TRO Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 14 minutes ago, Andy_10 said: The owners do share some of the responsibility. They are the owners & at the very least, if people are unhappy with Heck & not the owners, then they should at least be unhappy with them for hiring him in the first place. Especially after the review he earned while at New York Red Bulls. “I don’t think people really comprehend how much damage he’s done in the little time he’s been there,” one team insider said. He added: “He just came off as arrogant and ignorant, and in this business it’s a very bad combination. He was so arrogant, you just couldn’t talk to him. You don’t have to be a 100 percent soccer guy, able to name all the players on Brazil’s 1970 World Cup-winning team, but you have to have a basic understanding of the sport you’re working in. And that was clearly lacking." I don't think that negates the need for criticism of Heck for the negative things that he has done. He is a grown man, he earns lots of money doing his job, so when he fails at it, there should be some accountability. Especially at a football club, which is so public. Does the final buck stop with the owners? Yes & no, I would imagine. For example, they would have had the final say on the North Stand stadium upgrade, because thats a lot of money to spend. But how did Heck sell them on cancelling those works? And what was his motivation for doing so? Same with the crest. But the opposite goes for the positive things that he has done. His hand in the Castore cancellation negotiations, etc. I think that on forums, mostly due to social media, there often seems to be an inability to be able to recognise the grey areas. Everything is always either "brilliant" or "awful". And more often than not, the truth often lays in the middle. I agree. People can do good things and not so good things. I think the biggest issue is poor communication. we don’t know the challenges Chris Heck has to work with, and unless he communicates that, it’s inevitable some folk will interpret that as arrogance. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_10 Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 Just now, TRO said: I agree. People can do good things and not so good things. I think the biggest issue is poor communication. we don’t know the challenges Chris Heck has to work with, and unless he communicates that, it’s inevitable some folk will interpret that as arrogance. I have said it before, if he was honest with us from the start & explained the reasons for certain actions that he seems to have unilaterally chosen to do, instead of either ignoring us or feeding us literal nonsense, then a lot of the flack he receives probably wouldn't happen. Not to the degree that it currently does anyway. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Andy_10 said: I have said it before, if he was honest with us from the start & explained the reasons for certain actions that he seems to have unilaterally chosen to do, instead of either ignoring us or feeding us literal nonsense, then a lot of the flack he receives probably wouldn't happen. Not to the degree that it currently does anyway. I think the truth is one of the best mechanisms in life, for sorting out any complexity. We may not like it initially, but it creates the best basis for a solution. Edited September 6 by TRO 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_10 Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 18 minutes ago, TRO said: I think the truth is one of the best mechanisms in life, for sorting out any complexity. We may not like it initially, but it creates the best basis for a solution. I think the recent comments from Monchi & Vidagany explaining with honesty & humility why we did our business in the way that we did, goes to show that if you treat your customers with some respect, they will reciprocate. If you treat your customers with arrogance, disrespect & for want of a better word, lies, then they will not respect you back & will question the motives for everything that you do. Trust, especially in business is very hard to gain & very easy to lose. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Townsend Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 33 minutes ago, Andy_10 said: I have said it before, if he was honest with us from the start & explained the reasons for certain actions that he seems to have unilaterally chosen to do, instead of either ignoring us or feeding us literal nonsense, then a lot of the flack he receives probably wouldn't happen. Not to the degree that it currently does anyway. Bang on mate. 100%. Just waltzed in swinging! The badge issue was settled, he overruled and ignored the process predating him. The stand ,etc. A bit of truth and these issues would have been understood. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Townsend Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 Just to evolve my position, we knew when he was hired that Red Bulls sacked him after one year for alienating fans. Hence I was surprised to see how he went about things when he came here, it was like he hadn't learned from that experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 (edited) 3 hours ago, Captain_Townsend said: Just ro evolve my position, we knew when he was hired that Red Bulls sacked him after one year for alienating fans. Hence I was surprised to see how he went about things when he came here, it was like he hadn't learned from that experience. I don’t know his background to be honest. But, We don’t know the details of his brief, so it’s hard to comment. I am hearing we was so close to a 10 point deduction before Dougies sale, that would have changed everything. I am not giving him a free pass, but unless we know the details, it’s hard to form a reasonable opinion. Edited September 6 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post CVByrne Posted September 6 Popular Post Share Posted September 6 What he and his team have done in regards Villa Park, adding more premium seating, pricing our tickets correctly based on the demand for tickets and our status as a top Premier League club. All of this was overdue and takes strong leadership and is in the best interests of the long term success of the club and thus in the best interests of the vast majority of supporters. Chris Heck is doing an outstanding job. Keep it up 2 7 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rightdm00 Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 13 minutes ago, Captain_Townsend said: Just ro evolve my position, we knew when he was hired that Red Bulls sacked him after one year for alienating fans. Hence I was surprised to see how he went about things when he came here, it was like he hadn't learned from that experience. He is doing exactly as the owners want. If they didn't want a guy who's behavior/decisions could possibly peeve off fans they wouldn't have hired him. He is a known quantity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 1 hour ago, Vive_La_Villa said: This is true which is why I said fans need to ask themselves what they want as a Villa fan. The club will make decisions that won't sit well with everyone. I personally would be happy to sacrifice going to games if it meant we're a regular top 6 club always competing at the top. But I get everyone is different. Keeping on topic there is something about Heck I have never liked. Even in his interviews it all feels very insincere to me. I get he is meant to be good at what he does though. I am of the same mindset. However, in relation to Heck, nice guys, don’t always get the results. I don’t want him to be my best friend….my respect and admiration is reserved for UE. I have no doubt, that Purslow, was a far more amiable guy, but the owners wanted results, and so far they seem pretty good at hiring guys who get them. as unpalatable as some of the things he is doing, the club, needs finance, like we need oxygen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevonIsAPlaceOnEarth Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 Heck will do what most big chips execs do in a crisis; he will say nothing and wait for this to all become tomorrows chip paper. The reality is that he’s not a football man, he sees us as customers with disposable cash. Supply and demand says the club will probably get away with this pricing - as long as there’s 42k fans in for the CL games. But he has underestimated the roots of the game as a working class game still exist, and I imagine that the backlash and negative widespread coverage this has brought the club will mean he won’t be here next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Rightdm00 said: He is doing exactly as the owners want. If they didn't want a guy who's behavior/decisions could possibly peeve off fans they wouldn't have hired him. He is a known quantity. Peeve off a minority of match day going fans. The vast vast majority of us fans see revenue growth as overwhelmingly beneficial to the club and to the resources available to Emery and team to invest in the squad. This forum is skewed towards the minority and is not a representative sample of the fanbase Edited September 6 by CVByrne 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeroy Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 I've posted about this before but our matchday income in 22-23 was half what West Ham and Newcastle made and a sixth of what Spurs made! Of course those teams have bigger stadiums than us but it is one of many areas where we need to add more income. And even Leeds and Brighton made more from matchday despite having smaller stadiums. I don't think an increase of £4m (if that is what it will be for these CL games) makes much difference though, we need to increase it by £20m, £30, £40m or more. And that is where Heck has to make tough decisions that may upset the fans, but I do have sympathy. I'm not a season ticket holder, but I am a member so going to a CL game is going to cost me £90 and then I have to add travel from down south and accommodation in Birmingham etc. It's tough, we need more matchday income, a lot more, but we also want to keep loyal fans. Heck has a tough job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fun Factory Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 14 minutes ago, Rightdm00 said: He is doing exactly as the owners want. If they didn't want a guy who's behavior/decisions could possibly peeve off fans they wouldn't have hired him. He is a known quantity. Exactly. My feeling is that is time at Villa will be fairly short, is going to annoy a lot of people but ultimately deliver lots more money to the club. If he doesn't then he has failed in his remit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmygreaves Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 7 minutes ago, TRO said: as unpalatable as some of the things he is doing, the club, needs finance, like we need oxygen. Get more sponsorship deals. Leverage the incredible reach of the owners... there are countless companies Atairos have access to. Who's our training kit sponsor, who's name is on Bodymoor Heath, who's our official energy drink partner??? These are avenues to substantial investment but they take work. Doubling or tripling the prices on match day is easy.... Unfortunately it won't make much financial difference in the grand scheme of things but it will alienate your customers.... I don't understand where the "win" is... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 2 minutes ago, QldVilla said: I don’t agree with you. If the club is making similar sought of profit on several areas across the club it all adds up. It’s just lazy to justify a narrative to say making £4m makes no difference because it comes from ticket prices. I look at it that the owners heavily invested in the playing squad and manager which delivered us CL football. That has triggered better sponsorship deals and 8 games in the premier football competition across the planet and all it brings. All something we wouldn’t have without the owners and is now being milked by the owners to get every pound out of it. Or you would prefer to be in mid table obscurity or worse in the Championship. Ive seen all the false dawns over the past 40+ years, these owners have the resolve to deliver success and willing to pass on a little of the pain for the club to be successful. The whole fanbase has been pissed off. This will not help the team. The whole club has been dragged through the mud the last 48 hours as they decided to announce the prices right when an international break has arrived. This doesn't indicate good planning. We've been qualified for four months. Real gains aren't made by charging individual fans 5-60% more for their match tickets. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 2 minutes ago, The Fun Factory said: Exactly. My feeling is that is time at Villa will be fairly short, is going to annoy a lot of people but ultimately deliver lots more money to the club. If he doesn't then he has failed in his remit. I disagree, I think he's doing an exceptional job and I'm sure the owners see it that way too. He has stated his objective is growing the revenue to £400m and all of that additional revenue is going into the playing squad under these owners. That will translate into performances on the pitch because of Emery. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie09 Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 21 minutes ago, CVByrne said: thus in the best interests of the vast majority of supporters. Funniest thing i’ve read in years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 Just now, Robbie09 said: Funniest thing i’ve read in years. Mind elaborating your views? increased revenue = increased spending on the squad = increased performances on the pitch Increased performances on the pitch benefits all fans. Increased ticket prices impacts a minority of fans and doesn't impact the majority of fans as they don't attend games. So the majority of fans aren't impacted by ticket prices and do benefit from the improvements in the playing squad. Please give you counter points to this. Thanks 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicho Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 5 minutes ago, Leeroy said: I've posted about this before but our matchday income in 22-23 was half what West Ham and Newcastle made and a sixth of what Spurs made! Of course those teams have bigger stadiums than us but it is one of many areas where we need to add more income. And even Leeds and Brighton made more from matchday despite having smaller stadiums. I don't think an increase of £4m (if that is what it will be for these CL games) makes much difference though, we need to increase it by £20m, £30, £40m or more. And that is where Heck has to make tough decisions that may upset the fans, but I do have sympathy. I'm not a season ticket holder, but I am a member so going to a CL game is going to cost me £90 and then I have to add travel from down south and accommodation in Birmingham etc. It's tough, we need more matchday income, a lot more, but we also want to keep loyal fans. Heck has a tough job. You have to spend money to make money not just on the pitch but off it. The half arsed corporate offerings to bump up ticket prices and then massive general price rises is the way they have chosen It should have started with improved staffing, service and offerings within the stadium, you will take an easy tenner per person if it was easier to actually buy stuff. It’s harder to make better use of the space within though. The next was the north stand, scrapping it is fine especially with how it would lower attendance for what these big games are. But what’s the plan? New stadium? Massive demolition of the north and Doug? Again fans could stomach it if there was communication on what’s coming. Have we now also hit a benchmark where all games are pretty much £70+ for the foreseeable. That surely isn’t sustainable for our fan base. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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