Cameron Archer

[Dillon66]

1 hour ago, Adam2003 said:

I agree with you that I have some concerns about how young players could end up being used - but not in this situation. He had the dream situation! Got a move to a PL club, could have scored the goals to keep them up. Didn’t - not his fault, but worth saying - and now instead of relegation is back at a CL club and can either compete here or will get a move to another PL club. Without the buyback he’d be in a Championship squad now - and I don’t think he’ll end up in one next season. 

I wouldnt call getting bumped out of your home town club to go and play for one of the worst teams ever seen in the in Premier League a 'dream situation'. Basically spent the first 3 or 4 months living off scraps, had an injury then when fit, dinosaur Wilder hardly played him as he knew he wouldn't be keeping him. When you see the likes of McBurnie and Brewster getting minutes in front of you, I'd say that was more of a nightmare than a dream.

In the right team, Archer will score goals, even at Premier League level - he's a natural finisher.

[Adam2003]

48 minutes ago, Dillon66 said:

I wouldnt call getting bumped out of your home town club to go and play for one of the worst teams ever seen in the in Premier League a 'dream situation'. Basically spent the first 3 or 4 months living off scraps, had an injury then when fit, dinosaur Wilder hardly played him as he knew he wouldn't be keeping him. When you see the likes of McBurnie and Brewster getting minutes in front of you, I'd say that was more of a nightmare than a dream.

In the right team, Archer will score goals, even at Premier League level - he's a natural finisher.

Fairly obviously the dream situation I meant is the fact he got a shot at establishing himself as the main man at a new PL club then an automatic return to a CL club after it all went wrong there, not the season playing for a team that turned out to be dreadful.

And I agree with you, I think he has huge potential and hope we keep him around. But I don’t think Emery thinks the same sadly.

[rodders0223]

Archer one of the first players to be shown at the club that they don't actually give two shits about your career or development once you've got a decent value. We're making bank at the minute but it's diminishing returns. If my son was in an academy and I jest about retiring early and that, but I'd actually care about his career and his game and his enjoyment, I'd absolutely not advise him to go to Villa. You're not going to play and will be sold to anywhere the first decent bid that comes in.

[CarryOnVilla]

1 minute ago, rodders0223 said:

Archer one of the first players to be shown at the club that they don't actually give two shits about your career or development once you've got a decent value. We're making bank at the minute but it's diminishing returns. If my son was in an academy and I jest about retiring early and that, but I'd actually care about his career and his game and his enjoyment, I'd absolutely not advise him to go to Villa. You're not going to play and will be sold to anywhere the first decent bid that comes in.

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

2 minutes ago, rodders0223 said:

Archer one of the first players to be shown at the club that they don't actually give two shits about your career or development once you've got a decent value. We're making bank at the minute but it's diminishing returns. If my son was in an academy and I jest about retiring early and that, but I'd actually care about his career and his game and his enjoyment, I'd absolutely not advise him to go to Villa. You're not going to play and will be sold to anywhere the first decent bid that comes in.

Who are you dropping to give Archer game time then?

[MaVilla]

9 minutes ago, rodders0223 said:

Archer one of the first players to be shown at the club that they don't actually give two shits about your career or development once you've got a decent value. We're making bank at the minute but it's diminishing returns. If my son was in an academy and I jest about retiring early and that, but I'd actually care about his career and his game and his enjoyment, I'd absolutely not advise him to go to Villa. You're not going to play and will be sold to anywhere the first decent bid that comes in.

not sure if serious....

The fact is, Academies are like schools, 99% of players in elite academies wont make it at the club, but what they do get is elite coaching, good development opportunities via loans, support, the best input in to developing their skills, experience within an elite setup, and a very good chance to go on and have a good career if they do well.

To say a player shouldnt come to Villa for the reasons you state doesnt make sense, yes, they might do well elsewhere, developing in the champ, league 1 or 2 etc, but a well run and elite academy gives players a very good base to develop, and if they dont make it at the club, they have basically got a free period of time at that elite academy, to prepare them as best as possible for their career.

I understand people idealistically want loads of youth players to come through to the first team, but even 1 youth player coming through every couple of years is a success tbh, the other 99% just dont make it, that doesnt mean they didnt benefit from the experience though (if it is a good academy).

[Demitri_C]

18 minutes ago, rodders0223 said:

Archer one of the first players to be shown at the club that they don't actually give two shits about your career or development once you've got a decent value. We're making bank at the minute but it's diminishing returns. If my son was in an academy and I jest about retiring early and that, but I'd actually care about his career and his game and his enjoyment, I'd absolutely not advise him to go to Villa. You're not going to play and will be sold to anywhere the first decent bid that comes in.

Easy to say that from a outside view if you son was offered guranteed a mpve to stockport county where he will play more or be part of villa academy you are going villa every time

[Dillon66]

A good few years back, the son of a friend of mine was at the Villa academy (at that time was callled School of Excellence) and I recall a conversation we had with Bryan Jones who was in charge af that time. His take was that the academy/SOE had three main aims ;

1. To give the boys a structured environment in which they learn, not just how to be good footballers, but good people too.

2. To train and coach the boys to a level, where hopefully, they progress to be able to earn a living out of the game.

3. If conditions 1 and 2 are met, to be good enough characters and footballers, to be able to represent Aston Villa Football Club.

That resonated with me and gave me hope that these academies aren't just meat factories - even if times have changed.

Hopefully, Cam can get going in a Villa shirt next season, but if he doesn't, he'll have had the right grounding to be a success elsewhere.

Edited Saturday at 13:18 by Dillon66

[Pongo Waring]

1 hour ago, rodders0223 said:

Archer one of the first players to be shown at the club that they don't actually give two shits about your career or development once you've got a decent value. We're making bank at the minute but it's diminishing returns. If my son was in an academy and I jest about retiring early and that, but I'd actually care about his career and his game and his enjoyment, I'd absolutely not advise him to go to Villa. You're not going to play and will be sold to anywhere the first decent bid that comes in.

Archer will become a millionaire Yet daddy Rodders is unhappy. 

[thabucks]

He isn’t good enough for where we are and aspire to stay,  so will be shipped out and have a good career hopefully somewhere else… Sooner the better for all 

[VillaChris]

Guessing this will be sorted out next week as he's got to return to pre season training somewhere.

As I've said bit awkward if we do all the signing announcement videos and interviews just to sell him a week later.

Or if it's a sort of back door signing (no acknowledgement at all other than he just returns to train with us) that will also be telling.

After the last few weeks a few journalists will be watching his situation with interest I suspect.

[Demitri_C]

6 minutes ago, VillaChris said:

Guessing this will be sorted out next week as he's got to return to pre season training somewhere.

As I've said bit awkward if we do all the signing announcement videos and interviews just to sell him a week later.

Or if it's a sort of back door signing (no acknowledgement at all other than he just returns to train with us) that will also be telling.

After the last few weeks a few journalists will be watching his situation with interest I suspect.

I think archer sale is being saved for next seasons accounts after july 1st

[OutByEaster?]

1 hour ago, rodders0223 said:

Archer one of the first players to be shown at the club that they don't actually give two shits about your career or development once you've got a decent value. We're making bank at the minute but it's diminishing returns. If my son was in an academy and I jest about retiring early and that, but I'd actually care about his career and his game and his enjoyment, I'd absolutely not advise him to go to Villa. You're not going to play and will be sold to anywhere the first decent bid that comes in.

I think if anything, Archer is a great example of the opposite.

When he failed in his season long loan at Solihull Borough, he returned to the club a player that would soon turn twenty years old and had struggled at National League level. An awful lot of academies release that player. Villa didn't - they kept faith with him and gave him a chance in the team in a couple of cup games where he rewarded their faith in him.

He's never quite been good enough for the first team, but the club have ensured that he's had good loans to teams where he'd play and ensured that his talent will bring him a career in the game at a good level - obviously that's a symbiotic relationship and the club will gain financially from those choices and his efforts, but the club deserve that for the decision to give him a second chance after his career was all but done in 2021 and he deserves credit for grabbing his second chance with both hands.

If I was a parent of a young talent, I'd be happy to put my boy into an academy that's willing to have the patience to give second chances.

[useless]

His return will probably just be a short confirmation statement on the official site and nothing more, like when a player returns from a loan

As for his career, I imagine he's thrilled with the way it's going, and will be happy to have made it not only as a professional, but also at an high level, he's essentially got what most academy players dream of, but most don't make it, when he was at Solihull probably wasn't expecting to be where he is now

If anythng the fact we can produce players good enough to be sold for big money is going to make the academy more attractive not the opposite

[sharkyvilla]

Personally I'd keep him. We could have him, Ramsey and one of the goalkeepers fill 3 of the homegrown spots for the CL, leaving us just one short.  I think he is capable of chipping in with goals too in the cups especially.

[Kuwabatake Sanjuro]

A loan to Vitoria Guimaraes might be an option either, let him score a shit load of goals Portugal and take things from there.

[DakotaVilla]

20 hours ago, rodders0223 said:

Archer one of the first players to be shown at the club that they don't actually give two shits about your career or development once you've got a decent value. We're making bank at the minute but it's diminishing returns. If my son was in an academy and I jest about retiring early and that, but I'd actually care about his career and his game and his enjoyment, I'd absolutely not advise him to go to Villa. You're not going to play and will be sold to anywhere the first decent bid that comes in.

Absolute and utter rubbish.

The Villa academy has actually shown that it’s a superb pathway to develop players and to get them playing at a very high level. Jack, Chucky, Aaron Ramsey, Jacob Ramsey, Timbo, Kellyman, Archer and the list goes on. Any parent would be a fool to not want their kids to come to the club considering that track record and the stability at the club. 
 

That should not be confused with the extremely high bar required to now play in our first time but rest assured if a young player is good enough Emery will give them an opportunity. 

 

[Delphinho123]

Feels like a player that will be used in a deal somewhere. 

[CVByrne]

5 minutes ago, Delphinho123 said:

Feels like a player that will be used in a deal somewhere. 

I think he'll just be allowed to find the best club for himself and his career as long as our valuation is met by the buying club. 

[CarryOnVilla]

If we end up keeping him, it at least give us an extra club trained player for CL registration.