Vive_La_Villa Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 16 minutes ago, sharkyvilla said: I think Taylor does limit Jack's options when attacking, so it is a big problem in my book as Jack is our most creative player. I'd be tempted to put Guilbert at left back and Elmo on the right. I think too much is made of full backs having to be attacking. We managed 6th 2 seasons in a row with centre halves playing as full backs. I don’t think the game has changed that much in 11 years that every full back has to be shit hot going forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 35 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: I think too much is made of full backs having to be attacking. We managed 6th 2 seasons in a row with centre halves playing as full backs. I don’t think the game has changed that much in 11 years that every full back has to be shit hot going forward. Yeah but we had very good wingers back then. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 1 hour ago, Vive_La_Villa said: I think too much is made of full backs having to be attacking. We managed 6th 2 seasons in a row with centre halves playing as full backs. I don’t think the game has changed that much in 11 years that every full back has to be shit hot going forward. Deanoball requires full backs to be good going forward, because he wants more build-up play and he wants both wingers to come inside. Under MON we played direct football with a very good front 3 of Young-Carew-Agbonlahor. It was easy for someone like Mellberg or Cuellar to just sit back and hit speculative long balls to any of those three, all of whom could create goals out of nothing. You're probably right, though, that there's an element of fashion to it. Pep, Klopp and Poch play their full backs high, so everyone else copies. It wasn't that long ago that Chelsea won the PL with Ivanovic at right back. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 I wouldn't mind playing Kortney at LB. Did extremely well there last season. Those games against Forest and Derby, he was marauding forward, putting in good crosses and even some excellent through balls while also being solid at the back. I'd have him over Taylor until Targett gets up to speed. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaVilla Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Keyblade said: I wouldn't mind playing Kortney at LB. Did extremely well there last season. Those games against Forest and Derby, he was marauding forward, putting in good crosses and even some excellent through balls while also being solid at the back. I'd have him over Taylor until Targett gets up to speed. Agree with this, would much prefer Hause OR Targett over Taylor..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVTuco Posted September 20, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted September 20, 2019 How shite must Targett be not get a game in front of Taylor? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 1 hour ago, Wainy316 said: Yeah but we had very good wingers back then. So it’s Taylor’s fault our wingers are shit? For me Taylor’s job first and foremost is to prevent the opposition from scoring. In the last 3 games he has managed that. (Can’t blame him for the palace break away goal). I get his shit going forward and if we spend big money on Targett he should eventually play. But suggestions of Mcginn playing there and at one point even Hourihane is ridiculous in my opinion. I don’t think it matters what Taylor does for us he will forever be judged on how crap he was for large parts of his time in the Championship. Hause playing there is an option if the Taylor starts costing us goals. Burt whilst he’s does f**k all for us going forward I can remember quite a few crucial pieces of defending this season that has prevented us conceding. That seems to be overlooked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaVilla Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 39 minutes ago, AVTuco said: How shite must Targett be not get a game in front of Taylor? Wouldn't be surprised if Deano was planning to start phasing him in after the Crewe game, and then he went and got injured..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyp102 Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 Let’s not forget that Targett had been with us for a month before the season started. It’s not like he signed days before the season started. Smith still decided that Taylor was best to start the season. Targett will get a chance, but not for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 12 minutes ago, mikeyp102 said: Let’s not forget that Targett had been with us for a month before the season started. It’s not like he signed days before the season started. Smith still decided that Taylor was best to start the season. You're right, quite worrying for me that actually. Tremendous waste of money if he isn't better than Taylor. Then again, he got it wrong with Guilbert not starting the season. Fingers crossed Targett's a similar step up in level as Fred G is to Elmo and Deano has just misread it or played it overly cautious. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 3 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Nobody is saying he is a good defender. They are saying he has been doing a good job. Lets see how well we do defensively from that side when he’s eventually replaced. It’s going to need to be a massive improvement because he hasn’t even been that bad. He's been OK in purely defence yes. Honestly I don't think he's been good or brilliant, if you do, lovely, but he's certainly not a safe pair of hands I trust. But look at the overall picture regardless. We're so lopsided. None of the players want to give him the ball. When he does get it, everything stops, the other team resets and starts to push forward because you know he's got nothing. On the attacking side of things, he has been "bad" I'm afraid, he's been stifling and I think it'll be a huge improvement on that side when we get someone who can help us hold the ball in possession. It doesn't have to be a direct error for us to be negatively affected. Bit like last year when we were in smelly form and Hourihane was killing us in the middle of the pitch. He was never the one to lose the ball or get caught in possession but he was hiding from every bit of responsibility he could and shoveling off hospital passes so other people were being dispossessed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 1 hour ago, Vive_La_Villa said: I get his shit going forward and if we spend big money on Targett he should eventually play. But suggestions of Mcginn playing there and at one point even Hourihane is ridiculous in my opinion. Sorry I know I just quoted but I've just seen this...and want to share some guff. It's not something I would do because he's too good in the middle for us but McGinn would be a ridiculously good left back. Like silly good. I almost want to see him tried there because God knows his ceiling. I think he could play for Champions League contenders as a left back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 13 minutes ago, Tomaszk said: Sorry I know I just quoted but I've just seen this...and want to share some guff. It's not something I would do because he's too good in the middle for us but McGinn would be a ridiculously good left back. Like silly good. I almost want to see him tried there because God knows his ceiling. I think he could play for Champions League contenders as a left back. I totally disagree. I think he would get caught out positionally time and time again. But it’s all about opinions. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 5 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: I totally disagree. I think he would get caught out positionally time and time again. But it’s all about opinions. I reckon he'd be some sort of Maldini and Alan Wright werewolf. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimlico_Villa Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 4 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said: I think too much is made of full backs having to be attacking. We managed 6th 2 seasons in a row with centre halves playing as full backs. I don’t think the game has changed that much in 11 years that every full back has to be shit hot going forward. True, but nowadays teams play with one striker and therefore need an attacking component from full backs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 10 minutes ago, Pimlico_Villa said: True, but nowadays teams play with one striker and therefore need an attacking component from full backs. That’s true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brummybloke Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 17 hours ago, villalad21 said: Both done well. I would be happy with either. Elmo have created more chances than Guilbert though as much as people slate him for his offensive abilities. That's fair enough, I would guess you are in the minority as fred Gilbert provides pace and aggression as well as decent passing. Elmos crossing is reasonably good, normally from deep a different kind of skill than crossing while running. Problem is.. taylor cant do either. Gets the ball checks back, gets the ball freezes and then checks back, or gets the ball and passes it to a double marked player. None of which 99 out of 100 times is of any benefit to the attack we are trying to complete. Having fast or tricky players is fine if the play is going to take that advantage, taylor loses us that advantage. Every game he has played, worst player on the pitch will have been left winger as left totally isolated and rarely gets given the ball in a forward passing move from the flanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 4 hours ago, brummybloke said: That's fair enough, I would guess you are in the minority as fred Gilbert provides pace and aggression as well as decent passing. Elmos crossing is reasonably good, normally from deep a different kind of skill than crossing while running. Problem is.. taylor cant do either. Gets the ball checks back, gets the ball freezes and then checks back, or gets the ball and passes it to a double marked player. None of which 99 out of 100 times is of any benefit to the attack we are trying to complete. Having fast or tricky players is fine if the play is going to take that advantage, taylor loses us that advantage. Every game he has played, worst player on the pitch will have been left winger as left totally isolated and rarely gets given the ball in a forward passing move from the flanks Guilbert isn't crossing enough for me, but i'm sure he will improve on that aspect of his game. Elmo is 31 year old, Guilbert is the future so i overall agree with him starting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimlico_Villa Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 16 hours ago, mikeyp102 said: Let’s not forget that Targett had been with us for a month before the season started. It’s not like he signed days before the season started. Smith still decided that Taylor was best to start the season. Targett will get a chance, but not for a while. Don’t think he thought he was better, just wanted to minimise disruption in personnel from last season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MotoMkali Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 On 20/09/2019 at 18:13, KentVillan said: Deanoball requires full backs to be good going forward, because he wants more build-up play and he wants both wingers to come inside. Under MON we played direct football with a very good front 3 of Young-Carew-Agbonlahor. It was easy for someone like Mellberg or Cuellar to just sit back and hit speculative long balls to any of those three, all of whom could create goals out of nothing. You're probably right, though, that there's an element of fashion to it. Pep, Klopp and Poch play their full backs high, so everyone else copies. It wasn't that long ago that Chelsea won the PL with Ivanovic at right back. The thing about ivanovich though is that although he wasn't very creative he got goals through headers and at the time was probably the best right back in the league. On top of that Chelsea had pedro/willian/hazard on the wings who were all brilliant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts