Steven Gerrard

[ciggiesnbeer]

1 minute ago, Jas10 said:

Don’t see why you’re getting riled.

That’s the way I see it, you don’t. Fair enough.

SG has had plenty of time… another thing we are going to disagree on. 9 months, no signs of progress or an identity or playing style. 6 wins is 23 is abysmal.

its now 10 in 29, which is also bad but thats his number.


fwiw I agree with a lot of what you are saying. I think l comparing managers is just fine. Imho he is an upgrade on Dean Smith, or to be specific I think he is as good a tactician as Dean Smith. A better recruiter than Dean Smith and a much MUCH worse man manager than Dean Smith.


I am still pro Gerrard but honestly I have no problem with people calling for Gerrard's head. He has had a disastrous few days and its all self inflicted. I cant and wont defend his gaffes. He needs to change sharpish.
 

[Jas10]

1 minute ago, TRO said:

I backed Steve Bruce for a period of time until it was clear, he had to go......I backed Steve Bruce, against the Vitriol, he was receiving from certain quarters and I backed Steve Bruce from the idiotic throwing of vegetables to make a chavvy point....lets get things in to perspective here.....I did not unconditionally back Steve Bruce.....I challenged Crap aimed at him.

I am backing Steve Gerrard, to come through this....but if he doesn't, the club will know how to deal with it best.

I am not jumping on the Bandwagon, because we have had a dastardly game, that I could have thrown a brick at the telly over....he has games to put that right, if he don't, you will have your way.

The vitriol was bad and unnecessary, I acknowledge that. 

It was you who accused another member of jumping on bandwagons, no one has accused you of doing so.

I just think you could be a little more respectful in your responses, rather than appearing to talk down to people.

-

My way? I don’t want my way… whatever that is supposed to be. All I want is for Aston Villa to do well and be entertaining and take pride in following them… 

I am frustrated and annoyed because I see no direction and progress under this manager, there is nothing that I am being encouraged by and I just feel that damage is being done… it’s been 9 months under this guy… what is he doing?

[TRO]

27 minutes ago, Jas10 said:

Don’t see why you’re getting riled.

That’s the way I see it, you don’t. Fair enough.

SG has had plenty of time… another thing we are going to disagree on. 9 months, no signs of progress or an identity or playing style. 6 wins is 23 is abysmal.

I am not getting riled, but your normally intelligent posts have taken a turn for the worst.....you are simply writing stuff which is questionable.

But here you go again.....there WAS signs of progress, when he first arrived....he won 4 of his first 7 games up until new year and the 3 we lost was Man City, Liverpool and Chelsea, Liverpool and Man city we give them a game......In Jan 2022...He brought in 2 good footballers in Digne & Coutinho( who are lightweight) and we have gone backwards, ever since...not blaming them directly, but strange isn't it?

I accept, you see it the way you do.

Edited August 9, 2022 by TRO

[Jas10]

1 minute ago, ciggiesnbeer said:

its now 10 in 29, which is also bad but thats his number.


fwiw I agree with a lot of what you are saying. I think l comparing managers is just fine. Imho he is an upgrade on Dean Smith, or to be specific I think he is as good a tactician as Dean Smith. A better recruiter than Dean Smith and a much MUCH worse man manager than Dean Smith.


I am still pro Gerrard but honestly I have no problem with people calling for Gerrard's head. He has had a disastrous few days and its all self inflicted. I cant and wont defend his gaffes. He needs to change sharpish.
 

The last thing I would call him is a tactician. He needs an assistant manager to do the bulk of the work he is supposed to be doing, I find that ridiculous. 

I cannot fathom how he can be seen as an  upgrade either, not on the evidence so far…

As far as recruitment… that’s not all down to SG… and many people seem to have changed their view on his mate Coutinho. The only real transfer coup I can see is Kamara really… and I’m not sure that that is all down to him… maybe this has been a bit overblown… 

I don’t believe that we couldn’t attract quality players under Dean… we signed some good ones or high profile ones…

I honestly don’t see what he has over Dean but I’m not trying to do a comparison here… I just want us to kick on and progress and currently have no belief that we are going to do that under SG. That is what is bothering me…

I don’t want to keep comparing, my original point was simply that it was only worth sacking the previous manager in order to bring in an upgrade and on current evidence we haven’t done that and look to be regressing more than anything. It’s a major concern. 

If we somehow start performing and become a formidable side, I’ll be delighted. I don’t care about SG either way…. I just care about our club doing well and he is proving to be more of a hindrance than a help… I can’t see how that is going to change but I want it to…

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

26 minutes ago, Tom13 said:

And come on. Is your defence for McGinn really that he's nicknamed Super John McGinn?

Come on Tom, you know what he meant.

Anyway I might have to give Villa a break for a few days as it's quite depressing at the moment.

* See you in a few hours then. Lol

[Jas10]

4 minutes ago, TRO said:

I am not getting riled, but your normally intelligent posts have taken a turn for the worst.....you are simply writing stuff which is questionable.

But here you go again.....there WAS signs of progress, when he first arrived....he won 4 of his first 7 games up until new year and the 3 we lost was Man City, Liverpool and Chelsea, Liverpool and Man city we give them a game......In Jan...He brought in 2 good footballers in Digne & Coutinho( who are lightweight) and we have gone backwards, ever since...not blaming them directly, but strange isn't it?

I accept, you see it the way you do.

Fair enough, I can see we’re not going to see eye to eye on this.

I don’t mean to pick a fight or argument with you… I’m just very frustrated but you also seem to have strayed from your “normally intelligent posts” and seem to be talking down to people. As if you know better…

I’ll leave it there.

We rant or share opinions because we care, not healthy for our emotional states

[TRO]

11 minutes ago, Jas10 said:

I can also praise the owners and what they have done while pointing out any mistakes at the some time…

Sacking Dean wasn’t necessarily a mistake and, as I said, it may have been worthwhile or justified if we actually brought in an upgrade or someone to take us to the next level(s).

SG was a risk and it’s not working out. Don’t forget CP’s role, maybe it’s not the owners but him that is making mistakes.

He demanded “continual improvement”… that hasn’t happened… we continue on this decline…

For now, yeah.

I am sure there are issues the club have to deal with....because not every fan was surprised at that result.

9 minutes ago, ciggiesnbeer said:

its now 10 in 29, which is also bad but thats his number.


fwiw I agree with a lot of what you are saying. I think l comparing managers is just fine. Imho he is an upgrade on Dean Smith, or to be specific I think he is as good a tactician as Dean Smith. A better recruiter than Dean Smith and a much MUCH worse man manager than Dean Smith.


I am still pro Gerrard but honestly I have no problem with people calling for Gerrard's head. He has had a disastrous few days and its all self inflicted. I cant and wont defend his gaffes. He needs to change sharpish.
 

Ciggie....study his record, before Jan 2022.....and then look at it for 2022.

Look at who came in , in Jan 2022.

and tell me what you see?

I too agree he has made mistakes, but maybe not so much in the area's some folk are claiming, maybe its recruitment.

[TRO]

1 minute ago, Jas10 said:

Fair enough, I can see we’re not going to see eye to eye on this.

I don’t mean to pick a fight or argument with you… I’m just very frustrated but you also seem to have strayed from your “normally intelligent posts” and seem to be talking down to people. As if you know better…

I’ll leave it there.

We rant or share opinions because we care, not healthy for our emotional states

Me neither.

Soz if you think that, No I don't think I know better, because I am not privvy to the inner sanctum....I just think its so easy after that debacle to write SG off....thats all.

 

[Jas10]

1 minute ago, TRO said:

Me neither.

Soz if you think that, No I don't think I know better, because I am not privvy to the inner sanctum....I just think its so easy after that debacle to write SG off....thats all.

 

I think it’s time we both got some sleep

It’s an emotional and trying time as a Villa fan right now…

Goodnight and UTV

[ciggiesnbeer]

Well for me Digne, Coutinho, Kamara & Carlos have all been excellent signings. 3 of whome have all said specifically Gerrard was one of the reasons they came here.

I also remember Deano (who I still adore) getting lost tactically last season (3 at the back anyone? thought not.) He also has struggled at Norwich, forgivable because the players there are terrible but worth noting.

I also did believe we were in relegation danger and I believe so now. Then again I have been scarred by our past decade so maybe I am just gun shy I dunno.

I just hope against hope that we win big at Everton and these unprofessional comments stop from Gerrard. I dont like it at all. 

 

[TRO]

14 minutes ago, Jas10 said:

The last thing I would call him is a tactician. He needs an assistant manager to do the bulk of the work he is supposed to be doing, I find that ridiculous. 

I cannot fathom how he can be seen as an  upgrade either, not on the evidence so far…

As far as recruitment… that’s not all down to SG… and many people seem to have changed their view on his mate Coutinho. The only real transfer coup I can see is Kamara really… and I’m not sure that that is all down to him… maybe this has been a bit overblown… 

I don’t believe that we couldn’t attract quality players under Dean… we signed some good ones or high profile ones…

I honestly don’t see what he has over Dean but I’m not trying to do a comparison here… I just want us to kick on and progress and currently have no belief that we are going to do that under SG. That is what is bothering me…

I don’t want to keep comparing, my original point was simply that it was only worth sacking the previous manager in order to bring in an upgrade and on current evidence we haven’t done that and look to be regressing more than anything. It’s a major concern. 

If we somehow start performing and become a formidable side, I’ll be delighted. I don’t care about SG either way…. I just care about our club doing well and he is proving to be more of a hindrance than a help… I can’t see how that is going to change but I want it to…

where was the tactical genius of Klopp, when Mitrovic was bullying TAA at the back post?

Jas we have to give SG a chance to make us happy again.

[TRO]

6 minutes ago, Jas10 said:

I think it’s time we both got some sleep

It’s an emotional and trying time as a Villa fan right now…

Goodnight and UTV

you just beat me too it....enjoyed the ding dong mate, thanks.

UTV

[Adam2003]

11 minutes ago, TRO said:

Ciggie....study his record, before Jan 2022.....and then look at it for 2022.

Look at who came in , in Jan 2022.

and tell me what you see?

I too agree he has made mistakes, but maybe not so much in the area's some folk are claiming, maybe its recruitment.

I think we were just underperforming before he came in. Bounced back a bit to the mean for his first couple of months, which suggests it was time for Smith to go. But declining ever since then, which suggests Gerrard doesn’t bring much to the table. Which is sadly the risk when you appoint someone with no credible track record. And again shows the risk of firing him if we don’t get the replacement right - I hope they are working very hard behind the scenes on who that could be rather than scrambling in a few weeks or months (and I trust they will be because I do trust the ownership - they may have got this wrong but they made the right call sacking Bruce, the right call appointing Smith and the right call sacking Smith, so they are still 3/4 in my view).

[Tomaszk]

3 hours ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Seriously need some huge results after this, otherwise as I said the other day, this could be one.of the quickest Manager turnarounds ever.

He needs performances not results.

Obviously was expecting slop, because that's all we've seen. Didn't think it would be quite that bad on opening day. More than worried about Gerrard, I'm worried about Purslow not sacking him.

[Lerner's Driver]

1 hour ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Come on Tom, you know what he meant.

Anyway I might have to give Villa a break for a few days as it's quite depressing at the moment.

* See you in a few hours then. Lol

Mate, following the Villa is one mistake you can't pause or put right, you are destined to keep repeating it and it will continue to be something that haunts you even after you are dead.

Aston Villa is a cruel mistress, only interested in raising your hopes purely in order to destroy them, slowly and painfully through a mix of neglect and incompetence.

Your suffering is her delight! For those who have been abused over prolonged periods of time, they often say the only available choice is to enjoy it.

You've had plenty of chances to walk away, but you always come back, don't you? You are in it for the long haul, I'm afraid mate. Bend over and present like the rest of us.

Everton next and when we scrape an unconvincing 1-0 win after Tyrone comes on to nick it, she will be back in your ear, promising you the world. This time in return for one of your kidneys. 

Edited August 9, 2022 by Lerner's Driver

[WallisFrizz]

5 hours ago, Jas10 said:

Btw, to suggest there is anything wrong with Tyrone Mings’ attitude or character is complete bullshit. It’s an even greater shade of bullshit to suggest that Dean Smith ever had an issue with Ty. He was the guy that brought him in initially and secured his future at the club, at a time when the whole fan base was desperate for him to commit and absolutely delighted when he signed for the club. 

They had a great relationship for the most part  of course but when things got tough at the end and Smith dropped him it soured. Mings spoke out afterwards that Smith had scapegoated him and gave Dean the briefest of public goodbyes when he got sacked. It’s all there on the internet if you don’t believe the ‘bullshit’. I’m not saying there was a major bust up but there was an issue at the end.

I’ve always been a Mings fan, still am and I hate the way this has all become so public but I am willing to consider the fact that there might be stuff that has gone on that we don’t know about Mings that might justify Gerrards distrust of him (stripping the captaincy is pretty pointless tho when there is no one else suitable to take it on).

It may be just as simple as Mings thinks he’s Mr Aston Villa and Gerrard making it clear who is number 1 in the pecking order. In which case Ty may have seen off 2 managers very soon. Who knows? Not us is my point. 

[Jas10]

3 hours ago, Lerner's Driver said:

Mate, following the Villa is one mistake you can't pause or put right, you are destined to keep repeating it and it will continue to be something that haunts you even after you are dead.

Aston Villa is a cruel mistress, only interested in raising your hopes purely in order to destroy them, slowly and painfully through a mix of neglect and incompetence.

Your suffering is her delight! For those who have been abused over prolonged periods of time, they often say the only available choice is to enjoy it.

You've had plenty of chances to walk away, but you always come back, don't you? You are in it for the long haul, I'm afraid mate. Bend over and present like the rest of us.

Everton next and when we scrape an unconvincing 1-0 win after Tyrone comes on to nick it, she will be back in your ear, promising you the world. This time in return for one of your kidneys. 

[MSvillain]

3 hours ago, Lerner's Driver said:

Mate, following the Villa is one mistake you can't pause or put right, you are destined to keep repeating it and it will continue to be something that haunts you even after you are dead.

Aston Villa is a cruel mistress, only interested in raising your hopes purely in order to destroy them, slowly and painfully through a mix of neglect and incompetence.

Your suffering is her delight! For those who have been abused over prolonged periods of time, they often say the only available choice is to enjoy it.

You've had plenty of chances to walk away, but you always come back, don't you? You are in it for the long haul, I'm afraid mate. Bend over and present like the rest of us.

Everton next and when we scrape an unconvincing 1-0 win after Tyrone comes on to nick it, she will be back in your ear, promising you the world. This time in return for one of your kidneys. 

Think this may be the best, most accurate post I’ve seen on this forum

[lexicon]

Saturday can't come quick enough, can it? 

 

[Philosopher]

I don't believe we can criticise the new signings. Coutinho is an improvement on El Ghazi for sure, and Digne is a clear improvement on Targett. Targett, was getting destroyed on a regular basis last season.  I haven't  seen this from Digne.

Tactics has always been an issue. Smith was a poor tactician but he found a formula by relying on Grealish's talents. Gerrard on the other hand has a clear vision on how he wants to play and doesn't want to deviate from that, which I respect.

However he needs a team of top class players to play the way he wants, he also needs to get the team to start matches playing a bit more compact and with greater intensity, because this conceding of early goals is killing us. It's happening regardless of personnel, which suggests it's to do with tactics and coaching.

Gerrard has messed up big time with the Mings, McGinn, captaincy thing. He has an issue with Mings clearly, which has now become public, due purely down to his own handling of the matter. His post match comments have made things worse rather than better. Those comments won't have gone down well with the squad.

McGinn simply isn't a leader. And neither is he our best player. A captian should either be the best leader, or the best player. McGinn is nowhere near either. 

We all see the need for a new number 8 and we generally agree that new player should be taking McGinn's place in the team. Making McGinn captain shows Gerrard doesn't see this. He probably wants to push Ramsey out of the team. Which if true doesn't look good for the young players. 

On a final note, Gerrard has been operating on a net spend  in the region of 30 million over 2 windows, on the back of a window with a net spend of 0. It seems like the boardroom have either been cutting back, or are unwilling to back the managers due to doubts over their abilities.

Edited August 9, 2022 by Philosopher