dont_do_it_doug. Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 His problem is his first touch. He put a real shift in today and he has quality, no doubt, but he has to sort that touch out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted December 1, 2019 Author Share Posted December 1, 2019 That was one of his better games and he still was "OK" and nowt more. A striker with a bit of nous and we'll be fine. The team is getting more and more annoyed with him. We'd be in an identical position if we'd started Davis every game this season. We'd be higher if we had McGinn up front all season, because he'd hold the ball up and can kick a football properly. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 9 minutes ago, Tomaszk said: That was one of his better games and he still was "OK" and nowt more. A striker with a bit of nous and we'll be fine. The team is getting more and more annoyed with him. We'd be in an identical position if we'd started Davis every game this season. We'd be higher if we had McGinn up front all season, because he'd hold the ball up and can kick a football properly. This is funny, cause I suspect it to be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delphinho123 Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 I’d play McGinn up front and bring Nakamba in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinRichardsonsMoustache Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 No complaints about work rate and occasionally passed the ball off effectively. He also occupied the centre backs adequately. Unfortunately, if he’s effective anywhere else, I can’t see it. I know his job is to create space for others but I think defenders realise there’s little about his game atm that should worry them. As such, the space isn’t there as frequently. I have this inkling that Dean never intended him to be the number one striker. I think there was a other one lined up and that Wes would be given time to mature from the bench (look at every other are of the team and how new signings have been introduced). I really want him to work out and I can see he’s improving. I just don’t think he’s a number 9 and his dropping deep role means we’re stuffed when we can’t spring Jack or John. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted December 1, 2019 Author Share Posted December 1, 2019 My hope for Wes this season is that he becomes better than an out of form John McGinn would be up top. He's not particularly close right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughable Chimp Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 15 minutes ago, Elton said: Ha, ha, brilliant! So we agree Wesley is a vast improvement there then. He’s scored as many as Liverpool’s Brazilian Centre Forward so far this season. Stats, lies etc. Firmino's also assissted 2 more and is not relied on to be the main goal scorer for his team. Wesley is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted December 1, 2019 Author Share Posted December 1, 2019 1 minute ago, KevinRichardsonsMoustache said: I have this inkling that Dean never intended him to be the number one striker. I think there was a other one lined up and that Wes would be given time to mature from the bench (look at every other are of the team and how new signings have been introduced). I agree with you on not being first choice. However, after January when he's hopefully out of the XI and we've brought in a better player...I can't see him being a good one to throw on if we're chasing. He's not going to dart round, look dangerous and pinch a goal is he? He'll do his dropping deep thing that he does, have his huge touches backwards and pass it to advancing full backs. Anyone already in centre mid can do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 4 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said: Firmino's also assissted 2 more and is not relied on to be the main goal scorer for his team. Wesley is. Is he though? We're the 6th highest scorers in the league. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughable Chimp Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Keyblade said: Is he though? We're the 6th highest scorers in the league. Yes? He is still relied on to be the main goalscorer of our team and the fact that we're the 6th highest scorers in the league doesn't change that. If he's supposed to be like Firmino then I would expect more assists to his game as well but that's not really there either. **** hell, even his one assist that he's had to his name isn't some great pass either. Its a basic pass to Luiz outside of the box who proceeds to curl it into the top corner. Edited December 1, 2019 by Laughable Chimp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 2 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said: Yes? He is still relied on to be the main goalscorer of our team and the fact that we're the 6th highest scorers in the league doesn't change that. If he's supposed to be like Firmino then I would expect more assists to his game as well but that's not really there either. Well like you said, Firmino only has 2 more assists to his name than Wesley. So I'm not sure how you've concluded that he's not relied on as a goalscorer and indeed that Wesley is for us. Unless I've missed Dean say this before. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elton Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said: Firmino's also assissted 2 more and is not relied on to be the main goal scorer for his team. Wesley is. Thought it was obvious my comparison was a little tongue in cheek. Although I’m not sure Smith thinks he is setting up a team relying on Wesley to be top goal scorer. Football systems have moved on from over relying on a CF for goals. Look at Newcastle for example, they like to play 3 up front who can’t score. Edited December 1, 2019 by Elton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughable Chimp Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Keyblade said: Well like you said, Firmino only has 2 more assists to his name than Wesley. So I'm not sure how you've concluded that he's not relied on as a goalscorer and indeed that Wesley is for us. Unless I've missed Dean say this before. First of all, I said Firmino is not relied on to be the main goalscorer for his team, not that he isn't relied to score goals at all. Secondly, are you joking me? So are we not supposed to rely on Wesley as a goalscorer then? Well he certainly isn't really providing the asists either unless you think 1 assist in 14 games is acceptable for a "non-goal scoring forward", so why the **** are we playing him on the field for then? Edited December 1, 2019 by Laughable Chimp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post JAMAICAN-VILLAN Posted December 1, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted December 1, 2019 (edited) I'm actually tired of seeing him getting slaughtered to be honest. I genuinely think he is working hard, and it can't be "laziness" which sees him always so deep to help out. AGAIN, this time last year we were getting hammered by the likes of Wigan, we've just gotten a point at Old Trafford and a huge portion of the posts i'm seeing start with "Wesley is shite". instead of anything about the actual game or our progress. Edited December 1, 2019 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN 11 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 1 minute ago, Laughable Chimp said: First of all, I said Firmino is not relied on to be the main goalscorer for his team, not that he isn't relied to score goals at all. Secondly, are you joking me? So are we not supposed to rely on Wesley as a goalscorer then? Well he certainly isn't really providing the asists either, so why the **** are we playing him on the field for then? I'm going by what you said, my point is that I don't understand why one standard applies to one and not the other. Unless both Klopp and Smith intimated it in the past, I'm not sure how you determined this. In any case, Wesley is still our top scorer in the league, so in effect he is our main goal scorer. I'm not really sure what you're getting at to be honest. Do you have a target he should be hitting that he's currently not meeting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughable Chimp Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 6 minutes ago, Elton said: Thought it was obvious my comparison was a little tongue in cheek. Although I’m not sure Smith thinks he is setting up a team relying on Wesley to be top goal scorer. Football systems have moved on from over relying on a CF for goals. Look at Newcastle for example, they like to play 3 up front who can’t score. I don't know much about Newcastle, but I don't think their system intentionally works in such a way that their front 3 isn't supposed to score, that seems insane to me. Pretty sure they are in fact supposed to score they just aren't able to for whatever reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted December 1, 2019 Author Share Posted December 1, 2019 8 minutes ago, Keyblade said: Well like you said, Firmino only has 2 more assists to his name than Wesley. So I'm not sure how you've concluded that he's not relied on as a goalscorer and indeed that Wesley is for us. Unless I've missed Dean say this before. I don't care how many goals he scores or how many assists he ends up with. Points for Villa is where it's at. I just want general all-round improvement from Wes. He'd struggle to make any impact in the championship playing like this. It's not good enough. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villarocker Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 I don't hold out much hope for Davis but right now I'd give him a go over Wesley if, at the very least, to give Wesley a major kick up the arse that he seems to need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Kiwivillan Posted December 1, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted December 1, 2019 7 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said: I'm actually tired of seeing him getting slaughtered to be honest. I genuinely think he is working hard, and it can't be "laziness" which sees him always so deep to help out. AGAIN, this time last year we were getting hammered by the likes of Wigan, we've just gotten a point at Old Trafford and a huge portion of the posts i'm seeing start with "Wesley is shite". instead of anything about the actual game or our progress. I can't believe we got a draw at OT and one of most popular threads is Wesley bashing. It's beyond tedious 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 (edited) 45 minutes ago, Elton said: Ha, ha, brilliant! So we agree Wesley is a vast improvement there then. He’s scored as many as Liverpool’s Brazilian Centre Forward so far this season. Stats, lies etc. Thing is statistics often tells you what you're looking for. The huge difference between Wesley and lots of stat wise comperable players is that they are a lot more mobile. Wes is pretty decent defensively at times, but so incredibly static in the attacking play. Firminho might not have scored 15 goals so far, but his off ball movement, intelligence and what not is on another planet than Wes. Wes has definitely improved in some areas like work rate and coming deep to link up, but there's so much else missing. He's one of the least dangerous attacking threats I've ever seen. He simply doesn't have it yet. And he both directly and indirectly makes our attacking play a bit impotent. Edited December 1, 2019 by KenjiOgiwara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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