General Election Pre-Thread (3 of 6)

[Davkaus]

36 minutes ago, bickster said:

LibDem manifesto bounce

 

I'm increasingly thinking that the Lib Dems will get my vote, and if a result like this comes off, you're got to admire their smart targeting of seats and their use of their campaign budget but...You can't look at that as a feasible sets of results and think that this electoral system represents democracy, can you.

Some people on here cheer on FPTP because at least it keeps the Reform throbbers out, but just look at those numbers. It's not democracy, it's nothing like it. 

[bickster]

5 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

I'm increasingly thinking that the Lib Dems will get my vote, and if a result like this comes off, you're got to admire their smart targeting of seats and their use of their campaign budget but...You can't look at that as a feasible sets of results and think that this electoral system represents democracy, can you.

Some people on here cheer on FPTP because at least it keeps the Reform throbbers out, but just look at those numbers. It's not democracy, it's nothing like it. 

It’s all shaping up rather nicely I think and the LibDem increase is kind of a week earlier than I thought it would be. I’m really hoping it shows up in other polling released over the next few hours and days

[ml1dch]

15 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

Some people on here cheer on FPTP because at least it keeps the Reform throbbers out

[citation needed]

[Davkaus]

56 minutes ago, bickster said:

LibDem manifesto bounce

 

My favourite thing about this projection is that one of the 5 Reform seats is Wellingborough and Rushden, to the VT swear filter is only in need of a small update for Representative for North East Somerset.

[Davkaus]

Hang on, who changed it  

[Davkaus]

2 minutes ago, ml1dch said:

[citation needed]

I'm not going to dig through pages of bolitics threads, no, so if you're claiming I'm full of shit and deny that people support FPTP because it subdues extremist parties, so be it. 

[bickster]

6 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

Hang on, who changed it  

Oh we changed that when Bone lost his seat

We’ll have to change it again on July 5th as constituency won’t exist

[bickster]

14 minutes ago, ml1dch said:

[citation needed]

@Mandy Lifeboatseither a few pages back in this or last weeks topic, I forget exactly and I CBA either  

Others too but that is the freshest in my mind

[Davkaus]

3 minutes ago, bickster said:

@Mandy Lifeboatseither a few pages back in this or last weeks topic, I forget exactly and I CBA either  

Others too but that is the freshest in my mind

And to clarify, it's not a fringe view, so I was hardly having a go at people who feel that way - one of the very few perceived benefits of FPTP is that it generally leads to strong, moderate governments and marginalises the fringes at either end (and it is either end, compare the above projections for Green and Lib Dems).

I think all of the downsides of FPTP means it should go in the bin, but I wasn't trying to single anyone out.

[Seat68]

18 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

I'm not going to dig through pages of bolitics threads, no, so if you're claiming I'm full of shit and deny that people support FPTP because it subdues extremist parties, so be it. 

I do. I back up your assertion. But I am one person. 

[Davkaus]

2 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

but I wasn't trying to single anyone out.

 

2 minutes ago, Seat68 said:

I do. I back up your assertion. But I am one person. 

Except for this **** guy.  

[one_ian_taylor]

23 minutes ago, bickster said:

Oh we changed that when Bone lost his seat

We’ll have to change it again on July 5th as constituency won’t exist

Can we have a poll for which MP should be the word filter for the biggest Representative for North East Somerset please?

[chrisp65]

1 hour ago, bickster said:

LibDem manifesto bounce

 

If PLC were to get 4 seats after the boundary changes that, as they say, would be massive.

[bickster]

8 minutes ago, chrisp65 said:

If PLC were to get 4 seats after the boundary changes that, as they say, would be massive.

It would, outside chance of 3 I think. Ynys Mon and Caerfryddin are pretty nailed on with an outside chance of Llanelli. Can’t see them getting Caerphilly

[Mandy Lifeboats]

56 minutes ago, bickster said:

@Mandy Lifeboatseither a few pages back in this or last weeks topic, I forget exactly and I CBA either  

Correct. 

I am strongly against proportionate representation.  

FPTP usually gives us a moderate government with a decent majority. 

Proportionate Representation usually gives a coalition government where extremists have a disproportionate say. 

 

[Jon]

1 hour ago, Mandy Lifeboats said:

Correct. 

I am strongly against proportionate representation.  

FPTP usually gives us a moderate government with a decent majority. 

Proportionate Representation usually gives a coalition government where extremists have a disproportionate say. 

 

It actually works the exact opposite of this.  

FPTP often (especially for government with large majorities) leads to extremely strong government, able to do whatever they want. They essentially have a free reign to **** things up / make things great.  They can basically ignore the opposition, who are essentially toothless in these circumstances 

PR, on the other hand, often means government by consensus and coalition, as parties have to govern by broad agreement between each other. 

It works fairly well in other European countries that use it.  

It can lead to far better government. And the fringe parties don't call the shots. They just maybe get to get a few of their policies on the table.  Do you think the lib dems wielded disproportionate influence over the tories during their coalition? 

[bickster]

Here’s another Tory bar chart to go with the missing 55 MPs

As well as there apparently being zero candidates from other parties…

 

[bickster]

It’s very… erm… Orwellian. There is definitely something very sinister about the messaging

[one_ian_taylor]

5 minutes ago, bickster said:

It’s very… erm… Orwellian. There is definitely something very sinister about the messaging

Anyone else think that "Clear Plan" is open to misunderstanding? Could be clear as in "clear the table". 

[Danwichmann]

1 hour ago, bickster said:

Here’s another Tory bar chart to go with the missing 55 MPs

As well as there apparently being zero candidates from other parties…

 

And if course, another one trying not to remind anyone he's a Conservative. The brand is toxic.