bickster Posted June 10, 2017 Moderator Share Posted June 10, 2017 12 minutes ago, magnkarl said: I Let's hope the conservatives bring in a leader that can hold a debate without a critical motherboard overload every time she's asked a question, that way we'll be in pretty good shape moving forward. Well that rules out Boris and Gove, behind them? David Davis? Can't see it Elmer Fudd? a majority of minuscule proportions rules her out. Severely lacking in talent as has been pointed out by many about both the main parties 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakemineVanilla Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 There are two things you have to offer the British electorate to get them to vote for you - bribes and sentiment. Corbyn understood this and May did not. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 1 hour ago, StefanAVFC said: Labour won Kensington. Kensington. Tell me again how Labour will struggle to win Tory safe seats. I reckon that was protest vote. If they get a half decent leader whi isnt such a arrogant clearing in the woods that will be tory again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted June 10, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted June 10, 2017 49 minutes ago, MakemineVanilla said: I am sure there are plenty of Jews who would take your comparing Zionism with ISIS as anti-Semitic. It's not a particularly good allegory but it isn't anti-Semitic at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wazzap24 Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 56 minutes ago, Chindie said: And the Conservatives took traditional Labour seats, Derbyshire North East, Walsall North and Stoke South for instance. And obviously gains in Scotland. And that's running a bloody awful campaign with a risible leader. In fairness, you have to balance the awful Tory campaign, against the fact that Corbyn spent months and months fighting his own party before the campaign started. He had to claw back from a desperate position. Would May have done better with a decent campaign or would JC have done better with support from the PLP from the start? There are so many unknowns, we are in the middle of a real shake up here, one way or another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted June 10, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted June 10, 2017 56 minutes ago, MakemineVanilla said: I am sure there are plenty of Jews who would take your comparing Zionism with ISIS as anti-Semitic. (a) That's not what I did (and you know it), but... (b) Yes, there would. And they would be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 4 hours ago, blandy said: This is the shame of what Corbyn and farron did, in declining to co operate with each other and the greens etc. There are a whole bunch of seats won by the tories, where if lib dems had stood down, labour would have won, or where if labour had stood down, lib dems would have won. Amber Rudd, Zak Goldsmith etc. would be out and lib dems and labour in. No Tory government.... Shame? You either run a national political party or you don't. To his credit, Corbyn does. The labour party needs more mp's, not unstable alliances with other people's. You don't see the tories just giving up in seats where ukip do well do you? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 Just a quick mention for Paul Mason on Wednesday's Newsnight (though he missed with the progressive alliance bit): Quote Mason: I have a heart and head prediction. My head tells me between 20 and 30 majority for the Tories. They'll be the largest party ... er ... because I think Labour won't claw back...we might get 3 seats in Scotland...but Tories largest party but I think hung parliament, progressive alliance...bring it on. Evan Davies: So, perfectly possible hung parliament? But probably something there (sticks rosette with May's head between 20/30 marker on graph)? Mason: No, no. I actually think my head says thirty but I'm going with my heart. Stick it down there: hung parliament, progressive alliance. Link to iplayer: http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b08tn9s5/newsnight-07062017 (It's just after the 50 minute mark.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 2 hours ago, JB said: Fair enough. I understand what you're saying and the reasons behind it. But I just think that amongst other things, this election has shown us just how difficult it is to predict things with such certainty. Yes, I think the conventional wisdom is a big loser in this election. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 (edited) Nick Timothy has 'resigned'. And Fiona Hill. So May's bought herself the weekend. Edited June 10, 2017 by snowychap Edit: The other one's gone, too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PompeyVillan Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 I think the one thing the last few elections and Brexit has shown us is that conventional wisdom can now be challenged. For example, young people don't vote, Tory/Labour strongholds can't be turned, TheSun decide the winner, Corbyn is unpalatable to all but the extreme, Labour/Conservatives can't win in Scotland. It's all up for grabs in my opinion. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 Yep, and the targeting of voters by those poltical aides is also going to become spectacularly more personalised as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wazzap24 Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 'The book of Jeremy Corbyn' http://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/the-book-of-jeremy-corbyn Quote And it came to pass, in the land of Britain, that the High Priestess went unto the people and said, Behold, I bring ye tidings of great joy. For on the eighth day of the sixth month there shall be a general election. And the people said, Not another one. And they waxed wroth against the High Priestess and said, Didst thou not sware, even unto seven times, that thou wouldst not call a snap election? And the High Priestess said, I know, I know. But Brexit is come upon us, and I must go into battle against the tribes of France, Germany, and sundry other holiday destinations. And I must put on the armor of a strong majority in the people’s house. Therefore go ye out and vote. And there came from the temple pollsters, who said, Surely this woman will flourish. For her enemy is as grass; she cutteth him down. He is as straw in the wind, and he will blow away. And the trumpet of her triumph shall sound in all the land. And the High Priestess said, Piece of cake. And there came from the same country a prophet, whose name was Jeremy. His beard was as the pelt of beasts, and his raiments were not of the finest. And he cried aloud in the wilderness and said, Behold, I bring you hope......... Worth a read 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PompeyVillan Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 Jesus, a formal coalition with the DUP? Theresa May has well and truly lost the plot. Not only threaten peace in NI but potentially giving ministerial positions to a party that are anti gay rights, anti abortion and climate change denying. And the terrorism thing. Political suicide surely? Even if this a short term plan to get Brexit stuff through it seems toxic, and with such a narrow majority and dwindling internal support it could all go tits up in the commons anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 10, 2017 Moderator Share Posted June 10, 2017 Just now, PompeyVillan said: Jesus, a formal coalition with the DUP? Theresa May has well and truly lost the plot. Not only threaten peace in NI but potentially giving ministerial positions to a party that are anti gay rights, anti abortion and climate change denying. And the terrorism thing. Political suicide surely? Even if this a short term plan to get Brexit stuff through it seems toxic, and with such a narrow majority and dwindling internal support it could all go tits up in the commons anyway. They are the Tories long-term friends and allies. According to the May-bot. She said it, she should be strapped into a blue gimp suit and made to eat those words for many years by anyone from The 1922 Committee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 4 hours ago, blandy said: This is the shame of what Corbyn and farron did, in declining to co operate with each other and the greens etc. There are a whole bunch of seats won by the tories, where if lib dems had stood down, labour would have won, or where if labour had stood down, lib dems would have won. Amber Rudd, Zak Goldsmith etc. would be out and lib dems and labour in. No Tory government.... Aye. Progressive Alliance FTW. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post PompeyVillan Posted June 10, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted June 10, 2017 17 minutes ago, bickster said: They are the Tories long-term friends and allies. According to the May-bot. She said it, she should be strapped into a blue gimp suit and made to eat those words for many years by anyone from The 1922 Committee It'll end tears. The way I see it May is putting her Brexit agenda ahead of peace in Northern Ireland. She's already been punished by the electorate for opportunistically conning them into another election, I hope they finish her and her party off at the next election, hopefully sooner rather than later. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted June 10, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted June 10, 2017 39 minutes ago, snowychap said: Nick Timothy has 'resigned'. And Fiona Hill. So May's bought herself the weekend. By all accounts she's been incredibly reliant on those two throughout her career. Them going is the opening shot of the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 40 minutes ago, wazzap24 said: 'The book of Jeremy Corbyn' http://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/the-book-of-jeremy-corbyn Worth a read Quote And they hearkened unto the word of Jeremy, and believed. For they said unto themselves, Lo, he bringeth unto us the desire of our hearts. He cometh by bicycle, with a helmet upon his head. And he eateth neither flesh nor fowl, according to the Scriptures. For man cannot live by bread alone, but hummus is quite another matter. HAHA! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 1 hour ago, MakemineVanilla said: There are two things you have to offer the British electorate to get them to vote for you - bribes and sentiment. Corbyn understood this and May did not. If people can't see material benefits then why should they vote for someone. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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