Steven Gerrard

[nick76]

49 minutes ago, TRO said:

I don't necessarily agree, but I don't emphatically disagree either.....when teams are intent on stopping all that....AND YOU LET THEM.......all that goes out the window.

Good players, impose their talent, if not, the talent is wasted.

did Bournemouth do all that, as you have suggested?.....There is more to this game Nick, than just that.

From what I gather, Bournemouth had a poor pre-season.

This game on Saturday, was not a one off....and its not been experienced, by one manager either.

You may feel different but you seem to want to blame anybody but Gerrard.  Yes the players deserve some blame along with others but the buck stops with Gerrard.  We have talented players that don’t seem to know what they are meant to be doing.  When it’s one or two players or even a few more, it’s easy to say it’s form or something but we are seeing the whole team underperforming so that’s down to the manager, Gerrard.

[macandally]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

some perspective creeping in.

Maybe the closed season has seen his mood change towards some....." give them enough rope and all that"

I think Dean may have had similar issues....I remember him saying on one occasion, "they didn't do what I was asking" and I believed him, does anyone really believe Dean Smith set us up to play like that against Watford, No.....top managers don't ask players to do some of the things, I have seen....They are better than that, that includes Dean Smith, I think some players, let him down.....I think SG is now experiencing  it, now he is gettng what Dean Smith had, to deal with.

It takes strong management to sort it out.....and sort it he must, just like Arteta, did.

 

I find this whole “if you agree with me perspective is creeping in” a bit insulting.  

Same with the “one game”’narrative, how much damage needs to be done before reality sets in?

[Jas10]

18 minutes ago, TRO said:

........On the gate?

[foreveryoung]

I think if this continues, where it looks like the players aren't listening, were gonna need a name, a big name next. We haven't had a big name manager in since maybe O'Neil, an shockingly, it was the last time we had a bit of success. I'm convinced now, we ain't going anywhere with the Brice's, Smith's and now maybe Gerrards of the football world.

I'm sure to have any success these days, its gonna take a manager who can demand respect, who has done something in the game, no more trainees for Villa pleeeese!

An before you say it, I don't believe that none of the big boys will come here. They will come, for a big salary and money to spend, we can offer them both. Who is free at the moment I wonder??

[icouldtelltheworld]

43 minutes ago, momo said:

I'm sorry to say: Steve Bruce > Steven Gerrard

I would've laughed at this a few months ago, and I'm sure you said it tongue in cheek. But I honestly reckon Bruce would have had this group of players win more than 6 in their last 23

[TRO]

25 minutes ago, nick76 said:

You may feel different but you seem to want to blame anybody but Gerrard.  Yes the players deserve some blame along with others but the buck stops with Gerrard.  We have talented players that don’t seem to know what they are meant to be doing.  When it’s one or two players or even a few more, it’s easy to say it’s form or something but we are seeing the whole team underperforming so that’s down to the manager, Gerrard.

I think its too easy to blame Gerrard, soley, thats my view.....I suspect he is trying to get them to work harder and they don't like it....I also suspect Dean had similar issues.

I think his mistakes, is not bringing in enough stature and combative players.....just like Dean.....I blame SG, but not exactly for the same things as you.

I have to say, I am surprised, He hasn't, unless is spending has been curtailed.

Carlos is a centre back, so it follows, he will bring Stature....but If Mings is out, who else is north of 6 feet....so one in one out...negated, no further forward, unless we play both, which now seems unlikely.

Kamara is a potentially a fine signing.....but the main elements of midfield are still there....small in stature too.

We have just witnessed the trend setters sign up 2 x 6 foot plus centre Forwards....indicating a change in mood from the big boys....ours don't even clear 6 feet, yet we pump in high balls....to no effect.

are we really surprised, we are stuggling?

Our team is puny...and unless we find way of passing arounds teams, we have little else as a weapon and thats difficult when the running off the ball is a luxury as opposed to a welcome chore.....and when they decide to beat us to the ball or play the man, we are fuched.

Bournemouths Mantra on Saturday was "Hard work beats talent, when talent doesn't work hard"............Bingo.

[nick76]

8 minutes ago, TRO said:

I think his mistakes, is not bringing in enough stature and combative players.....just like Dean.

I have to say, I am surprised.

Carlos is a centre back, so it follows, he will bring Stature....but If Mings is out, who else is north of 6 feet....so one in one out...negated.

Kamara is a potentially a fine signing.....but the main elements of midfield are still there....small in stature too.

We have just witnessed the trend setters sign up 2 x 6 foot plus centre Forwards....indicating a change in mood from the big boys....our don't even clear 6 feet, yet we pump in high balls.

are we really surprised, we are stuggling?

Our team is puny...and unless we find way of passing arounds teams, we have little else as a weapon and thats difficult when the running off the ball is a luxury as opposed to a welcome chore.....and when they decide to beat us to the ball or play the man, we are fuched.

All agreed but I think you’re missing a major factor in that whatever is being coached at BMH is either not translating to the game day pitch or is rubbish.  We don’t look like a well coached team and it’s not just this game. So we will get bullied because of the points you make but there are large portions of that game when we weren’t being bullied and we didn’t know what to do, that’s down to SG and his teams coaching.

[allani]

21 minutes ago, Keyblade said:

All the evidence is pointing to a downward trajectory and a lack of ideas or nous. He's now had a "mini" preseason as well as a real preseason and we are no closer to seeing any sort of identity in his team. What I'm seeing in this thread is a lot of fingers in ears wishful thinking based on little evidence, which oddly wasn't afforded to the previous guy when things got dicey. We were cutthroat then, why are we suddenly so understanding and forgiving? It makes no sense.

To be fair Gerrard hasn't had a full transfer window yet.  He and our recruitment team may yet be working on the deal that does transform us into the team that he wants us to be (although probably one without the ideal striker this season).  If he (like Smith before) overlooks the midfield issue then the understanding and forgiveness will soon disappear.  I was probably leaning towards the "pro" side of the Gerrard debate - decent recruitment, clearly targetting key positions over-riding slight concerns on the continued inconsistency / poor performances.  The appointment of McGinn as captain (not related to the decision to replace Mings) has really concerned me.  If Gerrard is willing to build his midfield (and by extension his team) around McGinn then I can't see it ending well.  I do think that McGinn should start and that he could make a big contribution playing in the right role but he shouldn't be a key part of our "spine".  Unfortunately it looked like he wanted to try and run everything against Bournemouth - too involved in corners / free-kicks / etc.  I am still hoping that Gerrard will address this - in the same way I hoped Smith would.  I think he still deserves a chance.  But (as with Smith before) eventually those chances will run out.

[Zatman]

This is a constant trend at Rangers, he really needs to stop this. He cant do this if he ever {laughing as I type this} gets the Liverpool job. Salah or Van Dijk wouldnt take it

Quote

I believe Rangers will challenge for the league this year.

“But until Steven Gerrard gets it right and stops throwing his players under the bus...

“The best manager of all time, Sir Alex Ferguson, was known for the hairdryer treatment.

“He did it in the changing room but went out and blamed everyone but the players in the media.”

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/4706490/steven-gerrard-rangers-paul-slane-celtic-open-goal-podcast/

 

Googling Gerrard throwing players under the bus comes up about 20 different articles from his time at Rangers

[TRO]

26 minutes ago, macandally said:

I find this whole “if you agree with me perspective is creeping in” a bit insulting.  

Same with the “one game”’narrative, how much damage needs to be done before reality sets in?

I didn't say" If you agree with me" thats your narrative.....I said a bit of perspective is creeping in, and I think it is....some good rounded posts imo.

I was praising another poster, for what I think is perspective, how has it insulted you?, when that was not the intention?

but its is one game.....How many have we played then?

If we beat Everton, well and play well, and we all go home happy, The hang him brigade, will look pretty silly, won't they.

You speak to any football pundits and delare he must go now....and see what reponse you will get.

don't let your anger, rule your head.

[OLDVILLAN]

1 minute ago, TRO said:

I think that will be, one of his mistakes.

It  baffles and worries me for the rest of Gerrard's tenure however long it lasts That he is seeing something in Mcginn that 90% of the villa fanbase cant see.

I mean its crazy to think that he is using his favourites over the players that are in form , for example Konsa over Chambers and Coutihno over buendia and Jacob ramsay's form fell off a cliff months ago and  also needs to be dropped to get his perspective together.

Gerrard was quoted as saying that he wanted fast moving exciting possession based football..I wonder if the coaches have told the players that yet, It took him four years at rangers to build a team that could beat a poor celtic in a 2 horse league...he wont get that here..dare i say he wont even get the next 4 months if he does not turn around the dressing room.

[allani]

8 minutes ago, icouldtelltheworld said:

I would've laughed at this a few months ago, and I'm sure you said it tongue in cheek. But I honestly reckon Bruce would have had this group of players win more than 6 in their last 23

Bruce would never have got this group of players together to start with.

[Zatman]

7 minutes ago, allani said:

Or maybe it is down to the players not being good enough / able / willing to implement what is being drilled into them?  I am sure that McGinn is quite good at controlling the ball in training sessions and yet when he steps over the white line on match day he seems to be intent on playing his ridiculous floaty cross-field balls that work once every 60 times and the other 59 times result in the opposition getting the ball back.  If that is part of what the coaching team want us to do - then they need to go.

mm good managers build a team around the squad you have and not build your squad around a tactic. The manager is the one playing McGinn though as well, I know McGinn is going to do the same thing weekly and a manager on 5 million a year should be able to see the same thing

[Tom13]

12 minutes ago, Zatman said:

This is a constant trend at Rangers, he really needs to stop this. He cant do this if he ever {laughing as I type this} gets the Liverpool job. Salah or Van Dijk wouldnt take it

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/4706490/steven-gerrard-rangers-paul-slane-celtic-open-goal-podcast/

 

Googling Gerrard throwing players under the bus comes up about 20 different articles from his time at Rangers

From that same article... "His starting XI was bizarre..."

[Mantis]

1 hour ago, Keyblade said:

Not seeing much of it if any in 2022 would indicate it was a new manager bounce wouldn't you say? Especially after a full preseason, where none of that was displayed as well I should add.

No there definitely seemed to be a shift in the style of play, and we did still see glimpses of it in the latter half of last season, just not nearly enough.

[TRO]

19 minutes ago, sne said:

Any ideas about who this player who is both tall enough and angry enough to transform out team could be?

Vanja Ivesa.....

Edited August 9, 2022 by TRO

[Dale]

2 minutes ago, TRO said:

all the managers and their coaches at Man U since Fergie Poor

Given that they've won domestic and European competition since, no. Solskjaer trading on impressive playing career and good performance in a substandard league was poor. 

[VillaParkAvenue]

8 minutes ago, allani said:

We need a manager to make the bold decision of saying that some of our popular players / fan favourites might not be what we need.

You mean we need Gerrard to say we don’t need Buendia and Sanson, who seem to be the current fan favourites?

What difference would that do, they’re rarely playing anyway.

[allani]

19 minutes ago, TRO said:

I think you are right......if things are not being done properly, we assume its down to the coaching, sometimes it is, but sometimes its the player themselves.....they are not robots, they can think.....I am just offering other thoughts, not saying folk are wrong in their thinking.

Pep replied the week end when asked what can he bring to Haalands game.....the kid is 22, so its more than a reasonable question.

Pep made an ironic laugh and said " what can I teach him about scoring"......Pep was an honest man, what can he?

I am not challenging coaching per se......but some times folk turn to it too quickly and the answer to all the ills.

 

I agree.  I do think that lots of people got carried away with their expectations for this season.  Predictions of a top 8 finish are - I think fanciful.  I don't think we have addressed our biggest issue (midfield) sufficiently.  Just like we didn't last summer.  Just like we didn't the summer before.  I don't think it is possible to coach Luiz or McGinn to be the player that we need in the middle of the park.  They just don't have the required attributes.  They are both good players and I can see either of them being a very good part of a strong midfield three - just not together.  If Gerrard doesn't see this (as Smith didn't before him) then it won't be a coaching issue per se.  But it will be a managerial error and it will ultimately cost him his job.

[allani]

2 minutes ago, VillaParkAvenue said:

You mean we need Gerrard to say we don’t need Buendia and Sanson, who seem to be the current fan favourites?

What difference would that do, they’re rarely playing anyway.

That's a very weird thing to think that I am saying.  But whatever floats your boat.