Zatman Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 Thought he looked weak defensively but was comfortable bringing the ball into midfield. His ball carrying was good though choice of pass not the best But this will improve, Unai didnt play hin because he thought he was shit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMelvillan Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 For the goal, he probably dived in because he had the insurance of Barkley being behind him to cover the player if he has missed his tackle. Unfortunately Barkley didn't get the memo and did eff all to help, even when the danger was apparent he didn't break out of a jog Really disappointing from the much more experienced player, who otherwise looked excellent when he came on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 1 minute ago, TheMelvillan said: For the goal, he probably dived in because he had the insurance of Barkley being behind him to cover the player if he has missed his tackle. Unfortunately Barkley didn't get the memo and did eff all to help, even when the danger was apparent he didn't break out of a jog Really disappointing from the much more experienced player, who otherwise looked excellent when he came on It’s the other way around. Barkley was there to cover the player cutting back inside. This should have meant Bogarde was free to shepherd the attacker down to a dead end at the byline. Unfortunately Bogarde showed a bit of inexperience by diving in and leaving himself exposed. Fortunately it didn’t cost us points in the end and he’ll learn a lot from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 (edited) 11 hours ago, rodders0223 said: Another thread to close down because you can't say when players played crap anymore. We also need to keep thanking Hause, Chamberlinho and the likes for helping us to the top 4 Their is a fair bit of a difference in saying a player played crap, and saying he’s no future at the club after one game Edited September 1 by duke313 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Steve Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 8 hours ago, El Segundo said: Bogarde played fine until he got skinned for the goal. That seemed to rattle him and he went downhill after that. Not perfect but not a disaster either. I think fatigue was a major factor too at that point. He will get better and stepped up yesterday in a position he doesn’t normally play in. There’s a lot to look forward to with Bogarde and we will soon see why Unai got him a new deal. This performance won’t define him nor will criticism. It’s just a shame that there’s a minority of posters who don’t provide such nuances like yours and just want to tear a kid down on his league debut. Part of being a supporter is still being that - being critical and positive in ways that don’t give up on someone because of moments they thought were bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyp102 Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 1 hour ago, foreveryoung said: Chucking him in the deep end is not working. We won Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 21 minutes ago, mikeyp102 said: We won Ohhh, he must be absolute quality then???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyp102 Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 1 minute ago, foreveryoung said: Ohhh, he must be absolute quality then???? Have I said that? But it’s clearly not a failure. That would be if he caused us to lose. You’re writing a player off saying it’s a failure, when it’s clearly not. Stop with the hyperbole. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 18 minutes ago, mikeyp102 said: Have I said that? But it’s clearly not a failure. That would be if he caused us to lose. You’re writing a player off saying it’s a failure, when it’s clearly not. Stop with the hyperbole. It's not hyperbole. I watched the game. If he continues this form, he will be the weak link. An to be honest, I saw no flashes of quality, which makes me think he ain't gonna make it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 14 hours ago, foreveryoung said: My person opinion. We are a champions league team, he ain't no where near this level. An I doubt he ever will be. Don't make me snap on The Day Of The Sabbath Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 1 minute ago, Kingman said: Don't make me snap on The Day Of The Sabbath Give me something then please. He's obvious just cover until we get players back anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 7 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: Give me something then please. He's obvious just cover until we get players back anyway. How about a £20 bet to VT at the end of the season that he wins the young player of the season award (Obviously Rodgers excluded if he falls into that category) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 I thought he was fairly ok, given the occasion and his age. He showed some rawness at times, like the diving in, which allowed the cross that led to their goal. I think he's more suited to the centre - half position considering his physical attributes. I'm inclined to think he has a future in the top tiers of football, wether that's with us, remains to be seen. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 (edited) 36 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: Give me something then please. He's obvious just cover until we get players back anyway. Ugo was shit on his debut. Ramsey was described as 'dog-shit' on these very pages when he broke through. Grealish had people saying he wouldn't make it. Young players improve with experience generally. Their performance on debut is not their absolute ceiling as a player. Players can improve..Look at Morgan Rogers. Konsa has improved immeasurably in his time here. They're generally not the finished article on day one. Give you something? How about our excellent manager with a history of winning things, has seen something in Bogarde and therefore rejected bids and integrated him into the first team, and played him ahead of an excellent young prospect at right back. He may end up not being our right back for years to come, but he deserves more than one game before being written off. Edited September 1 by Xela 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 (edited) 3 hours ago, Made In Aston said: I'm surprised Bogarde is coming in for any criticism at all. He is a young lad, making his debut, in a position that he doesn't normally play in. The fact that he didn't look out of his depth is the main thing and is really promising. Focusing on one error seems ridiculously harsh Everything is either brilliant or shit to some fans. If its shit then just buy a replacement, as transfers are the most important part of supporting the team now. Edited September 1 by Xela 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 14 hours ago, allani said: There's a difference between saying that a player struggled but understanding the reason why and effectively saying he's **** and should never play for the club again. I've had a very enjoyable discussion on today's match with @TRO where he was more nervy than I was about us coming away with 3 points. That's fine. I enjoy that kind of debate and discussion and finding out how other people have seen things slightly differently. However, there have been a lot of completely bizarre and OTT responses on numerous threads where the only possible intent seems to be to cause a reaction from others. I thought Bogarde did OK - he wasn't brilliant, he wasn't awful. He did a few good things, he did a few not so good things and he did a lot of things that he can look back at and learn from. Expecting him to come in and play as well as a seasoned international is completely unreasonable. I too enjoy a sensible and respectful discussion, even if folks don't always agree on everything. I for my sins, do study the defensive side of the game a bit more than the offensive side, maybe because I was a defender when playing in my youth.....I also was taken by the approach of the 80/81/82 side, where they were very hard to breach. I love attacking football, like the next man, and I can't describe that headed goal, without purring......but my take is, good, defensive play, wins titles, That is not ignoring the fact that good offensive play is imperative too. I am not a fan of we score one, you score one, and see who score most....entertaining for some, not for me. I want to give teams "not a flea to breed off" That is idealism, I get that, but getting close is the aim. On that note, its inevitable folk will see things differently, but I respect that too. I thought for a Debut, the lad did well, slipped up a couple of times, but so do seasoned pro's....I was quietly impressed, before he ran out of fuel. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macandally Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 8 hours ago, ozvilla28 said: First game.Will be better for the run and experience. That goal could have been avoided before it got to Bogarde in previous passages of play by the way. For me there was a foul on Duran for a high foot that Coote didn’t give (again random refereeing with no consistency) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 5 minutes ago, Xela said: Ugo was shit on his debut. Ramsey was described as 'dog-shit' on these very pages when he broke through. Grealish had people saying he wouldn't make it. Young players improve with experience generally. Their performance on debut is not their absolute ceiling as a player. Players can improve..Look at Morgan Rogers. Konsa has improved immeasurably in his time here. They're generally not the finished article on day one. Give you something? How about our excellent manager with a history of winning things, has been something in Bogarde and therefore rejected bids and integrated him into the first team, and played him ahead of an excellent young prospect at right back. He may end up not being our right back for years to come, but he deserves more than one game before being written off. These were the days when we wasn't fighting for real success. When we could afford to bleed the youngsters, cause we had no one else. When midtable was seen as a great season. I trust in Unai 100%. Which is why I know, he is just being played, while we wait for the likes of Kamara to get fit. As I said, you saw flashes in Grealish, Ramsey and the like. Looking at his Instagram, I think he maybe one of these players who loves the lifestyle more than the game. But I'm more than happy to be proved wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 10 hours ago, El Segundo said: Bogarde played fine until he got skinned for the goal. That seemed to rattle him and he went downhill after that. Not perfect but not a disaster either. Strong disagree. He struggled. 3 hours ago, Made In Aston said: I'm surprised Bogarde is coming in for any criticism at all. He is a young lad, making his debut, in a position that he doesn't normally play in. The fact that he didn't look out of his depth is the main thing and is really promising. Focusing on one error seems ridiculously harsh. I think he looked out of his depth throughout. No huge drama, value experience etc etc. He didn't play well though. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Townsend Posted September 1 Share Posted September 1 (edited) 1 hour ago, foreveryoung said: It's not hyperbole. I watched the game. If he continues this form, he will be the weak link. An to be honest, I saw no flashes of quality, which makes me think he ain't gonna make it. Isn't Ugo Ehiogu's debut notorious for being absolutely awful? Yet he went on to be one of our best centre backs of the Premier league era? Edited September 1 by Captain_Townsend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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