty seats but that’s  modern football whether you like it or not … 

Is the club even releasing those numbers?

Either way it's going to be a what if scenario as we'll never know if we'd made more or less money with a slightly less aggressive pricing while making sure more fans could actually get into the stadium ahead of kick off to spend a couple bucks inside.

Obviously I'm more in favor of the "Germany style pricing" idea but maybe this predatory approach will work in Birmingham.

[TRO]

29 minutes ago, thabucks said:

Again you believe you represent the fan base and your opinion counts - it doesn’t. Nor does mine as we are dispensable and replaceable. This fan nonsense that the club owes you anything needs to be gotten over. Fans I sat with recently were all praising the club and its off field progress and were saying it’s about time too - but that doesn’t mean anything it’s not representational nor is this place. The truth will always be somewhere in the middle. 

if you don’t like the prices of something no one has a gun to your head to pay it - there will be others who will happily pay and that’s all they care about. It’s not right but it is the modern reality of football. 

It’s the way everything runs…..not just football.