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Russia and its “Special Operation” in Ukraine


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15 minutes ago, sne said:

Israel uses it against Palestinians.

USA used it in Afganistan, its horrible stuff, used in general just to inflict the most pain to troops, but mainly children and civilians  There was pictures all over twitter, you don't wanna see them.

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Just now, fruitvilla said:

The intent is clear, and laudable if true. 

Truth is the first casualty of war, so to speak.

Civilians are always expendable in war. Having some enemy soldier or general decide how many and which civilians that are unnecessary casualties is just a charade.

 

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3 minutes ago, sne said:

Civilians are always expendable in war. Having some enemy soldier or general decide how many and which civilians that are unnecessary casualties is just a charade.

I take your point, but if you are looking for a "clean" war, then I suspect you are sh!t out of luck. Conflicts whether Israeli-Palestinian or Russia-Ukraine are in part a battle for the hearts and minds of the peoples involved, allies and potential allies. RT closed down in some parts of the West, western news sources shut down in Russia and Belarus. 

People like us propagate the various memes of war that have managed to make their way to our monitors.

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2 minutes ago, fruitvilla said:

I take your point, but if you are looking for a "clean" war, then I suspect you are sh!t out of luck. Conflicts whether Israeli-Palestinian or Russia-Ukraine are in part a battle for the hearts and minds of the peoples involved, allies and potential allies. RT closed down in some parts of the West, western news sources shut down in Russia and Belarus. 

People like us propagate the various memes of war that have managed to make their way to our monitors.

Yeah it's easier to get away with war crimes and atrocities if you are "on the side of good".

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Tolstoy wrote an excellent essay to accompany 'War and Peace', in which he pointed out the absurd hypocrisy of having 'rules' about what is and is not acceptable in war. 

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5 minutes ago, mjmooney said:

Tolstoy wrote an excellent essay to accompany 'War and Peace', in which he pointed out the absurd hypocrisy of having 'rules' about what is and is not acceptable in war. 

I thought it was about the notion of having a truce in war for sides to take care of their dead and wounded only to continue hostilities again afterwards  that he found hypocritical  , rather than "rules" ? 

or is there more to it than that  ? ( i know very very little about the works of Tolstoy ) 

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1 hour ago, mjmooney said:

Tolstoy wrote an excellent essay to accompany 'War and Peace', in which he pointed out the absurd hypocrisy of having 'rules' about what is and is not acceptable in war. 

I dunno, white phosphorus is horrendous. It burns incessantly and is a particularly cruel weapon. You can wage war without looking to cause particularly nasty forms of harm. WP is one of those things you should not be using to hurt the enemy with really.

It does have legitimate uses in warfare, but those are purely as a means of smoke cover.

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2 minutes ago, Chindie said:

I dunno, white phosphorus is horrendous. It burns incessantly and is a particularly cruel weapon. You can wage war without looking to cause particularly nasty forms of harm. WP is one of those things you should not be using to hurt the enemy with really.

It does have legitimate uses in warfare, but those are purely as a means of smoke cover.

But compared to deliberately destroying a theatre full of children knowing they were there?

Kids - would you rather die in a bad way or a slightly more bad way.   

I don't know what my point is, just that the red line is pretty arbitrary.

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7 minutes ago, ender4 said:

But compared to deliberately destroying a theatre full of children knowing they were there?

Kids - would you rather die in a bad way or a slightly more bad way.   

I don't know what my point is, just that the red line is pretty arbitrary.

Why not just nuke them if we’re saying there is no point to rules of war?

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1 hour ago, tonyh29 said:

I thought it was about the notion of having a truce in war for sides to take care of their dead and wounded only to continue hostilities again afterwards  that he found hypocritical  , rather than "rules" ? 

or is there more to it than that  ? ( i know very very little about the works of Tolstoy ) 

True, that was the main part. But his point seemed to be that we shouldn't treat war like some sort of gentleman's game - if we faced up to the fact that wars are brutal and obscene from the get-go, we might be a bit less keen to start them. That's what I took away from it anyway. And I'd extend that to things like sanitised 'adventure' war films and military-themed toys. 

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2 minutes ago, colhint said:

Think we should give it to Ukraine

With Stadiums built from Oligarch money. How nice would that be. Every penny taken from these gangsters should be reinvested back into Ukraine when this is done. It wont happen but it should. 

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Maxar showing a buildup by Belarusian forces just across the border. Poland, Romania, Slovakia and the baltics receiving another 40.000 NATO troops. Is NATO trying to scare Lukashenko from entering the war with his troops?

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1 hour ago, Chindie said:

I dunno, white phosphorus is horrendous. It burns incessantly and is a particularly cruel weapon. You can wage war without looking to cause particularly nasty forms of harm. WP is one of those things you should not be using to hurt the enemy with really.

It does have legitimate uses in warfare, but those are purely as a means of smoke cover.

orrible stuff.

USA using it in Iraq. It's actually legal to use on troops, military bases, but not in civilian areas.

 

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