Steven Gerrard

[Zatman]

18 minutes ago, Zero7 said:

It's the same people that want instant success, we have to give him time. 

Thats actually not true as Gerrard is a manager designed for instant success, its going straight for instant success and failing that is one of the problems with hiring him in the first place. People were happy with how the club was naturally evolving without bringing in big names on huge contracts

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

1 hour ago, nick76 said:

He’s done pretty poor so far. After the initial bounce he’s averaged 1 ppg and knocked out the cup.  Even with this squad that’s the bottom end of what he should get without being fired.

 

His PPG is 1.29 , which would average out to 49 points over a 38 game season.

There are MANY mitigating factors being discounted here as well.

We are something like 10th in the League since he has come in.

[Keyblade]

5 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Thats actually not true as Gerrard is a manager designed for instant success, its going straight for instant success and failing that is one of the problems with hiring him in the first place. People were happy with how the club was naturally evolving without bringing in big names on huge contracts

This is honestly a good point. Something seems to have shifted with the club.

As I've probably said a hundred times in this thread, most of this isn't even directed at Gerrard, but at the club. Seems like its heading into shaky territory. But of course people seem so sensitive about him for some reason. Is it because he's a big name or something?

[Zero7]

9 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Thats actually not true as Gerrard is a manager designed for instant success, its going straight for instant success and failing that is one of the problems with hiring him in the first place. People were happy with how the club was naturally evolving without bringing in big names on huge contracts

Couldn't disagree more with what you are saying, so I'll leave it there. 

[nick76]

1 minute ago, useless said:

Protesting against the appointment of McLeish wasn't irrational, it was perfectly normal considering he'd just relegated our local rivals, one of the strangest managerial appointments ever. But once he was appointed there was actually that much hatred towards him.

So questioning the hiring is irrational? , questioning the results of Gerrard is irrational? Questioning his tactics, systems, having favourites, subs, lack of drive in the team, conceding silly goals, not able to create chances or scoring despite the talent we have is irrational?  Hiring Gerrard for me was bizarre, a rookie manager and based on his players name than his managerial resume.  It was a massive risk and the reservations are being validated and thus questioned. You think it is irrational to question him but just as McLeish was questioned, so is Gerrard.  I’m not comparing them as managers but just as it was rational to question McLeish hiring and subsequent poor results, the same is for Gerrard.  It doesn’t mean we want Gerrard sacked at all but the worry about hiring him is not being alleviated by the last six months of results, performances or coaching.

[Keyblade]

Just now, useless said:

People clearly aren't reading what I wrote, I said Gerrard is getting more Irrational hatred thanMcLeish

Again McLeish was disliked because he'd just relegated our local rivals, so of course people would dislike that appointment, he then didn't do very well as our manager, so again people wouldn't like him as our manager, nothing irrational about that, people weren't going out of their way to try and twist everything related to him into a negative because they didn't need to, that's the difference between the hatred Gerrard is getting and whatever hatred McLeish got.

Basically one you agreed with and one you don't, got it. 

Another key difference is the word hate. I think there's maybe what, 2 people on here who seem like they actively hate on him. Everyone else is just commenting on what they see. It's not all exactly sunshine and roses at VP is it? 1 point out of the last 15 available. People are naturally going to discuss negatives. That doesn't mean it's hate. 

[useless]

Gerrard had just won the league with Rangers after going a season unbeaten with them, and when he took over them they were in a bad state, so it wasn't like taking over Rangers as they've been historically known, he had to rebuild them and help end Celtic's ten year domiance, also he'd done well with them in Europe. So appointing Gerrard was nothing whatsoever like appointing McLeish.

Ironically comparing the Gerrard appointent to appointing McLeish is another example of the irrationality that some are coming out with.

[nick76]

13 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

His PPG is 1.29 , which would average out to 49 points over a 38 game season.

There are MANY mitigating factors being discounted here as well.

We are something like 10th in the League since he has come in.

Again as I said before he’s on 1 ppg in 2022. Has 15 points in 15 games and also knocked out the cup.  I think it’s disingenuous including the new managerial bounce and all the initial fanfare of Stevie G, the media daring coming back to the PL. when things got back to normal and based on current form we are 1 ppg and inconsistent leaning towards mainly poor.

There are always mitigating factors for anything as Smith found out didn’t count when he got the sack despite all the mitigating factors he had.

[nick76]

3 minutes ago, useless said:

Gerrard had just won the league with Rangers after going a season unbeaten with them, and when he took over them they were in a bad state, so it wasn't like taking over Rangers as they've been historically known, he had to rebuild them and help end Celtic's ten year domiance, also he'd done well with them in Europe. So appointing Gerrard was nothing whatsoever like appointing McLeish.

Ironically comparing the Gerrard appointent to appointing McLeish is another example of the irrationality that some are coming out with.

In your opinion.  

What Gerrard did in Scotland in a two team league while impressive up there and his short managerial career did not warrant enough to be considered for the Villa role.  No way would Gerrard ever been considered had it not been for Purslow.  

When new managers were being discussed by some end of last season, throughout the summer and start of this season I do not ever remember Gerrard being mentioned and when the rumours started most of us laughed them of as just clickbait links because of Purslow.  

It was not a rational hiring but we have accepted it, trying to support it and trying to defend it because of that Rangers title and grabbing at straws while knowing the hiring was only because of Purslow.  

I’m guessing Newcastle fans aren’t gutted missing out on Gerrard.  

We are behind him at games but it’s not irrational to come on here and question so many worrying things we are seeing at the moment. 

[nick76]

2 minutes ago, useless said:

When judging Gerrard's time with us and conviently ignorin his four or five games and calling it 'bounce', is another example of some of some being irrational. 

How? As I’ve shown before in stats it’s a well known and proven thing having a managerial bounce.  If you don’t like that then talking about calendar year form is a thing and 2022 for Gerrard is 1 ppg over 15 games.  Smith was judged on his 2021 2nd half of the season form.  I think it’s disingenuous including his first lot of games because you know it’s only inflating his numbers.  It’s also not irrational focusing on recent form and 15 games is a reasonable set of data.  It’s not irrational it’s questioning data.

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

20 minutes ago, nick76 said:

Again as I said before he’s on 1 ppg in 2022. Has 15 points in 15 games and also knocked out the cup.  I think it’s disingenuous including the new managerial bounce and all the initial fanfare of Stevie G, the media daring coming back to the PL. when things got back to normal and based on current form we are 1 ppg and inconsistent leaning towards mainly poor.

There are always mitigating factors for anything as Smith found out didn’t count when he got the sack despite all the mitigating factors he had.

How about the largest mitigating factor?

Like letting the man even have 2 /3rds of a season, before declarations.

So now, the points during the " new manager bounce " don't count hey? Is there a scientific calculation for exactly how long or short " new manager bounce " is?

When we won 3 in a row a month or so ago, was that a little " new manager bounce " spurt as well?

I realise the evaluation criteria is constantly evolving so I need answers to these questions.

If we beat Norwich and Burnley, then  draw with Palace and lost to Liverpool, can we then say " He's averaged 1 point in the middle of May " since " beating a poor Norwich and Burnley "? Lol

If anything, discounting all the drawbacks, he has been " Average ", not " poor " IMO.

Dean Smith had 3 years, and wasn't sacked based on just this seasons start, get over it ffs 

I give up. Yet keep falling into this groundhog Day trap.

Edited April 25, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[nick76]

11 minutes ago, useless said:

People have literally called Gerrard a 'scumbag' on here and said they can't support the club if he's appointed. And also people have posted things that just aren't true, so no when I say some of it's irrational it's not just things I disagree with, people are posting over the top negative nonsense with regards to Gerrard, and as i've said previsously I'm not even sure why people need to twist everything into a negative, because there are actual negative things that they could use.

But you are generalising one or two extreme people with the rest of us.  Don’t bag all of us in with those comments.

[Keyblade]

3 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

How about the largest mitigating factor?

Like letting the man even have 2 /3rds of a season, before declarations.

So now, the points after the " new manager bounce " don't count hey? Is there a scientific calculation for exactly how long or short " new manager bounce " is?

When we won 3 in a row a month or so ago, was that a little " new manager bounce " spurt as well?

I realise the evaluation criteria is constantly evolving so I need answers to these questions.

If we beat Norwich and Burnley, then  draw with Palace and lost to Liverpool, can we then say " He's averaged 1 point in the middle of May " since " beating a poor Norwich and Burnley "? Lol

If anything, discounting all the drawbacks, he has been " Average ", not " poor " IMO.

Deja Smith had 3 years, get over it ffs 

I give up. Yet keep falling into this groundhog Day trap.

What declarations are people making though? That things aren't so good right now? We're playing shit football? I don't see what's so irrational about this.

Or do you mean things like he should be sacked or he's shit etc? I'm seeing very few of the latter. There's always going to be some of those.

[nick76]

1 minute ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Like letting the man even have 2 /3rds of a season, before declarations.

Have I made a declaration? I’ve just questioned many things

2 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

So now, the points after the " new manager bounce " don't count hey? Is there a scientific calculation for exactly how long or short " new manager bounce " is?

It’s a good question. I just use that because after that sixth game I felt something change, that buzz in the team, that drive, that fight, faded and been very mixed since.

5 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

When we won 3 in a row a month or so ago, was that a little " new manager bounce " spurt as well?

Where did that run come from and where did it go.  As I say it been mixed since that initial run

6 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

I realise the evaluation criteria is constantly evolving so I need answers to these questions.

As you will see from my history I will always give my honest opinion and will say when I’m right and have been wrong.  If you are happy at the moment then fair enough, I am expressing my worry.

9 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

If we beat Norwich and Burnley, then  draw with Palace and lost to Liverpool, can we then say " He's averaged 1 point in the middle of May " since " beating a poor Norwich and Burnley "? Lol

Weird what you think is funny

10 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

If anything, discounting all the drawbacks, he has been " Average ", not " poor " IMO.

Fair enough, that’s your view.  I think he’s been poor and I think that’s being generous.

12 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Smith had 3 years, get over it ffs

Ok, not sure what this is about when I have been responding to people talking about him.

13 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

I give up.

I’m just getting started

15 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Yet keep falling into this groundhog Day trap.

It’s a Villa forum, this is going to happen for the rest of your life, just the topics will change over time.  Expecting something different, you are fooling yourself.  The life of a football fan. 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

11 minutes ago, Keyblade said:

What declarations are people making though? That things aren't so good right now? We're playing shit football? I don't see what's so irrational about this.

Or do you mean things like he should be sacked or he's shit etc? I'm seeing very few of the latter. There's always going to be some of those.

There have been loads of declarations, surely you can't be serious?

I've seen our Impending doom and financial " iimplosion " due to " signing a load of old players on massive salaries " spelt out multiple times.

I've seen how he is single handedley going to destroy the squad and leave any future manager and the club in a deep hole.

I've seen predictions about what is going to happen to us when we've inevitably sacked him too late.

I've seen how embarassing it's going to be for us to finish 16th this season and much more.

I've seen straight up untruths, personal digs and the most petty and bizarre criticisms.

Alot of purposely skewed narratives and stats to paint misleading pictures for effect, and much more.

Are you reading the same message board?

Do you think some people would be so would up if this wasn't the case? Alot of it is cringeworthy.

 

Edited April 25, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

Just saw him on a Hyundai World Cup advertisement on CNN ( Not Bein Sports sorry ) in Football kit.

Wtf?!

Edited April 25, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[VillaParkAvenue]

10 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Just saw him on a Hyundai World Cup advertisement on CNN ( Not Bein Sports sorry ) in Football kit.

Wtf?!

Gerrard is the frontman for a huge new Hyundai campaign that’s supposed to run from now and through the World Cup.

https://www.carmudi.com.ph/journal/watch-hyundai-launches-goal-of-the-century-campaign-with-steven-gerrard-bts/?amp=1

[Tomaszk]

Didn't consider Poch at all.

We should be right in there if he's interested. Having £200m to spend is a pull to plenty of managers.

I'd love to sack Gerrard tomorrow if it meant Poch came in.

[sharkyvilla]

13 minutes ago, Tomaszk said:

Didn't consider Poch at all.

We should be right in there if he's interested. Having £200m to spend is a pull to plenty of managers.

I'd love to sack Gerrard tomorrow if it meant Poch came in.

Can't see it sadly, even if we had held off the trigger on Dean and waited for the summer to make the next level appointment I doubt it would have happened.  Gerrard is definitely not going anywhere now he is in place.  For all my worries about him and why he was recruited we would be a laughing stock for sacking him this early.

[useless]

I don't want us to sack Gerrard and we would be heavily criticized if we did sack him, not just by media people, but football fans in general would be bemused, our squad isn't good enough that we have the right to sack a manger just because they haven't shown better than midtable form over twenty one games.

That said, if he was sacked so we could replace him with Pochettino then that would put a completely different perception on it, would be like when Tottenham fired Nuno and replaced him with Conte, have to remember that players and managers will leave us when better offers come their way to further their career, so from time to time we can do the same to them to further our progress.

But as it stands changing manager is probably the last thing on our mind, only thing that would possibly change that is if we were to say pick up just a few more points between now and the end of the season, which I don't think will happen.