Omari Kellyman

[johnny from donny]

If he’s not going to be playing and we have a sell on clause then it’s a win/win

[Dillon66]

Understand the reasoning behind selling the young lad, but can't help feeling this could be our equivalent of the Middlesbrough fans initial elation at 'fleecing' us for Morgan Rogers, then eventually realising they've had their pants pulled down......

Derby must be feeling worse having let him go to us for £600k because they were skint, then watching us trouser 20mill......

[Isa]

12 minutes ago, johnny from donny said:

If he’s not going to be playing and we have a sell on clause then it’s a win/win

Almost certainly no sell on clause given the fee. Perhaps a first option at best. 

Edited June 22 by Isa

[Pongo Waring]

3 minutes ago, Dillon66 said:

Understand the reasoning behind selling the young lad, but can't help feeling this could be our equivalent of the Middlesbrough fans initial elation at 'fleecing' us for Morgan Rogers, then eventually realising they've had their pants pulled down......

Derby must be feeling worse having let him go to us for £600k because they were skint, then watching us trouser 20mill......

Boro sold Rodgers for cheaper than what we sold Kellyman for He would have to some incredible things at Chelsea to be worth more than 20 million

[VillaChris]

22 minutes ago, rodders0223 said:

Whilst getting 9m for Tim and 20m for Omar is amazing business i still think both these players will be considered a pittance for whay they can do in the future. If Tim comes a regular PL midfielder which he will 9m is nothing and Omar is literally one of the best talents in Europe. 

Again 20m is amazing and we're having to do what we have to do for PSR, I'm not blaming the club or the staff but anyone that thinks it amazing we are selling kids for quick bucks is deluding themselves.

 

He's just a young kid with a few europa group stage matches and then played in the dead rubber at Palace.

Two years ago we were selling Carney for that fee and he had started prem games for us and his value hasn't really increased given his lack of games for Chelsea.

Worry I have for someone like Kellyman is he'll just get lost in Chelsea's system. I remember years back West Brom had a player called Izzy Brown, think he made his debut for them at 16 and was on the brink of regular first team participation. Moved to Chelsea and was just endlessly loaned out before his career just amounted to playing in the championship and then he had to retire early.

 

[Dillon66]

Just now, Pongo Waring said:

Boro sold Rodgers for cheaper than what we sold Kellyman for He would have to some incredible things at Chelsea to be worth more than 20 million

I understand that Villa staff believe the lad has a very high ceiling......I wouldn't be surprised if he went on to be a top top player.

But again, I understand how the financial realities of PSR affect these decisions.

[Zatman]

35 minutes ago, OhioVilla said:

If I recall correctly, selling a homegrown like Omari can be considered pure profit in FFP, yes? If that's true, then he and Tim are a magnificent deal. Wonder if we can sneak another Archer deal across the line in time?

We paid 600k for him and we got Tim from West Brom so not sure both of them count as academy players

[rodders0223]

2 minutes ago, Pongo Waring said:

Boro sold Rodgers for cheaper than what we sold Kellyman for He would have to some incredible things at Chelsea to be worth more than 20 million

20m really isn't a lot. I mean, it is for an 18 year old who hasn't kicked a ball but if you can turn than 18 year old into a moderate PL rotation player you can sell them for near double in 3 year.

[useless]

It's disappointing to lose him and frustrating, especially as he felt somewhat like a Chukwuemeka replacement so for it to be Chelsea who we're losing him to adds to the disappointment

That said twenty million is a very good fee, I'm not just saying this out of bitterness now because it looks like he's leaving, but for me he's nowhere near as good as Chukwuemeka or Aaron Ramsey were for the U21s, those two would run games by themselves and were much more consistent, and they were doing that as first year scholars too, Kellyman isn't as consistent, and I don't seem him dominate games

But the above doesn't mean he isn't a very good prospect, Young, Patterson, and others are close, but probably fair to say he is or was the biggest prospect in our academy, not being as good  as Chukwuemeka or Aaron Ramsey at the same age isn't a criticism really, those two were just a level above, and with comparing Kellyman reported fee to the Chukwuemeka fee, Chelsea overpaid but only because Chukwuemeka had just a few months left on his deal, if he had years left on his contract he would have cost more than £20m

Transfer fees can be strange for highly rated youth players, in that they can be higher the less first team experience the player has had, at that point it's potential that is being paid for, for example if we had have kept Kellyman and loaned him to the Championship next season and lets say he did okay but not brilliantly, he would probably worth less then than he is being valued at now despite it being the case that in that scenario he would be more proven at first team level, potential is what Chelsea are paying for

As for whether the move is a good one for him I don't know, they have a lot of left footed attackers, Palmer, Hutchinson, Madueke, they tried to sign Olise, having missed out on him it wouldn't surprise me if they tried for another, and there might be more besides those, not really up to date with all their players, so a lot of players to get past, but you could say the same about our squad, he mostly plays right side or in the number ten area, so he would essentially be behind Bailey, DIaby, Buendia, and Rogers, and probably Iling as he can also play on the right, maybe Chelsea plan is to loan him out

Back on the iniial point of him feeling like a Chukwuemeka replacement, I would say Jimoh had kind of overtaken him in that regad, by which I don't mean Jimoh is better, just closer in style to Chukwuemeka, and definitley very good in his own right

[Pongo Waring]

6 minutes ago, useless said:

It's disappointing to lose him and frustrating, especially as he felt somewhat like a Chukwuemeka replacement so for it to be Chelsea who we're losing him to adds to the disappointment

That said twenty million is a very good fee, I'm not just saying this out of bitterness now because it looks like he's leaving, but for me he's nowhere near as good as Chukwuemeka or Aaron Ramsey were for the U21s, those two would run games by themselves and were much more consistent, and they were doing that as first year scholars too, Kellyman isn't as consistent, and I don't seem him dominate games

But the above doesn't mean he isn't a very good prospect, Young, Patterson, and others are close, but probably fair to say he is or was the biggest prospect in our academy, not being as good  as Chukwuemeka or Aaron Ramsey at the same age isn't a criticism really, those two were just a level above, and with comparing Kellyman reported fee to the Chukwuemeka fee, Chelsea overpaid but only because Chukwuemeka had just a few months left on his deal, if he had years left on his contract he would have cost more than £20m

Transfer fees can be strange for highly rated youth players, in that they can be higher the less first team experience the player has had, at that point it's potential that is being paid for, for example if we had have kept Kellyman and loaned him to the Championship next season and lets say he did okay but not brilliantly, he would probably worth less then than he is being valued at now despite it being the case that in that scenario he would be more proven at first team level, potential is what Chelsea are paying for

As for whether the move is a good one for him I don't know, they have a lot of left footed attackers, Palmer, Hutchinson, Madueke, they tried to sign Olise, having missed out on him it wouldn't surprise me if they tried for another, and there might be more besides those, not really up to date with all their players, so a lot of players to get past, but you could say the same about our squad, he mostly plays right side or in the number ten area, so he would essentially be behind Bailey, DIaby, Buendia, and Rogers, and probably Iling as he can also play on the right, maybe Chelsea plan is to loan him out

Back on the iniial point of him feeling like a Chukwuemeka replacement, I would say Jimoh had kind of overtaken him in that regad, by which I don't mean Jimoh is better, just closer in style to Chukwuemeka, and definitley very good in his own right

They just signed Estevao Willian for 50 million too whos a left footed winger

[AvonVillain]

Gutted about this, just doesn't feel right.

[duke313]

21 minutes ago, Zatman said:

We paid 600k for him and we got Tim from West Brom so not sure both of them count as academy players

I think it depends on what kind of contract they be on when they sign? If it’s a youth contract then it counts as academy 

[burchy]

Thought he looked a great prospect, PSR and FFP effing stink

[AndyM3000]

27 minutes ago, rodders0223 said:

20m really isn't a lot. I mean, it is for an 18 year old who hasn't kicked a ball but if you can turn than 18 year old into a moderate PL rotation player you can sell them for near double in 3 year.

Agreed it's not a lot.

We are paying 35m for Maatsen who is 4 years older and has 200 prem minutes and half a season at Dortmund to his name. Outside of that, he's played Championship or lower.

This is also how Chelsea make their money, paid 100k for him without a proper appearance and now sell for that amount. They know what they are doing.

Edited June 22 by AndyM3000

[Mr_Dogg]

This is bizarre. From Chelsea.

He might not even make it as a PL player. 

[HalfTimePost]

20m? Absolutely yes. Get that done.
 

It's a shame, and I don't like the fact PSR incentivizes selling off kids before giving them a chance.

Selling Kellyman, we could absolutely live to regret it. Sure. He's a potential top talent.

However, more likely, with how Chelsea are run and the way they blitz through players and coaches - is that this probably slows his development.

He'll get some good loans and then become part of the Chelsea loan system for 4 years and be sold for a cut price fee to a Championship or lower Prem side. For a PSR profit on his book value but a loss overall.

That'd be a huge shame for the lad. He does have the mentality and drive to kick on though. So hopefully he manages to make us regret this, for his sake.

[Tayls]

So what’s the point in this transfer then, for both us and Chelsea? They sure as hell aren’t going to be playing him are they… think I’m missing the purpose or misunderstanding the whole PSR thing… it’s all a bit boring…

[BG_Villa_Fan]

1 minute ago, Tayls said:

So what’s the point in this transfer then, for both us and Chelsea? They sure as hell aren’t going to be playing him are they… think I’m missing the purpose or misunderstanding the whole PSR thing… it’s all a bit boring…

The point could be revealed when we buy Gallagher for 55m after the euros.

[Isa]

Chelsea have signed him effetively as a favour to us to help with PSR because we are doing the same for them with Maatsen and perhaps Gallagher as well.  I don't fully understand it but that is why the journalists reported it as Maatsen + a random academy player when confirmation of it broke. Chelsea know at the very least that they themselves will be able to sell Kellyman for pure profit themselves in a few years when he will count as one of their own due to spending a 3 years on their books before the age of 21 (or however long it is). 

[oishiiniku_uk]

Part of Clearlake's MO is to make Chelsea an 'engine for football talent development'. So if doesn't necessarily matter if Kellyman makes the first team there or gets loaned and then sold for double his fee in a couple of years' time. And Chelsea have hoovered up young talent for decades (although it used to be at youth level rather than targeting 18-20 year olds).