Russia and its “Special Operation” in Ukraine

[magnkarl]

Jesus, Zelensky is showing the UN security council pictures of the atrocities. This reminds me of the pictures I was shown as a kid of what happened to my grandparents and their extended family..

[Hobsons Choice]

4 minutes ago, og1874 said:

You have to chuckle at the whole "the media is lying to us" schtick. Believe it or not, the vast majority of journalists don't actually publish what they believe to be lies. The might be wrong, sure. They might have gobbled up some agenda-fuelled nonsense from elsewhere, but they do tend to actually believe what they're writing.

The idea that the entire media, comprised of hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of people worldwide, get their heads together to pull off some conspiracy is utterly laughable.

Most conspiracy theories collapse when you ask the question "how many people do you think it would need to know the real story and then conspire to cover it up, without it falling to pieces instantly, for the global media/governments/etc to pull it off?", and then point out how utterly useless and inept the people regurgitating those conspiracy theories hold the media/government to actually be... Couldn't organize a piss up in a brewery, but can work with millions globally to successfully carry out a massive conspiracy without breaking a sweat.

I'm an Environmental Scientist. I've had exactly those kind of views thrown at me regarding climate change for 20 years. Honestly it's mega depressing. Apparently I've been part of some global conspiracy for all this time, falsifying evidence and just generally shitting on the fact that the world is flat, aliens visit rednecks in Texas, and there is some kind of illuminati-type organisation running the world. 

In reality people are dumb, scared, angry, greedy and prejudiced. Those criteria account for 99.9% of all decisions made everyday across the planet. 

[og1874]

2 minutes ago, HKP90 said:

I'm an Environmental Scientist. I've had exactly those kind of views thrown at me regarding climate change for 20 years. Honestly it's mega depressing. Apparently I've been part of some global conspiracy for all this time, falsifying evidence and just generally shitting on the fact that the world is flat, aliens visit rednecks in Texas, and there is some kind of illuminati-type organisation running the world. 

In reality people are dumb, scared, angry, greedy and prejudiced. Those criteria account for 99.9% of all decisions made everyday across the planet. 

Yeah, the general level of idiocy on this planet is far, far higher than we realise. I don't know how most humans get through the day without setting themselves on fire, or drinking bleach.

[Hobsons Choice]

1 minute ago, og1874 said:

Yeah, the general level of idiocy on this planet is far, far higher than we realise. I don't know how most humans get through the day without setting themselves on fire, or drinking bleach.

And that's just my kids!

[ender4]

Only posting a link, not the actual embedded tweet because it includes a photo of dead Ukranians in a mass grave in Mykolayiv, including a 3 year old girl with signs of rape.

The post is from the ambassador of Ukraine to Estonia.

NSFW: https://twitter.com/Mariana_Betsa/status/1510966912724963328?s=20&t=RqKar0mLH3xtVVxGFIe-jg

 

[Davkaus]

The 'sad' reaction feels a little twee when it comes to that. Absolutely sickening, there must be justice when this war ends. 

I understand it's a no-win position, it's not our war, and we don't want to provoke a madman with nuclear weapons, but I feel sick to my stomach that Ukraine has had to do this alone. 

Edited April 5, 2022 by Davkaus

[Genie]

24 minutes ago, og1874 said:

Yeah, the general level of idiocy on this planet is far, far higher than we realise. I don't know how most humans get through the day without setting themselves on fire, or drinking bleach.

There’s a Ricky Gervais joke where he says how ridiculous it is that the general public were asked to decide whether the UK should be in or out of the EU but the general public also still needs “do not drink” messages on bleach. 
He said they should remove the do not drink message for a couple of years and then do the referendum.

[ml1dch]

40 minutes ago, og1874 said:

The idea that the entire media, comprised of hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of people worldwide, get their heads together to pull off some conspiracy is utterly laughable.

Most conspiracy theories collapse when you ask the question "how many people do you think it would need to know the real story and then conspire to cover it up, without it falling to pieces instantly, for the global media/governments/etc to pull it off?", and then point out how utterly useless and inept the people regurgitating those conspiracy theories hold the media/government to actually be... Couldn't organize a piss up in a brewery, but can work with millions globally to successfully carry out a massive conspiracy without breaking a sweat.

As a case-in-point, if Bill Clinton couldn't successfully cover-up an extra-marital blow job when only he and one other person were in the room, how can anyone expect anything with *that* level of admin to be successfully hidden?

[Davkaus]

1 minute ago, ml1dch said:

As a case-in-point, if Bill Clinton couldn't successfully cover-up an extra-marital blow job when only he and one other person were in the room, how can anyone expect anything with *that* level of admin to be successfully hidden?

On the other hand, look at some of the things that have been declassified over the years, like MK Ultra. Governments, especially within the intelligence services, almost certainly still get up to some disgraceful shit, and we know that our government is willing to lie to us about the small stuff, so how can we trust them on the big stuff?

There's nothing wrong with treating any information we get from our government with scepticism and trying to assess information and evidence on its merits, because they're absolutely not trustworthy. It just needs a degree of evidence on the contrary rather than believing any shite posted by nutters and propagandists on Twitter.

[ender4]

Not sure if this is representative sample of what Russians think, or whether only certain viewpoints have been interviewed.

[og1874]

18 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

On the other hand, look at some of the things that have been declassified over the years, like MK Ultra. Governments, especially within the intelligence services, almost certainly still get up to some disgraceful shit, and we know that our government is willing to lie to us about the small stuff, so how can we trust them on the big stuff?

 

The thing with programs like that is that very, very few people know about them. You don't keep something a secret by looping in hundreds of thousands of people. Every government has beyond dark things happening that maybe, MAYBE, a handful of people know about, and those people probably aren't even official on the record parts of the government. 

[magnkarl]

Seems that the US are now saying that we've delivered coastal defense missiles to Ukraine. They're also going a long way towards saying that they're in the process of transferring SAM systems to Ukraine. Another likely reason for Russia's 'withdrawal'?

Edited April 5, 2022 by magnkarl

[blandy]

1 hour ago, HKP90 said:

I'm an Environmental Scientist. I've had exactly those kind of views thrown at me regarding climate change for 20 years. Honestly it's mega depressing. Apparently I've been part of some global conspiracy for all this time, falsifying evidence and just generally shitting on the fact that the world is flat, aliens visit rednecks in Texas, and there is some kind of illuminati-type organisation running the world. 

Unlucky for you, then, that those plucky little Oil companies uncovered your cunning plot to fool the world!

It's the same as climate denial with Russian propaganda. They don't really rely on their direct communications to "work" on the west, they rely on gullible/ foolish/uncritical/whatever types of westerners to replicate it, to retweet, to comment, to post on facehole or their blogs and that's the real insidious part of it - these useful idiots spreading it for them. Even intelligent people do their work for them.

[NoelVilla]

 

[Spoony]

8 minutes ago, NoelVilla said:

 

The UN is so toothless. There’s always the argument that it’s better to have Russia inside the tent pissing out but what’s the point when the only thing the UN is capable of is the equivalent of a strongly worded letter. Whilst Russia is a “permanent member” it’s a joke of an organisation. 

[tonyh29]

1 hour ago, Genie said:

There’s a Ricky Gervais joke where he says how ridiculous it is that the general public were asked to decide whether the UK should be in or out of the EU but the general public also still needs “do not drink” messages on bleach. 
He said they should remove the do not drink message for a couple of years and then do the referendum.

its an idea , but then there wont be enough remainers left alive  to bother holding the referendum   

[il_serpente]

17 minutes ago, blandy said:

Unlucky for you, then, that those plucky little Oil companies uncovered your cunning plot to fool the world!

It's the same as climate denial with Russian propaganda. They don't really rely on their direct communications to "work" on the west, they rely on gullible/ foolish/uncritical/whatever types of westerners to replicate it, to retweet, to comment, to post on facehole or their blogs and that's the real insidious part of it - these useful idiots spreading it for them. Even intelligent people do their work for them.

And they convince these people that it's everyone else who's gullible, foolish and uncritical because they've discovered the secret truth through their "research".

[avfc1982am]

33 minutes ago, ender4 said:

Not sure if this is representative sample of what Russians think, or whether only certain viewpoints have been interviewed.

I would say not...whilst many have been brainwashed by a time long gone, state TV and ridiculous rhetoric, the youngsters are far more free in thought and not indoctrinated by history, even if slightly ignorant in some cases. I also doubt many of the younger generation will look back and say " yeah....the good old days, when we bombed Ukraine and killed thousands". Most of those that appear onside with the War come across as a little retarded. 

 

[Hobsons Choice]

32 minutes ago, blandy said:

Unlucky for you, then, that those plucky little Oil companies uncovered your cunning plot to fool the world!

It's the same as climate denial with Russian propaganda. They don't really rely on their direct communications to "work" on the west, they rely on gullible/ foolish/uncritical/whatever types of westerners to replicate it, to retweet, to comment, to post on facehole or their blogs and that's the real insidious part of it - these useful idiots spreading it for them. Even intelligent people do their work for them.

Nice reference!

[Davkaus]

29 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

its an idea , but then there wont be enough remainers left alive  to bother holding the referendum   

Surprised you're posting, and not too busy enjoying your brexit dividend