Keyblade Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, PaulC said: Quite true, can people who are calling him an evil racist actually picture what life would have been like here under Nazi rule. Its ridiculous. You know, calling him an evil racist as you say doesn't detract from his achievements against the Nazis in WWII in any way. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post chrisp65 Posted June 7, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted June 7, 2020 1 minute ago, PaulC said: Quite true, can people who are calling him an evil racist actually picture what life would have been like here under Nazi rule. Its ridiculous. It’s not a game to see who makes the cut. People can have multiple sides to their personality or their own personal history. I mean, genuinely, you can see that can’t you? We beat the nazis in large part because of him, the right man at that time. I’m grateful. We should not then mythologise his whole life and make him out to be some god figure. He was not. It is possible to have a more nuanced and informed view of the world than goodies and baddies. It’s ridiculous that people want to whitewash history. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, PaulC said: Quite true, can people who are calling him an evil racist actually picture what life would have been like here under Nazi rule. Its ridiculous. What on earth are you going on about? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2020 Again, you can view Churchill simultaneously as a great wartime leader and also acknowledge he was a pretty flawed character. One doesn't diminish the other. Arguing about a bloke who has been dead for 60 years seems more than a bit navel gazy when you have stuff before our very eyes going on now, like black men getting murdered by police, the most powerful person on the planet echoing lines of infamous racists, and your common or garden crap like identical CVs under the names Jamal or James will see James more likely to get hired... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 @Keyblade I couldn't find the tweet I saw earlier but here's some news item about earlier in the week: Quote On Tuesday, a bust of former Belgian King Leopold II was defaced in the Flemish city of Ghent, with red paint symbolising blood and a message referring to the death of George Floyd in the United States. The statue has been defaced several times before, but this time, the bust was gagged as well. Red paint was also thrown over the rest of the sculpture, as well as the pedestal, reports Het Laatste Nieuws. ... The statues of Leopold II throughout Belgium have been the subject of scrutiny several times before, with many opponents wanting them all removed. On Monday, a petition was launched to remove all statues in his honour from the City of Brussels. ...more 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadridVilla Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 (edited) 52 minutes ago, Follyfoot said: What on earth has been happening over the last week with the far left protesting, and what an earth is wrong being proud of your heritage and proud of your nation What's been happening? Have you been living on the moon? There's been thousands of people protesting against the murder of a black man, in a country with a racist leader, a racist history, and a racist police force. Funnily enough, the UK also has a racist leader, a racist history and a racist police force. The problem with being proud of our heritage is that there is so little to be proud of. Are you really proud of a nation that has committed so many atrocities through its history? Are you really proud of our history of slavery, stealing the historical artifacts of other countries to display in our museums, the massacre of hundreds of Indians at Amritsar, the partition of India and Pakistan, Bloody Sunday? The list goes on and on. Fighting against the Nazis does not excuse our country of the disgraces it has committed. It is a source of pride that we defeated Nazism, but all our other historical controversies are a source of great shame to me. Edited June 7, 2020 by MadridVilla 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 3 minutes ago, Chindie said: Again, you can view Churchill simultaneously as a great wartime leader and also acknowledge he was a pretty flawed character. One doesn't diminish the other. That is fair enough Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyp102 Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 2 hours ago, chrisp65 said: I’m posting this as the good people at Aljazeera appear to have gone early with the welsh independence referendum Why is Wales listed separately is it no longer part of the UK? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2020 Collymore's response to Farage has been taken down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2020 3 minutes ago, MadridVilla said: What's been happening? Have you been living on the moon? There's been thousands of people protesting against the murder of a black man, in a country with a racist leader, a racist history, and a racist police force. Funnily enough, the UK also has a racist leader, a racist history and a racist police force. The problem with being proud of our heritage is that there is so little to be proud of. Are you really proud of a nation that has committed so many atrocities through its history? Are you really proud of our history of slavery, stealing the historical artifacts of other countries to display in our museums, the massacre of hundreds of Indians at Amritsar, the partition of India and Pakistan, Bloody Sunday? The list goes on and on. Fighting against the Nazis does not excuse our country of the disgraces it has committed. It is a source of pride that we defeated Nazism, but a source of great shame for all our other historical controversies. I was quoting the violence that has occurred and your implication that violence will happen next week as if it’s something new. Every empire in the history of Time has blood on its hands, we are no different and it is only now that we can reflect with more modern thinking regarding what has transpired. I’m proud to be British,, if you are not that is your decision and right, Please do not tell me how I should think 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 4 minutes ago, snowychap said: @Keyblade I couldn't find the tweet I saw earlier but here's some news item about earlier in the week: I imagine on Genktalk.com there is an argument about him being a great leader and just a product of his time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post chrisp65 Posted June 7, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted June 7, 2020 7 minutes ago, mikeyp102 said: Why is Wales listed separately is it no longer part of the UK? We split about 8 this evening. There’s a tank just outside Shrewsbury awaiting my signal. Obviously I mean slurry tank. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2020 1 minute ago, chrisp65 said: We split about 8 this evening. There’s a tank just outside Shrewsbury awaiting my signal. Obviously I mean slurry tank. Pronounced ‘Shroosbury’ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 1 minute ago, Follyfoot said: Pronounced ‘Shroosbury’ Not anymore. It’s now pronounced Pontypandy. We’ve taken the local MP hostage and unless our demands are met we’ll give him back. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2020 4 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: Not anymore. It’s now pronounced Pontypandy. We’ve taken the local MP hostage and unless our demands are met we’ll give him back. You are number six Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 47 minutes ago, Keyblade said: I'd certainly hope Belgium for example doesn't idealize and have statues/streets after King Leopold II (fully expect to be proven wrong on this ). 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enda Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Follyfoot said: The man who led us to victory against the most evil fascist racist threat to our way of life that has ever existed, try and rewrite the truth as much as much as you wish , Thankfully you can have an opinion which you would’ve not had if not for him If confident in your ability to tell Churchill, Hitler and Stalin apart, I heartily suggest www.whosaidit.eu. Let me know how you get on. Edited June 7, 2020 by Enda Add link 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, Enda said: If confident in your ability to tell Churchill, Hitler and Stalin apart, I heartily suggest www.whosaidit.eu. Let me know how you get on. Only one I was sure of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted June 8, 2020 Author Share Posted June 8, 2020 10 hours ago, bickster said: He was that much of a racist, wikipedia has a page dedicated to his racism. Churchill was a racist, it really shouldn't be up for debate I get that but what kind of country would we have if the nazis won? The racism i suspect would be much worse than it is now. The vandalism of that statute was a disgrace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 4 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: I get that but what kind of country would we have if the nazis won? The racism i suspect would be much worse than it is now. The vandalism of that statute was a disgrace that's part of what the UK protests are about us not being as racist as everyone else seems to be the backbone of UK anti-racism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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