Tyrone Mings

[TRO]

49 minutes ago, Johnnyp said:

Exactly this. The fallout the last few days, you’d swear we’d dropped McGrath. I don’t buy ( never have ) that his leadership alone warrants him a place in the team. Sure, let’s just forget all the mistakes he makes. You lead by doing your job, quietly, vocal - it matters not. And as you rightly say, Smith dropped Mings. People have short memories. 

The problem for me is......I think the team is better with Tyrone in it.....despite his shortfalls, he brings us presence, amongst other things.

I think that says more about the make up of the squad, than Mings himself.

making tha comment prior to Carlos arriving.

[david-avfc]

8 hours ago, AV82 said:

This. The 'injury' has been conjured up to save face.

Yes if he was genuinely injured he wouldn’t have been on the bench, we had 3 other defenders amongst the subs and only 1 midfielder so not like we needed to take an extra unfit centre back with us 

[Keyblade]

7 hours ago, Zatman said:

One of the podcasters said in the Friday press conference Gerrard said everybody was fit

Also in his presser last week he accidentally gave away that he isn't going to start for him by saying that just because someone is a captain or vice captain doesn't mean they're guaranteed to start. Mings is neither a captain or vice captain. Then after the game he came out with that look me in the eye stuff. He should just be honest, either he's not fit or he's not in your plans. Being mealy-mouthed about it is hurting him more than helping.

[TRO]

50 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said:

Except he appointed 2 x vice captains and a club captain also and none of them were Tyrone Mings. 

Maybe he has a point to make.....we are simply judging his man management skills without knowing the full source of events.

I seem to recall, a minor reaction from the fans to Dean Smith, when he dropped Ty.....so this is nothing new.....we simply don't know enough to criticise either manager.

Dean Smith might be many things, but I would back him 100% for being a reasonable guy......That is not me, castigating Ty, because I don't know enough.....SG may have a similar issue with Ty that Dean, had.

Its so, so easy to take sides on the basis of little information, and maybe using earlier prejudices for comfort, of which may not be relevant.

[sharkyvilla]

For what it's worth I don't think Dean and Mings fell out, it was just Dean thought he was out of form and Hause deserved his chance.  We got well beaten and Mings came straight back in, no dramas, no shitty comments to the media, no demotion below 4 other captains.  It's that last bit that is the real humiliation and very unusual, I mean who actually appoints 2 vice captains and a club captain other than if they're making a point of showing how far down the pecking order you've demoted the incumbent.  If truly Gerrard isn't making it personal, it's a major PR cock up, verging on incompetence.

[Jas10]

21 hours ago, MotoMkali said:

They tend to get away with it when Tyrone Mings is partnering with them and can cover their mistakes. 

I don’t see how anybody can deny this, he has always clearly been our best defender as well as our only real leader and organiser. I haven’t seen one game where we were better without him and didn’t looked lost or prone to errors…

I can’t understand why sections of our own fanbase criticise him so heavily when he is clearly a vital player for us and we are always worse off without him… I don’t give a shit what outsiders or opposition fans have to say but he has always deserved our support. I think too much has been asked of him due to deficiencies/weaknesses in the rest of the side or the players around him. I had hoped that by signing Carlos we could alleviate some pressure and responsibility for him and that would allow him to focus, concentrate, be more “switched on” for the full duration of games…

He has always been crucial for us and we would be much, much weaker without him.

I would be infuriated if he was sold tbh, especially if it’s just due to some argument or fallout with SG. We need Ty. We will be worse without him.

Mings > Gerrard 

every

single

time 

[ciggiesnbeer]

Ok after reading the full context of Gerrard's comments I am less annoyed. He still misspoke but he mentioned before and after Tyrone has an injury which is why he did not play.  The "look me in the eye" seems to be more a reference to "look me in the eye and tell me you  are sure the injury is healed" kind of statement. Which given our history of rushing players back too soon makes some sense.

My hope is Gerrard will clear the air and express his respect for Tyrone Mings in his pre match presser.

Yes I am being charitable but I like Gerrard and Mings and I hope my interpretation is correct.

Edited August 10, 2022 by ciggiesnbeer

[VillaParkAvenue]

4 minutes ago, ciggiesnbeer said:

My hope is Gerrard will clear the air and express his respect for Tyrone Mings in his pre match presser.

”I love Tyrone Mings, I love the person, the character, the player.”

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/i-love-person-steven-gerrard-22454460.amp

[Jas10]

Which of our other defenders has performed so well and so consistently and produced so many moments like these below? Ty has always been and remains a key player for us. I don’t get why he’s so under appreciated, a few mistakes don’t mask the fact that he has been a bedrock of our success and can continue to be:

[Jas10]

Ever since he started playing for us, I have always seen him as the “true” captain regardless of who’s worn the armband. He is our leader, our organiser, our motivator… we don’t have a comparative character other than maybe Martinez who can benefit us in that way…

Madness to give McGinn the captaincy but we are stuck with that decision for now. I’m just hoping he can get back to his best somehow… needs a tougher midfield behind him and be encouraged to get forward then because he is fairly inadequate in a defensive and ball retaining (passing, composure) sense…

Again, we are much weaker and softer without Ty’s presence in that side…

My only/main criticism of him is that he could offer more in an attacking sense but defensively he is so adept and important for us and adds that bit of physicality and aerial ability that we so sorely lack. Again, with less responsibility or tasks to fulfil, he can be even better. Focus on his strengths.

Edited August 10, 2022 by Jas10

[duke313]

The latest theory on Twitter on why Mings has been dropped, is that SG is punishing Mings as he blames him for City 3-2 comeback and Liverpool not winning the league 

[Kingman]

21 minutes ago, duke313 said:

The latest theory on Twitter on why Mings has been dropped, is that SG is punishing Mings as he blames him for City 3-2 comeback and Liverpool not winning the league 

Only thing I remember from that game was that Olson should be made to walk back (preferably to Rome) 

[supermon]

It'd be hilarious if Mings just comes back to the side for Everton game and starts all other games, if he did then maybe it's all been blown well out of proportion 

[Aston_Villan4]

7 minutes ago, supermon said:

It'd be hilarious if Mings just comes back to the side for Everton game and starts all other games, if he did then maybe it's all been blown well out of proportion 

Definitely. Although I’m surprised no one has come out and said anything yet. I guess the Athletic with saying there’s no bad blood between the two but you’d think one of them would make a comment clearing the air considering how much attention it’s getting. Not that it’s necessary, of course.

[Jas10]

7 hours ago, sharkyvilla said:

For what it's worth I don't think Dean and Mings fell out, it was just Dean thought he was out of form and Hause deserved his chance.  We got well beaten and Mings came straight back in, no dramas, no shitty comments to the media, no demotion below 4 other captains.  It's that last bit that is the real humiliation and very unusual, I mean who actually appoints 2 vice captains and a club captain other than if they're making a point of showing how far down the pecking order you've demoted the incumbent.  If truly Gerrard isn't making it personal, it's a major PR cock up, verging on incompetence.

Thank you. This suggestion that Dean and Ty had problems and didn’t get on is utter bullshit. Dean was the guy who brought him in and developed him into the talent he became, Dean helped turn Ty’s career round and got him into the England squad. Made him a figurehead for Aston Villa FC.

He only dropped him for part of one game when he was under pressure and trying something different to turn the tide of bad results.

No drama, no comments or hissy fits in the media or anything, as you stated. God, I miss having that kind of personality at the helm, Dean was an absolute class act…

This is not a comparable situation. SG has acted really poorly and run his mouth too much, could have been done in a much better way and with much better timing… it’s SG himself who has made a huge deal about the whole thing, it’s self inflicted and I don’t see how it helps the club…

[WallisFrizz]

4 hours ago, Jas10 said:

Thank you. This suggestion that Dean and Ty had problems and didn’t get on is utter bullshit. Dean was the guy who brought him in and developed him into the talent he became, Dean helped turn Ty’s career round and got him into the England squad. Made him a figurehead for Aston Villa FC.

He only dropped him for part of one game when he was under pressure and trying something different to turn the tide of bad results.

No drama, no comments or hissy fits in the media or anything, as you stated. God, I miss having that kind of personality at the helm, Dean was an absolute class act…

You have no idea though. You keep repeating it is bullshit because it doesn’t fit your narrative. Ty spoke out in an interview at the time saying he was scapegoated. Dean got sacked so didn’t need to speak about it, somebody said earlier about Dean alluding to too much power in the dressing room. How do you know that Gerrard hasn’t been given instruction to quell that power imbalance? It all speculation but you don’t know any better than I do. 
 

Bournemouth was terrible but it is done and gone. One thing we do know is that if the fans turn at Villa Park, it will only have a negative effect on the pitch. I’m starting to think that some folk don’t even want Gerrard to turn it around and are happier frothing in their own anger. I’m not saying you, but there will definitely those at VP who will be baying for blood at the first miskick and it’s depressing as hell.

 

[tinker]

17 minutes ago, WallisFrizz said:

You have no idea though. You keep repeating it is bullshit because it doesn’t fit your narrative. Ty spoke out in an interview at the time saying he was scapegoated. Dean got sacked so didn’t need to speak about it, somebody said earlier about Dean alluding to too much power in the dressing room. How do you know that Gerrard hasn’t been given instruction to quell that power imbalance? It all speculation but you don’t know any better than I do. 
 

Bournemouth was terrible but it is done and gone. One thing we do know is that if the fans turn at Villa Park, it will only have a negative effect on the pitch. I’m starting to think that some folk don’t even want Gerrard to turn it around and are happier frothing in their own anger. I’m not saying you, but there will definitely those at VP who will be baying for blood at the first miskick and it’s depressing as hell.

 

It's does not matter what certain fans want Gerrard's future is in his own hands he has to start winning games and picking players and systems that can achieve that goal. 

If we are losing games and he's picking players that some fans think should be playing , Beundia for sure , then he's going to come into criticism. He should understand that having played for Liverpool.

We all want him to succeed he just has to hurry up a bit and at least appear to be getting closer to it at the moment we seem to be getting further away from it as each week goes by, more off the pitch than on it . 

[WallisFrizz]

10 minutes ago, tinker said:

It's does not matter what certain fans want Gerrard's future is in his own hands he has to start winning games and picking players and systems that can achieve that goal. 

If we are losing games and he's picking players that some fans think should be playing , Beundia for sure , then he's going to come into criticism. He should understand that having played for Liverpool.

We all want him to succeed he just has to hurry up a bit and at least appear to be getting closer to it at the moment we seem to be getting further away from it as each week goes by, more off the pitch than on it . 

Oh I agree and think it’s less and less likely he will still be here in 6 months, I just hate the irrational bile being spat which is miserable enough on a fan forum but if it reaches VP will only help the opposition. I’d possibly disagree with the statement that “we all want him to succeed”. I’d argue that some really don’t.

[BleedClaretAndBlue]

Mings and Carlos has the potential to be a very commanding partnership behind Kamara. We constantly bemoan the size of our side being much smaller and weaker than 95% of our opponents. Those 2 together should be great in both boxes if they can strike up an understanding. Hope we get to see it develop when Mings finally decides to look Gerrard in the eye.

[tomav84]

13 hours ago, sharkyvilla said:

For what it's worth I don't think Dean and Mings fell out, it was just Dean thought he was out of form and Hause deserved his chance.  We got well beaten and Mings came straight back in, no dramas, no shitty comments to the media, no demotion below 4 other captains.  It's that last bit that is the real humiliation and very unusual, I mean who actually appoints 2 vice captains and a club captain other than if they're making a point of showing how far down the pecking order you've demoted the incumbent.  If truly Gerrard isn't making it personal, it's a major PR cock up, verging on incompetence.

it's a really great point that's been largely overlooked. ok, we've had club captains before, but to actually publicly say that we've just signed a new CB, that doesn't speak the lingo, and decided to make him a 2nd vice captain over the previous captain is ridiculous

SG could so easily have said "emi martinez is the vice captain but mings is still part of the leadership group and ready to take the captaincy role in the event that mcginn and emi aren't playing"