Russia and its “Special Operation” in Ukraine

[OutByEaster?]

3 minutes ago, LondonLax said:

China has also banned the showing of any Premier League matches in China this weekend because of the coordinated show of support for Ukraine. 

Oddly, if those Chinese people desperate to see a game were to nip across the border into Russia, they could watch it there. I don't think the Premier League have done anything in terms of sanctions on the Russian broadcasters.

 

[HanoiVillan]

37 minutes ago, Eidolon said:

I get what you mean but women =\= mothers. 

Reminds me of this:

'There’s this one celebrity, Rosie O’Donnell, a talk show host, and she said this: “I don’t know anything about Afghanistan, but I know it’s full of terrorists, speaking as a mother.” So what is this "speaking as a mother" then? Is that a euphemism for "talking out of my arse"? "Suspending rational thought for a moment"? As a rational human being, Al-Qaeda are a loose association of psychopathic zealots who could be rounded up with a sustained police investigation. But speaking as a parent, they’re all eight foot tall, they’ve got lasers under their moustaches, a huge eye in their foreheads and the only way to kill them is to NUKE every country that hasn’t sent us a Christmas card in the the last 20 years!! "Speaking as a mother".“ — Bill Bailey, 'Part Troll' (2004)

Source: https://quotepark.com/quotes/1921054-bill-bailey-theres-this-one-celebrity-rosie-odonnell-a-tal/

[lp_villa830]

10 minutes ago, LondonLax said:

It’s not just bots. Putin has large support in quite a few regions around the world. We are exposed to a very pro western side of this but a bit of digging and you see a very different narrative. 

This was Belgrade last night for example. 

 

 

 

The fact that they've experienced what the Ukrainians are currently going through makes it even worse in my eyes that they're showing support for Putin. 

Where is the empathy? 

[Lichfield Dean]

More than support for Russia, I'm seeing a lot of criticism (or whataboutery) of the club's stance on Ukraine being the exact opposite of their stance on Palestine. Some supporters were not allowed to show a flag in support of Palestine because of "no politics allowed" and yet the club are openly supporting Ukraine.

I can see that there are some double standards going on here, and to the rest of the world it *really* looks like the West are a big bunch of hypocrites.

[OutByEaster?]

3 minutes ago, Lichfield Dean said:

More than support for Russia, I'm seeing a lot of criticism (or whataboutery) of the club's stance on Ukraine being the exact opposite of their stance on Palestine. Some supporters were not allowed to show a flag in support of Palestine because of "no politics allowed" and yet the club are openly supporting Ukraine.

I can see that there are some double standards going on here, and to the rest of the world it *really* looks like the West are a big bunch of hypocrites.

There's some logic in that and there's a definite double standard, but even so, if you want to support all nations that are suffering in conflicts, taking the opportunity to support the one that is getting good coverage should be a great opportunity shouldn't it?

Complaining that 'there's not enough of this being done' by undermining the bit of this that is being done seems counter productive. 

If you support all of the nations suffering, then surely you take the opportunity to support Ukraine in any and all ways you can.

There's a right time and place for different protests, even those of similar sentiment - undermining support for Ukraine doesn't help the people of Palestine or Yemen.

 

[MaVilla]

17 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said:

Reminds me of this:

'There’s this one celebrity, Rosie O’Donnell, a talk show host, and she said this: “I don’t know anything about Afghanistan, but I know it’s full of terrorists, speaking as a mother.” So what is this "speaking as a mother" then? Is that a euphemism for "talking out of my arse"? "Suspending rational thought for a moment"? As a rational human being, Al-Qaeda are a loose association of psychopathic zealots who could be rounded up with a sustained police investigation. But speaking as a parent, they’re all eight foot tall, they’ve got lasers under their moustaches, a huge eye in their foreheads and the only way to kill them is to NUKE every country that hasn’t sent us a Christmas card in the the last 20 years!! "Speaking as a mother".“ — Bill Bailey, 'Part Troll' (2004)

Source: https://quotepark.com/quotes/1921054-bill-bailey-theres-this-one-celebrity-rosie-odonnell-a-tal/

Part Troll was amazing!, i remember watching in back in the day!, great stuff!

[MaVilla]

Interesting watch:

 

[foreveryoung]

I'm not rating Zelensky's comments condemning Nato for not enforcing a no fly zone. I know he may be getting desperate, but he still needs to be professional as a president and fully understand what that would mean.

[HanoiVillan]

7 minutes ago, MaVilla said:

Part Troll was amazing!, i remember watching in back in the day!, great stuff!

Yeah, it was a great show! Can't believe it was nearly 20 years ago. Also surprised I couldn't find a video of that section, but unless I'm missing it it's not on YT.

[Awol]

9 minutes ago, foreveryoung said:

I'm not rating Zelensky's comments condemning Nato for not enforcing a no fly zone. I know he may be getting desperate, but he still needs to be professional as a president and fully understand what that would mean.

He’s saying what he knows his people want him to say. NATO governments understand that very well.  We’re worried about starting WW3, but from a Ukrainian civilian’s perspective they’re already in it. 

[avfc1982am]

2 minutes ago, foreveryoung said:

I'm not rating Zelensky's comments condemning Nato for not enforcing a no fly zone. I know he may be getting desperate, but he still needs to be professional as a president and fully understand what that would mean.

Come on, get real. Him, his family and millions of Ukrainians are fighting to survive. I fail to see how any assistance he asks for is being unprofessional. He's begging for other humans to save his people by any means necessary. He is a true leader, whether an actor, comedian, politician. He's got far more about him than most the slags in western political politricks. 

[blandy]

23 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

There's some logic in that and there's a definite double standard, but even so, if you want to support all nations that are suffering in conflicts, taking the opportunity to support the one that is getting good coverage should be a great opportunity shouldn't it?

Complaining that 'there's not enough of this being done' by undermining the bit of this that is being done seems counter productive. 

If you support all of the nations suffering, then surely you take the opportunity to support Ukraine in any and all ways you can.

There's a right time and place for different protests, even those of similar sentiment - undermining support for Ukraine doesn't help the people of Palestine or Yemen.

 

Perfectly put. 

[sne]

Big news if true. Been a lot of stuff reported about working closer with NATO but no exact details.

Actually joining NATO would likely need a referendum thou, at least in Sweden. 

Quote

Finland and Sweden jointly seek co-operation with the United States such as Major non-NATO ally status

According to Mika Aaltola, Program Director of the Finnish Institute of International Affairs, Finland is striving for a similar arrangement as in MMNA status, but no actual agreement will be made.

According to the IL, the United States, Finland and Sweden have embarked on a negotiation process aimed at achieving co-operation between the countries similar to Major non-NATO ally status based on American law.

The English name means "important non-NATO ally".

Finland and Sweden will become - if the matter progresses to a final decision - US allies in security policy, although MNNA status does not include a legal guarantee of security such as NATO's Article 5.

Thanks to co-operation such as Major non-NATO ally status, Finland and Sweden would be able to purchase state-of-the-art additional armaments from the United States, and in practice the United States would provide Finland and Sweden with a military security guarantee.

For example, Japan, South Korea, Israel and Australia have official MNNA status. At least Finland is apparently striving for the same position, but without making an actual treaty declaration.

MNNA status would give Finland the opportunity to prepare for possible NATO membership in peace. Status would be a significant message from the United States to Russia that the Western superpower would not allow Finland to be threatened.

According to IL information, arms sales were also discussed during President Niinistö's working visit.

The official major non-NATO ally status is approved by the US Congress. It will be confirmed by the country's president. Biden represents the Democratic Party, but Niinistö also met with Republican leaders during his visit. 

“Major non-NATO ally status is a status based on U.S. law that offers foreign partner countries advantages in the areas of defense trade and security cooperation. Major non-NATO ally status is a powerful symbol of the close relationship that the United States shares with these countries and demonstrates our deep friendship with the countries to which it is granted. ”

For example, wartime stockpiles of U.S. military materials can be located in countries that have been granted status. In this way, the partner country would be prepared for heavy armaments to assist American troops.

https://www.iltalehti.fi/politiikka/a/a5f72427-d975-4ece-adc3-be7703c3ade7

[magnkarl]

1 hour ago, Awol said:

I get the ‘poor Russian conscripts’ argument but they are now killing civilians by the 1000, shelling entire cities to rubble. I’ll save my sympathy for them and wish the Russians a painless passing.

…Not just helicopters either. If the Russian Air Force is being pressured to get more involved during daylight the Ukrainians can really start getting at them. 

 

I wonder if this is the reported U.S SAM systems in Kiev that keeps hitting these jets or if it’s something else.

Ukraine mod reporting that 68.000 men of fighting age are now enlisted from people returning to Ukraine, while over 100.000 have joined in total from abroad  if you count other roles too. Wonder if Putin thought this would happen?

[sparrow1988]

1 hour ago, Demitri_C said:

I dont know if anyonw has seen it on social media but villa have changed their profile pic with  a Ukrainian flag and a majority of the comments are "we stand with russia" and praising putin etc

Its actually quite bizarre

Bots Dem. All of them are bots

[foreveryoung]

4 minutes ago, avfc1982am said:

Come on, get real. Him, his family and millions of Ukrainians are fighting to survive. I fail to see how any assistance he asks for is being unprofessional. He's begging for other humans to save his people by any means necessary. He is a true leader, whether an actor, comedian, politician. He's got far more about him than most the slags in western political politricks. 

But it's doing him no favours with Russia. They are already thinking he personally wants WW3, by bringing Nato into war. There is no need to condem Nato, this is only giving Russia brownie points.

[blandy]

Just now, sparrow1988 said:

Bots Dem. All of them are bots

Seems a mix of US Republicans, “whatabouters” and bots and trolls

[Lichfield Dean]

29 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

There's some logic in that and there's a definite double standard, but even so, if you want to support all nations that are suffering in conflicts, taking the opportunity to support the one that is getting good coverage should be a great opportunity shouldn't it?

Complaining that 'there's not enough of this being done' by undermining the bit of this that is being done seems counter productive. 

If you support all of the nations suffering, then surely you take the opportunity to support Ukraine in any and all ways you can.

There's a right time and place for different protests, even those of similar sentiment - undermining support for Ukraine doesn't help the people of Palestine or Yemen.

 

Yeah, it isn't easy to navigate all the opinions floating about, and to some extent there's no way to please everybody.

Obviously, I support the club showing solidarity for Ukraine.

[foreveryoung]

2 minutes ago, magnkarl said:

I wonder if this is the reported U.S SAM systems in Kiev that keeps hitting these jets or if it’s something else.

Ukraine mod reporting that 68.000 men of fighting age are now enlisted from people returning to Ukraine, while over 100.000 have joined in total from abroad  if you count other roles too. Wonder if Putin thought this would happen?

I don't think it's any sort of SAM defense systems, as they would be taking alot more aircraft out on night missions. They need them desperately, to quieten the night skys.

[Hobsons Choice]

23 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said:

Yeah, it was a great show! Can't believe it was nearly 20 years ago. Also surprised I couldn't find a video of that section, but unless I'm missing it it's not on YT.

Ah, the laminated book of dreams.