OLDVILLAN Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 My Gawd...My Eyes ^^^ Info overload 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allani Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 40 minutes ago, picicata said: Well you've argued your points which is fair enough. Not sure many would agree with you though For what it's worth I'd like Gallagher as well as Luiz I did a FBref comparison with Gallagher when I was there and their stats seemed to intertwine quite well. Gallagher's defensive stats are much higher than both Luiz and McGinn but I still think we'd need a Kamara type player in there too. However, Kamara-Luiz-McGinn-Gallagher on paper would look like a pretty impressive midfield with strength in winning the ball back, controlling possession and then attacking the opposition. However, take Kamara out of the equation and we'd be pretty unbalanced again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 1 hour ago, OutByEaster? said: Doug is the player in the game that seems most difficult to find - he'd fit incredibly well into Arsenal's midfield - you want the attacking one, the defensive one and the one who can link everything together and set tempos, that's Doug. Rice/Odegaard/Luiz would be the best midfield in the league by a mile - it's interesting as well that it's the same problem that England have; Bellingham and Rice are desperate for a Luiz. He's as rare as hens teeth and there are teams like City that change shape to try to get over not being able to find one, there are veterans being given a higher status than they might expect because they have a little of it, the likes of Kovacic and Jorginho, both four or five years older and nowhere near Luiz - but getting games at top sides. There are very, very few players around who can do what he does - and those there are have been going for nine figures in this league - of those, Rice is better than him, but he's better than both of Chelsea's. A valuation of £40m is laughable for a player that Europes best midfields are crying out for - based on the market, he's a nine figure footballer. What worries me is if we cant get him to agree to a new contract this summer then thats the sort of fee we would get for him next summer with 12 months left on his contract. If he doesnt agree to a new contract this summer then we may be forced to take a 80m offer for him to help with FFP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveAV1 Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 1 hour ago, rodders0223 said: We don't have the aura of Gerrard now mind you. Is that what aura smells like? I’ll give a bottle of that a miss, if you don’t mind. Essence of Scouse plonker, is so last year now. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 2 hours ago, DaveAV1 said: That’s all true but our coaching staff and recruitment team his much better now than then. As are many other aspects that have improved dramatically since the appointment of Unai, who has been a key driver of the club both on and off the pitch and who still enjoys the backing of the owners who appointed him and support him massively. It’s almost as if Unai has turned the lights on for us to enable us to see where we should be going and how to get there. As long as he remains everything and anything positive is possible. Would you bet against us?? UTV!!!!!!!!!! All of that is true too but isn’t relevant to the point I was responding to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 2 hours ago, allani said: OK I tried really hard not to respond. However, the bit in bold sums up why your opinion is flawed. You see Luiz isn't a DM. That isn't his position. He's only playing that role because Kamara is out injured. I'm sure that we could find a better DM for £40m. I'm not getting into whether Luiz or McGinn are "better" because they are different types of players and impact games in different ways. However, the FBREF comparison is interesting nonetheless. I think they show quite clearly why Luiz is so important to us: he played 6 minutes less than McGinn in the PL last season but made over 800 more passes, progressed the ball 2000 meters further (passing), touched the ball over 800 times more (and more times in every part of the pitch except the opposition penalty area), he wins a higher percentage of tackles and has won almost three times as many aerial duels. I'm not cherry-picking stats here. Interestingly one stat that does stand out is that our PPM record with McGinn in the team was 1.83 and for Luiz is lower at 1.69. However, this appears to be primarily down to McGinn missing the Man City away match through suspension. https://fbref.com/en/stathead/player_comparison.cgi?show_form=1&request=1&sum=0&comp_type=by_type&dom_lg=1&player_id1=6f7d826d&p1yrfrom=2023-2024&player_id2=90f91999&p2yrfrom=2023-2024 Standard Stats Playing Time Performance Expected Progression Per 90 Minutes Player Span Nation Pos Squad MP Starts Min 90s Gls Ast G+A G-PK PK PKatt CrdY CrdR xG npxG xAG npxG+xAG PrgC PrgP PrgR Gls Ast G+A G-PK G+A-PK xG xAG xG+xAG npxG npxG+xAG Douglas Luiz 2023-24 br BRA MF Aston Villa 35 35 2,993 33.3 9 5 14 5 4 4 12 0 6.9 3.8 5.4 9.2 60 168 50 0.27 0.15 0.42 0.15 0.30 0.21 0.16 0.37 0.11 0.28 John McGinn 2023-24 sct SCO MF,FW Aston Villa 35 35 2,999 33.3 6 4 10 6 0 0 9 1 5.0 5.0 4.6 9.6 59 189 84 0.18 0.12 0.30 0.18 0.30 0.15 0.14 0.29 0.15 0.29 Totals may not be complete for all senior-level play, see coverage note. An underline indicates the data for the statistic is incomplete Shooting Standard Expected Player Span Nation Pos Squad 90s Gls Sh SoT SoT% Sh/90 SoT/90 G/Sh G/SoT Dist FK PK PKatt xG npxG npxG/Sh G-xG np:G-xG Douglas Luiz 2023-24 br BRA MF Aston Villa 33.3 9 44 13 29.5 1.32 0.39 0.11 0.38 23.3 5 4 4 6.9 3.8 0.09 +2.1 +1.2 John McGinn 2023-24 sct SCO MF,FW Aston Villa 33.3 6 40 14 35.0 1.20 0.42 0.15 0.43 19.5 3 0 0 5.0 5.0 0.12 +1.0 +1.0 Totals may not be complete for all senior-level play, see coverage note. An underline indicates the data for the statistic is incomplete Passing Total Short Medium Long Expected Player Span Nation Pos Squad 90s Cmp Att Cmp% TotDist PrgDist Cmp Att Cmp% Cmp Att Cmp% Cmp Att Cmp% Ast xAG xA A-xAG KP 1/3 PPA CrsPA PrgP Douglas Luiz 2023-24 br BRA MF Aston Villa 33.3 1800 2101 85.7 31199 7807 812 871 93.2 775 870 89.1 167 276 60.5 5 5.4 5.3 -0.4 53 137 39 8 168 John McGinn 2023-24 sct SCO MF,FW Aston Villa 33.3 972 1223 79.5 17953 5844 434 489 88.8 396 462 85.7 130 217 59.9 4 4.6 4.9 -0.6 44 124 52 14 189 Totals may not be complete for all senior-level play, see coverage note. An underline indicates the data for the statistic is incomplete Pass Types Pass Types Corner Kicks Outcomes Player Span Nation Pos Squad 90s Att Live Dead FK TB Sw Crs TI CK In Out Str Cmp Off Blocks Douglas Luiz 2023-24 br BRA MF Aston Villa 33.3 2101 1857 237 129 11 13 115 6 100 61 7 2 1800 7 21 John McGinn 2023-24 sct SCO MF,FW Aston Villa 33.3 1223 1137 82 31 15 8 74 3 37 28 0 0 972 4 25 Totals may not be complete for all senior-level play, see coverage note. An underline indicates the data for the statistic is incomplete Goal and Shot Creation SCA SCA Types GCA GCA Types Player Span Nation Pos Squad 90s SCA SCA90 PassLive PassDead TO Sh Fld Def GCA GCA90 PassLive PassDead TO Sh Fld Def Douglas Luiz 2023-24 br BRA MF Aston Villa 33.3 117 3.52 61 34 6 10 5 1 10 0.30 5 4 0 0 1 0 John McGinn 2023-24 sct SCO MF,FW Aston Villa 33.3 106 3.18 88 9 6 2 1 0 14 0.42 11 1 2 0 0 0 Totals may not be complete for all senior-level play, see coverage note. An underline indicates the data for the statistic is incomplete Defensive Actions Tackles Challenges Blocks Player Span Nation Pos Squad 90s Tkl TklW Def 3rd Mid 3rd Att 3rd Tkl Att Tkl% Lost Blocks Sh Pass Int Tkl+Int Clr Err Douglas Luiz 2023-24 br BRA MF Aston Villa 33.3 58 38 21 27 10 25 53 47.2 28 32 8 24 23 81 18 2 John McGinn 2023-24 sct SCO MF,FW Aston Villa 33.3 59 35 18 34 7 32 77 41.6 45 33 4 29 21 80 21 0 Totals may not be complete for all senior-level play, see coverage note. An underline indicates the data for the statistic is incomplete Possession Touches Take-Ons Carries Receiving Player Span Nation Pos Squad 90s Touches Def Pen Def 3rd Mid 3rd Att 3rd Att Pen Live Att Succ Succ% Tkld Tkld% Carries TotDist PrgDist PrgC 1/3 CPA Mis Dis Rec PrgR Douglas Luiz 2023-24 br BRA MF Aston Villa 33.3 2351 81 519 1256 598 38 2347 47 24 51.1 16 34.0 1394 7522 3562 60 48 4 33 31 1638 50 John McGinn 2023-24 sct SCO MF,FW Aston Villa 33.3 1546 44 257 810 499 58 1546 96 54 56.3 27 28.1 994 5181 2385 59 45 10 55 61 1096 84 Totals may not be complete for all senior-level play, see coverage note. An underline indicates the data for the statistic is incomplete Playing Time Playing Time Starts Subs Team Success Team Success (xG) Player Span Nation Pos Squad MP Min Mn/MP Min% 90s Starts Mn/Start Compl Subs Mn/Sub unSub PPM onG onGA +/- +/-90 On-Off onxG onxGA xG+/- xG+/-90 On-Off Douglas Luiz 2023-24 br BRA MF Aston Villa 35 2,993 86 87.5 33.3 35 86 26 0 0 1.69 65 57 +8 +0.24 -1.23 56.4 52.7 +3.7 +0.11 +0.18 John McGinn 2023-24 sct SCO MF,FW Aston Villa 35 2,999 86 87.7 33.3 35 86 24 0 0 1.83 68 52 +16 +0.48 +0.69 56.6 48.6 +8.0 +0.24 +1.22 Totals may not be complete for all senior-level play, see coverage note. An underline indicates the data for the statistic is incomplete Miscellaneous Stats Performance Aerial Duels Player Span Nation Pos Squad 90s CrdY CrdR 2CrdY Fls Fld Off Crs Int TklW PKwon PKcon OG Recov Won Lost Won% Douglas Luiz 2023-24 br BRA MF Aston Villa 33.3 12 0 0 51 41 0 115 23 38 0 0 0 184 25 18 58.1 John McGinn 2023-24 sct SCO MF,FW Aston Villa 33.3 9 1 0 39 69 2 74 21 35 0 0 0 161 9 19 32.1 Totals may not be complete for all senior-level play, see coverage note. An underline indicates the data for the statistic is incomplete 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulMcGrath_5 Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 Quote The #AstonVilla advances on #McKennie thinking of being able to satisfy the player's requests: and, therefore, of gaining his satisfaction with the destination. The fit with #DouglasLuiz is possible (we are talking about it) but not necessarily tied: #Juventus evaluates the opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarryOnVilla Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 Losing Doug and replacing him with Mckennie!!! is this some kind of nightmare dimension 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post _AA_786 Posted June 3 Popular Post Share Posted June 3 14 hours ago, CarryOnVilla said: Losing Doug and replacing him with Mckennie!!! is this some kind of nightmare dimension If we lose Luiz and replace with McKennie that would be an epic downgrade almost on a par with the upgrade from Gerrard to Unai. Yes McKennie played a lot at Juve this last year but he's generally just adds energy and arguably Fagioli & Miretti have outperformed him when they've played. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chips'ngravy Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 Don't get the 'Luiz is expendable' narrative that is starting to emerge amongst some of the Villa fan base. Stats aside, when I watch him in a Villa shirt he is the hub of our midfield play. Great first touch, always looks to have the ball under control, rarely loses it, drives us forward where he can and has even started to bang a few goals in. Perhaps it's times like this we should reflect on some of the total and utter shite we've had in central midfield or the talented but largely anonymous. Luiz is a cracking player, and if he leaves will be sorely missed and not easily replaced. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBlack Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 10 minutes ago, chips'ngravy said: Don't get the 'Luiz is expendable' narrative that is starting to emerge amongst some of the Villa fan base. Stats aside, when I watch him in a Villa shirt he is the hub of our midfield play. Great first touch, always looks to have the ball under control, rarely loses it, drives us forward where he can and has even started to bang a few goals in. Perhaps it's times like this we should reflect on some of the total and utter shite we've had in central midfield or the talented but largely anonymous. Luiz is a cracking player, and if he leaves will be sorely missed and not easily replaced. I would say not expendable. But if it were a choice between the biggest players in our team then I'd rather sell him over Watkins or Martinez. Martinez is kind of unique in world football and genuinely irreplaceable. Watkins is the most complete forward one ever seen at Villa, and I don't see us being able to sign a striker remotely close to his ability. If Kamara returned then Youri can play Luiz's role and there isn't a massive drop down there. Barkley, if signed, seems to have very comparable (arguably more favoruable) stats in a Luton team that would have seen even more pressing than Luiz did in some games. I dont want him to go. I want him to be our first choice alongside whoever we get in to replace the injured Kamara for the start of next season. But he's definitely the one key player we do have an alternative for in the team already, and an alternative almost lined up. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
striker Posted June 3 Visiting Supporter Share Posted June 3 23 hours ago, lexicon said: I am very, very happy that you are not involved in any of our transfer decisions. This is just absolute drivel, I'm sorry. No worries at all. It is just my opinion of the player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CroVillan Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 (edited) 33 minutes ago, chips'ngravy said: Don't get the 'Luiz is expendable' narrative that is starting to emerge amongst some of the Villa fan base. Stats aside, when I watch him in a Villa shirt he is the hub of our midfield play. Great first touch, always looks to have the ball under control, rarely loses it, drives us forward where he can and has even started to bang a few goals in. Perhaps it's times like this we should reflect on some of the total and utter shite we've had in central midfield or the talented but largely anonymous. Luiz is a cracking player, and if he leaves will be sorely missed and not easily replaced. Each to their own Chips but I disagree. Yes the impact of losing Boubs has had an impact on his play but honestly and I’ll get lambasted for this but I’ve never seen the hype surrounding him. Personally think he’s too passive on the ball sometimes, gets flustered in pressure situations regularly and lacks that pace to drive through the centre and split sides open. I love Dougie and he’s been a great servant and one of our better players but world class he is not in my eyes. People will say then why are Arse, Pool and United going for him….maybe he’ll suit their style better and be able to extract something that will raise his bar but who knows. 80-100m on Dougie is a great deal for us and I’d rather be selling him than Jacob or Ollie. time will tell and I’d love to keep him but if a an offer came in with the above amount I’d be pulling the trigger. Edited June 3 by CroVillan Spelling 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerCollins29 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 When Doug plays in his correct position, with a DM next to him, he is in the top 5 midfielders in the league. DO NOT SELL (assuming Monchi is reading this) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Keener window-cleaner Posted June 3 Popular Post Share Posted June 3 I don't understand the idea of entertaining bids for Luiz at all, at any price. He is imo one of the best, if not the best, midfielder we have had since I started following Villa around 1993. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulMcGrath_5 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 4 minutes ago, Keener window-cleaner said: I don't understand the idea of entertaining bids for Luiz at all, at any price. He is imo one of the best, if not the best, midfielder we have had since I started following Villa around 1993. P S R 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexvilla4 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 I really don't want to sell Dougie. Very talented player who has been with us now a fairly long time, and I would love to see him in the Champs League However, in the current circumstances unfortunately if it was me I would take £80m for him and reinvest it elsewhere. I think McGinn/Tielemans/Barkley next to a fit Kamara could do a good job between them and we could use the rest to purchase top full backs, attacking mid/DM rotation etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 10 minutes ago, Keener window-cleaner said: I don't understand the idea of entertaining bids for Luiz at all, at any price. He is imo one of the best, if not the best, midfielder we have had since I started following Villa around 1993. What don't you understand about the need to raise money to strengthen the whole squad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 5 minutes ago, alexvilla4 said: I really don't want to sell Dougie. Very talented player who has been with us now a fairly long time, and I would love to see him in the Champs League However, in the current circumstances unfortunately if it was me I would take £80m for him and reinvest it elsewhere. I think McGinn/Tielemans/Barkley next to a fit Kamara could do a good job between them and we could use the rest to purchase top full backs, attacking mid/DM rotation etc I love Dougie. But nobody is offering 80m for him in the current climate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rightdm00 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 Just now, Tomaszk said: What don't you understand about the need to raise money to strengthen the whole squad? How does one strengthen the squad by selling one of its best players. It took us almost 2 seasons to recover from selling Jack. Any midfielder bought to replace luiz would have to hit the ground running or our champions league campaign is over before it ever starts. Selling luiz, especially with kamara unavailable for the first half of the season is plain craziness. Luiz was top 3 in the minutes played this campaign. Selling him would leave a massive hole. We would be weaker for it, especially in the short term. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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