General Election Pre-Thread (4 of 6)

[bickster]

1 hour ago, Jareth said:

Been waiting for Starmer to put something in writing, something he might be held to

It is absolutely hilarious how those on the left hold the Labour Party to a higher level of accountability than all the other parties and expect them to do insane things like release their manifesto months earlier than any of the other parties. They get attacked by the people they supposedly appeal to on one side and the media (or most of it) on the other.

It's no wonder the party ends up with cyborg like appearances at public election events. They are constantly treading on twice as many eggshells as the other parties

I'm not even talking about just Starmer here. Rayner was the same last week (and no doubts in the next one), she had her entire personality sucked out of her in the debate and its her personality that actually resonates with the electorate.

I can't wait for the AI avatars a la ABBA to attend instead of the actual politicians

[bickster]

1 minute ago, Jareth said:

Sadly yes, it's difficult not to take it all with a large pinch of salt, however specific the mainfesto will be. And I have a feeling it'll be more likely a set of vague directions they want to take rather than commitments.

It'll be pretty much what he's been talking about for the last god knows how many weeks

[Jareth]

7 minutes ago, bickster said:

It is absolutely hilarious how those on the left hold the Labour Party to a higher level of accountability than all the other parties and expect them to do insane things like release their manifesto months earlier than any of the other parties. They get attacked by the people they supposedly appeal to on one side and the media (or most of it) on the other.

It's no wonder the party ends up with cyborg like appearances at public election events. They are constantly treading on twice as many eggshells as the other parties

I'm not even talking about just Starmer here. Rayner was the same last week (and no doubts in the next one), she had her entire personality sucked out of her in the debate and its her personality that actually resonates with the electorate.

I can't wait for the AI avatars a la ABBA to attend instead of the actual politicians

TBF, criticism of Starmer a few months ago was met with "wait until the manifesto, of course he's not going to commit to anything now and give the tories ammunition". Now suspicion of Starmer is met with "well don't expect him to commit to anything more than anyone else".

Anyhoos - the big headline is 'Go for growth' - not really explaining what happens if growth does not happen

Edited June 13 by Jareth

[Mark Albrighton]

2 hours ago, desensitized43 said:

I don’t know why Starmer struggled so much to answer the questions about supporting Corbyn.

All he had to say was “we’ve all worked for people we don’t particular agree with or like but you do it because you’re a team player and it’s the team that matters”.

End of discussion.

Presumably the follow up question would be “…so is there anyone on your team who doesn’t like you or disagrees with you?” Or a similar question would probably be directed to some of the more prominent Labour MPs who are likely to be in the cabinet.

Not a perfect answer (I don’t think there is one) but I think something along the lines of “While my view of what a Labour government is different to what Mr Corbyn thinks it should be, I believe that either version would be preferable to the scandal littered, omnishambles that has been the Conservative government over the past five years.”

[bickster]

4 minutes ago, Jareth said:

Anyhoos - the big headline is 'Go for growth' - not really explaining what happens if growth does not happen

None of the parties economic message is anything other than fantasy. I tend to ignore any of that because its bollocks, from all of them

[NurembergVillan]

5 minutes ago, Jareth said:

Anyhoos - the big headline is 'Go for growth' - not really explaining what happens if growth does not happen

Self explanatory isn't it?

Nike's tagline isn't "Just Do It - or you'll get fat and type 2 diabetes is shit".

[chrisp65]

11 minutes ago, Jareth said:

Sadly yes, it's difficult not to take it all with a large pinch of salt, however specific the mainfesto will be. And I have a feeling it'll be more likely a set of vague directions they want to take rather than commitments.

I’ve actually paid for and read party manifestos since way back when, I think Michael Foot was in charge for the first Labour one I read and reported on when I was a union rep..

The best you’ll get from a manifesto is a ‘vibe’ a desired direction of travel.

Whether Diego Garcia will actually be taken back from the U.S. and its population repatriated with compensation is somewhat unlikely. just as it’s somewhat unlikely a tweek to the planning process will produce 1.6 million affordable new homes.

Yes, correct, I have never touched a boob.

 

[bickster]

Not really a fan of Dawn Butler

Not really a fan of this type of music

But its still the best thing I've seen from a Labour politician in this campaign.

 

[DaoDeMings]

21 minutes ago, bickster said:

It is absolutely hilarious how those on the left hold the Labour Party to a higher level of accountability than all the other parties and expect them to do insane things like release their manifesto months earlier than any of the other parties. They get attacked by the people they supposedly appeal to on one side and the media (or most of it) on the other.

It's no wonder the party ends up with cyborg like appearances at public election events. They are constantly treading on twice as many eggshells as the other parties

I'm not even talking about just Starmer here. Rayner was the same last week (and no doubts in the next one), she had her entire personality sucked out of her in the debate and its her personality that actually resonates with the electorate.

I can't wait for the AI avatars a la ABBA to attend instead of the actual politicians

Why shouldn't people on the left hold the Labour Party to high standards?

The Tories have had a similar situation with Farage and UKIP in the last 10-15 years. As long as we have FPTP you'll always get a massive range of views within the two main parties.

I hardly think it's fair to blame Starmer's robotic media appearances on 'the left'.

Edit: When the Labour Party was under different leadership, did they not also get attacked by others within the party? Some on the right of the Labour Party even left. This is not something that's exclusive to 'those on the left'.

Edited June 13 by DaoDeMings

[bickster]

3 minutes ago, DaoDeMings said:

Why shouldn't people on the left hold the Labour Party to high standards?

Higher not high

[DaoDeMings]

13 minutes ago, bickster said:

Higher not high

I don't think it's true that they do

[bickster]

1 minute ago, DaoDeMings said:

I don't think it's true that they do

That's fine, you can think whatever you want to. No-one said you can't

[omariqy]

In reality everyone hold any party to their own standards. And for standards read principles and beliefs. No party will ever cover them all unfortunately. Especially in this current system.

[Wainy316]

Exhibit A: An actual tool made by Keir Starmer's father:

[VillaJ100]

I can't believe there isn't a party that's economically left wing but with a somewhat right wing foreign and immigration policy. One that wants -

Free tertiary education

Nationalised rail and buses, water, electricity and gas

Funded museums and libraries 

NHS and free elderly care

Stringent environmental regulations (no shit in rivers), investment in green energy including nuclear

Fairer tax brackets

But also -

Reduce non-student immigration to c.50k a year of highly skilled high taxpaying people and make immigration stricter overall - grow economy througu efficiency and productivity not just 'add more people'

Keep a nuclear deterrent 

Reverse armed forces cuts

Stop pandering to the petrostates and tell Russia to F off

Surely that party would go far?

[tonyh29]

1 hour ago, bickster said:

and its her personality that actually resonates with the electorate.

tbh her Northern ladette persona is the exact thing that has me swearing at the TV every time she appears on it , but that's probably true for any Northerner that appears on my TV  

interestingly on Yougov , she is more popular with men than women , it's probably some weirdo types that also fantasise about Liz Truss 

[bickster]

12 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

she is more popular with men than women , it's probably some weirdo types that also fantasise about Liz Truss 

I just think its Liverpool and Man Utd fans who secretly (or even openly) fantasise about being FKWs

[tonyh29]

 

[ml1dch]

Labour manifesto if anyone wants to read it

Nothing jumped out at me that wasn't briefed in advance. But all the stuff that was briefed in advance seems to have made it in.

Reckon Votes at 16 is going to be the thing the Tories jump on.

[bickster]

5 minutes ago, ml1dch said:

Reckon Votes at 16 is going to be the thing the Tories jump on.

The Times reckons they aren't capable of jumping