sidcow Posted April 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted April 8, 2022 1 hour ago, Jareth said: The Russians are denying whilst bombing civillians and could not care less what anybody thinks of them. It is such deliberate evil and it takes my breath away. Every atrocity makes the case for immediate suspension of Russian gas by European countries - Germans might claim there will be a recession, but that is preferable to giving money to these devils. Get on with it Germany, whatever the cost. Germany is meant to still be an industrial powerhouse. They should get producing heat pumps and wind turbines like an industrial war measure. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted April 8, 2022 Share Posted April 8, 2022 1 hour ago, Jareth said: The Russians are denying whilst bombing civillians and could not care less what anybody thinks of them. It is such deliberate evil and it takes my breath away. Every atrocity makes the case for immediate suspension of Russian gas by European countries - Germans might claim there will be a recession, but that is preferable to giving money to these devils. Get on with it Germany, whatever the cost. I don't fully understand how countries are "introducing more sanctions". Just go for the maximum straight away. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobsons Choice Posted April 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted April 8, 2022 24 minutes ago, bobzy said: I don't fully understand how countries are "introducing more sanctions". Just go for the maximum straight away. If you do that you remove any barrier to escalation. I.e 'might as well do what we want, what else can they do to us?' 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedClaretAndBlue Posted April 8, 2022 Share Posted April 8, 2022 Half hour with Peskov Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAuthority Posted April 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted April 8, 2022 Is there no "final straw" for the Ukraine conflict? Has NATO drawn up plans to change the regime or does Putin have a free hand to do what he wants there? How much is enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted April 8, 2022 Share Posted April 8, 2022 1 hour ago, bobzy said: I don't fully understand how countries are "introducing more sanctions". Just go for the maximum straight away. You must be great at poker…… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted April 8, 2022 Share Posted April 8, 2022 1 hour ago, HKP90 said: If you do that you remove any barrier to escalation. I.e 'might as well do what we want, what else can they do to us?' I wonder which sanction will make it a step too far and see Russian forces retreat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobsons Choice Posted April 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted April 8, 2022 7 minutes ago, bobzy said: I wonder which sanction will make it a step too far and see Russian forces retreat Whether sanctions work is another matter entirely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mic09 Posted April 8, 2022 Share Posted April 8, 2022 28 minutes ago, TheAuthority said: Is there no "final straw" for the Ukraine conflict? Has NATO drawn up plans to change the regime or does Putin have a free hand to do what he wants there? How much is enough? I always thought NATO was a military allience to defend its territory. Should it really do a full USA and undertake regime changes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted April 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted April 8, 2022 45 minutes ago, TheAuthority said: Is there no "final straw" for the Ukraine conflict? Has NATO drawn up plans to change the regime or does Putin have a free hand to do what he wants there? How much is enough? NATO exists to protect itself. Ukraine isn't a member, it's a friend on its borders. NATO isn't going to get involved. The only way that changes without Putin directly harming a NATO member is maybe if he chooses to break certain taboos or openly commits large scale atrocities - by which we can basically say uses a nuke (which is suicide, so he won't) or just instructs the army to slaughter every Ukrainian they find with no quarter on a systematic basis (which is also stupid, so again won't happen). Ukraine will be supported in every way they can be, as a friendly country, but nuclear powers aren't fighting each other in the field over a third party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted April 8, 2022 Moderator Share Posted April 8, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ender4 Posted April 8, 2022 Share Posted April 8, 2022 2 hours ago, sidcow said: Germany is meant to still be an industrial powerhouse. They should get producing heat pumps and wind turbines like an industrial war measure. The UK still has the 8th biggest manufacturing base in the world. We could easily manufacture all this stuff ourselves if we had the will to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted April 8, 2022 Author Share Posted April 8, 2022 With each new atrocity my patience for our current strategy is waning. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAuthority Posted April 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted April 8, 2022 39 minutes ago, Chindie said: NATO exists to protect itself. Ukraine isn't a member, it's a friend on its borders. NATO isn't going to get involved. The only way that changes without Putin directly harming a NATO member is maybe if he chooses to break certain taboos or openly commits large scale atrocities - by which we can basically say uses a nuke (which is suicide, so he won't) or just instructs the army to slaughter every Ukrainian they find with no quarter on a systematic basis (which is also stupid, so again won't happen). Ukraine will be supported in every way they can be, as a friendly country, but nuclear powers aren't fighting each other in the field over a third party. I understand all of that. I just wondered if anyone here thinks there will be a public opinion red line in terms of number of casualties/type of weapons used (before nukes) That train station bombing is an atrocity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted April 8, 2022 Author Share Posted April 8, 2022 It seems as if Putin will simply luxuriate in grinding the gears of destruction until he is stopped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted April 8, 2022 Share Posted April 8, 2022 15 minutes ago, ender4 said: The UK still has the 8th biggest manufacturing base in the world. We could easily manufacture all this stuff ourselves if we had the will to. Could create hundreds or thousands of jobs too but y’know, theres just not enough profit to be skimmed off the top by the elite to make it worthwhile doing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted April 8, 2022 Share Posted April 8, 2022 Russia looking more and more like opportunistic terrorists than a military heavyweight. Whats the feeling about the action in the south and east of the country, can a very well backed Ukraine actually push them back into Russia? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoelVilla Posted April 8, 2022 Share Posted April 8, 2022 Well I am no russian-speaker but the man tweeting is from Novaya Gazeta and that is good enough for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted April 8, 2022 Share Posted April 8, 2022 3 minutes ago, Genie said: Russia looking more and more like opportunistic terrorists than a military heavyweight. Whats the feeling about the action in the south and east of the country, can a very well backed Ukraine actually push them back into Russia? It’s a lot harder to attack than defend and Russia are pretty dug in. It seems like the Russian offensive likely ends when Russia take Mariupol and can create a land corridor to Crimea. Presumably at that point it switches to a Ukrainian insurgency against the lands they lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted April 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted April 8, 2022 3 minutes ago, NoelVilla said: Well I am no russian-speaker but the man tweeting is from Novaya Gazeta and that is good enough for me. She's probably got hairy armpits but would. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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