mikeyp102 Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 (edited) I wonder how much we have offered. Anything above £25k a week and I think we’d be setting ourselves up to fail. How CC should look at it, is sign a contract, play games prove your worth then ask for more. If he had a good season he could easily then ask and be probably be granted 70-100% increase. (Just random numbers I’ve picked out, just to illustrate the point) Edited July 14, 2022 by mikeyp102 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichiBoi11 Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 (edited) 12 minutes ago, mikeyp102 said: I wonder how much we have offered. Anything above £25k a week and I think we’d be setting ourselves up to fail. How CC should look at it, is sign a contract, play games prove your worth then ask for more. If he had a good season he could easily then ask and be probably be granted 70-100% increase. (Just random numbers I’ve picked out, just to illustrate the point) Which is exactly what Ramsey did. He signed a new deal, cemented himself in the first team and was given an improved contract a year later. Edited July 14, 2022 by RichiBoi11 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 1 minute ago, RichiBoi11 said: Which is exactly what Ramsey did. He signed a new deal, cemetned himself in the first team and was given an improved contract a year later. Quite a few of our players have done that to be fair. The ones on high wages from the start are the established players. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichiBoi11 Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 4 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Quite a few of our players have done that to be fair. The ones on high wages from the start are the established players. Yep. Which makes the supposed demands from Carney's agent even more ludicrous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 5 minutes ago, duke313 said: I've not heard this TBH, if it's true he shouldn't even have been promoted to the first team and should have been shipped out on loan or sold. Well it seems the contract offer made back in October was turned down by Carney and his representatives. Under the proviso he wanted to see what game time he would be getting. Now he's had good game time and won the u21s the contract situation is revisited. His team now want double (or thereabouts as is filtering through now) the offer the club made in October. The club deem this ridiculous. I assume that double the offer would put Carney on or above what McGinn and Watkins are currently on and more than JJ. This is clearly a ridiculous salary demand. One a proper agent wouldn't be asking for knowing it's ridiculous. The club are holding firm on the original offer (and tbh will likely budge by 20% I assume). But when faced with absurd demands there isn't room for negotiation. The only option left to Villa is bring the situation to a head. I imagine we will let things sit for a few days or a week and give a final contract offer if rejected he should find a new club to bid for him (we would set the price) and he will train on his own until his move is settled either this summer or at expiration of his contract. It's 100% the right way to proceed from the clubs position. We also will never give a young player any Premier League minutes until they have signed their longer terms contracts (as recently evidenced by Tim signing a new contract and then playing two games shortly after). 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villabromsgrove Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 Does anyone know the name of CC's agent? I may have missed it but we tend to refer to this anonymous individual without identifying him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 1 minute ago, villabromsgrove said: Does anyone know the name of CC's agent? I may have missed it but we tend to refer to this anonymous individual without identifying him. I assumed it was his Dad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 57 minutes ago, joshharris12 said: He’s gone Not to Australia, he hasn't 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 8 minutes ago, CVByrne said: Well it seems the contract offer made back in October was turned down by Carney and his representatives. Under the proviso he wanted to see what game time he would be getting. Now he's had good game time and won the u21s the contract situation is revisited. His team now want double (or thereabouts as is filtering through now) the offer the club made in October. The club deem this ridiculous. I assume that double the offer would put Carney on or above what McGinn and Watkins are currently on and more than JJ. This is clearly a ridiculous salary demand. One a proper agent wouldn't be asking for knowing it's ridiculous. The club are holding firm on the original offer (and tbh will likely budge by 20% I assume). But when faced with absurd demands there isn't room for negotiation. The only option left to Villa is bring the situation to a head. I imagine we will let things sit for a few days or a week and give a final contract offer if rejected he should find a new club to bid for him (we would set the price) and he will train on his own until his move is settled either this summer or at expiration of his contract. It's 100% the right way to proceed from the clubs position. We also will never give a young player any Premier League minutes until they have signed their longer terms contracts (as recently evidenced by Tim signing a new contract and then playing two games shortly after). That seems like the most likely scenario. The club have put their foot down, so it's decision time for Chuk, no more negotiating. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 (edited) On 13/07/2022 at 20:25, hippo said: If Carney thought he was getting starts anytime soon I'm sure he would have signed up . Has his play, deserved any starts, when has been given minutes? You have to earn a shirt. despite all the platitudes and back slapping, where is the evidence, that he deserves a start?.......in place of who? his whole journey,so far, has been potential...... I see no sound reason,(when in search of points) to play him, in place of someone else. He has to force his way in.......and he doesn't. Edited July 14, 2022 by TRO 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 13 minutes ago, CVByrne said: Well it seems the contract offer made back in October was turned down by Carney and his representatives. Under the proviso he wanted to see what game time he would be getting. Now he's had good game time and won the u21s the contract situation is revisited. His team now want double (or thereabouts as is filtering through now) the offer the club made in October. The club deem this ridiculous. I assume that double the offer would put Carney on or above what McGinn and Watkins are currently on and more than JJ. This is clearly a ridiculous salary demand. One a proper agent wouldn't be asking for knowing it's ridiculous. The club are holding firm on the original offer (and tbh will likely budge by 20% I assume). But when faced with absurd demands there isn't room for negotiation. The only option left to Villa is bring the situation to a head. I imagine we will let things sit for a few days or a week and give a final contract offer if rejected he should find a new club to bid for him (we would set the price) and he will train on his own until his move is settled either this summer or at expiration of his contract. It's 100% the right way to proceed from the clubs position. We also will never give a young player any Premier League minutes until they have signed their longer terms contracts (as recently evidenced by Tim signing a new contract and then playing two games shortly after). surely, if CC backs his own talent, he could write his own salary in time. If all the predictions are right about his projected development, he has nothing to worry about. but that isn't the case, is it?......It seems, He wants the club to stomp up a huge salary and give him playing time based on what exactly? It seems he wants the club to take ALL the risk, and him take none. Best of luck, to him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 33 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said: How are people still debating whether it's about money or not, when people who would know more than us, have straight up come out and said it IS about money, over the last few days? Lol Apparently we made him a great offer, and he wants it doubled. I have no " vitriol" at all towards the kid, but I'm also tired of all the hyperbole and being held over a barrel for a kid who thinks he's already Paul Pogba and hyped by some fans as such. We need to just get the best money we can for him, or he can continue to boss it against 16, 17 and 18 year olds at his level. We have other players and youngsters who want to be here, we can concentrate on. Also, a crucial thing which others have pointed out, is his agent coming out a year and a half ago and said he WILL NOT be signing a contract, so they've stayed true to their word. There is absolutely nothing wrong with Villa fans siding with the club on this. Why wouldn't you side with the club, after all, that's who you support. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 6 minutes ago, TRO said: Has his play, deserved any starts, when has been given minutes? You have to earn a shirt. despite all the platitudes and back slapping, where is the evidence, that he deserves a start?.......in place of who? his whole journey,so far, has been potential...... I see no sound reason, in search of points to play him, in place of someone else. He has to force his way in.......and he doesn't. He was average against Burnley. A few nice passes but really didn't get on the ball enough and dictate against a relegated prem team. That was his chance to show he's ready to play 10-15 prem games next season from start and no chance he showed enough. Guess it's only a deluded contract thought though if no one else would pay what he wants. I assume his agent has been putting feelers out to Bundesliga clubs and some have said they'll pay him close to what he wants from us. Gerrard had it right at the start, giving him 15-20 minute cameos in second half games, Man. City at home is good example where he did make an impact but he simply isn't ready to be starting a third of our prem games yet. In ideal world loan him out to top end championship club but won't happen with contract impasse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 47 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said: How are people still debating whether it's about money or not, when people who would know more than us, have straight up come out and said it IS about money, over the last few days? Lol Apparently we made him a great offer, and he wants it doubled. Apparently is the big word Also the leaks are coming from Villa people who are obviously getting fed by the club 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichiBoi11 Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 10 minutes ago, VillaChris said: He was average against Burnley. A few nice passes but really didn't get on the ball enough and dictate against a relegated prem team. That was his chance to show he's ready to play 10-15 prem games next season from start and no chance he showed enough. Guess it's only a deluded contract thought though if no one else would pay what he wants. I assume his agent has been putting feelers out to Bundesliga clubs and some have said they'll pay him close to what he wants from us. Gerrard had it right at the start, giving him 15-20 minute cameos in second half games, Man. City at home is good example where he did make an impact but he simply isn't ready to be starting a third of our prem games yet. In ideal world loan him out to top end championship club but won't happen with contract impasse. A loan next season and a full year in the championship would be the making of him to be honest, but I think he believes he can skip that step, and obviously a loan won't happen without a new contract, so he's kind of shot himself in the foot unless he gets move this summer, and even then there's no guarantee he will play. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rustibrooks Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 33 minutes ago, villabromsgrove said: Does anyone know the name of CC's agent? I may have missed it but we tend to refer to this anonymous individual without identifying him. Possibly his dad or someone from his church. Not to cause any offence to anyone that is religious, but churches and money never ever mix well. So with everything we know it sounds like they could be using him as a way to get money for themselves. (just an assumption) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 18 minutes ago, TRO said: surely, if CC backs his own talent, he could write his own salary in time. If all the predictions are right about his projected development, he has nothing to worry about. but that isn't the case, is it?......It seems, He wants the club to stomp up a huge salary and give him playing time based on what exactly? It seems he wants the club to take ALL the risk, and him take none. Best of luck, to him. I assume an outsized say is coming from who is representing him right now. They will be in line for usually 10-15% of the total contract value. As they aren't proper representation from a professional they don't have multiple clients and thus multiple income streams. This is the only opportunity they will get to make a big chunk of money off Carney. So the normal way is agents know with young players there are improved contract offers than come with improved on pitch performances as the player gets more salary and the club protects their investment. That's why a contract when a player turns 18 isn't that important and the agent would advise the player as much. The people representing Carney likely know they will only get one chance at a cut of money from Carney as he will get professional agents sooner or later as he himself grows up and gets talking to his teammates and friends etc. So to these people (his Dad or his Church or family friend or whoever) the size of the contract he signs now is absolutely critical to their own interests. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 4 minutes ago, Rustibrooks said: Possibly his dad or someone from his church. Not to cause any offence to anyone that is religious, but churches and money never ever mix well. So with everything we know it sounds like they could be using him as a way to get money for themselves. (just an assumption) That seems the most logical conclusion. The club are used to dealing with professionals. I would imagine there is zero dialogue directly with Carney on this just his representation as it's cleaner way to do business and not impact a player mentally. Now we've unfortunately had to drag Carney himself into this as his representation are harming him and he needs to now get involved. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 20 minutes ago, Zatman said: Apparently is the big word Also the leaks are coming from Villa people who are obviously getting fed by the club It would seem so, allowing word to slip out about why there is an impasse is an important part of the pressure to be put on Carney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 11 minutes ago, Rustibrooks said: Possibly his dad or someone from his church. Not to cause any offence to anyone that is religious, but churches and money never ever mix well. So with everything we know it sounds like they could be using him as a way to get money for themselves. (just an assumption) Strange thing is his brother has an agent and not represented by church or family member Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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