Stevo985 Posted June 16, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 16, 2022 36 minutes ago, villa4europe said: How many mistakes has pickford actually made for England? Can't be many He's been excellent for England He's a prime example of why always picking players on club form isn't always a great idea. See Harry Maguire as another (far worse) example Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 6 hours ago, Demitri_C said: Its not the best we ever had When we had the gerrards, the lampards that was a better squad for me Yes without a doubt. We had better cbs, better midfield players and more options up front. The only area we are better now is wide attackers. Most of them are really young. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a m ole Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 (edited) It was a better first 11 of footballers, but the squad is far better now. Edited June 16, 2022 by a m ole Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 I honestly don't think the current squad is *that* good. We have a lot of options at RB (lol) and two decent options at LB when they're fit. The CBs have been good in the past but are both coming off very poor seasons, and look like it. We don't have much in central midfield; Rice is a very good player but has no CL experience, and then the other options are out of form (Phillips) or seem like they should do better than they are (Bellingham). In the attacking roles, Kane is a great penalty taker but not as effective as at club level, and the wide players are pretty mixed. Sterling went years without much contribution, then went through a purple patch, and now looks to be back to doing little again, Grealish and Foden have loads of talent but not great attacking output for England, Mount seems to be off form. They're all excellent players of course, don't get me wrong, but the notion we have the 2nd best squad in world football, not for me. Germany lined up with a better XI against us just last week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 1 hour ago, PaulC said: Yes without a doubt. We had better cbs, better midfield players and more options up front. The only area we are better now is wide attackers. Most of them are really young. I think current squad is much more balanced and has a better blend of pace and ability in midfield and attack. It’s an easier squad for a manager to get right. But yes it would be lovely to take JT, Rio and Gerrard from that generation and add them to this squad. Rooney, Lampard etc would obviously be great too, but I don’t think you’d necessarily need them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 1 minute ago, HanoiVillan said: I honestly don't think the current squad is *that* good. We have a lot of options at RB (lol) and two decent options at LB when they're fit. The CBs have been good in the past but are both coming off very poor seasons, and look like it. We don't have much in central midfield; Rice is a very good player but has no CL experience, and then the other options are out of form (Phillips) or seem like they should do better than they are (Bellingham). In the attacking roles, Kane is a great penalty taker but not as effective as at club level, and the wide players are pretty mixed. Sterling went years without much contribution, then went through a purple patch, and now looks to be back to doing little again, Grealish and Foden have loads of talent but not great attacking output for England, Mount seems to be off form. They're all excellent players of course, don't get me wrong, but the notion we have the 2nd best squad in world football, not for me. Germany lined up with a better XI against us just last week. True but we’re comparing a lot of early / mid career players in current squad with a generation of players who had stellar careers into their 30s. I’d imagine Rice, Bellingham and Foden will end their careers with plenty of silverware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 Just now, KentVillan said: True but we’re comparing a lot of early / mid career players in current squad with a generation of players who had stellar careers into their 30s. I’d imagine Rice, Bellingham and Foden will end their careers with plenty of silverware. Fair, but then that swings both ways. If we can't compare them to the peak years of the noughties squad because of their age, then why would we expect them to do much better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 32 minutes ago, KentVillan said: I think current squad is much more balanced and has a better blend of pace and ability in midfield and attack. It’s an easier squad for a manager to get right. But yes it would be lovely to take JT, Rio and Gerrard from that generation and add them to this squad. Rooney, Lampard etc would obviously be great too, but I don’t think you’d necessarily need them. Scholes and Beckham too. we also have Neville and Cole but Southgate won't pick the best attacking right back in world football so I think a more progressive manager could do better with the crop he has. But that generation failed miserably but at the same time the quality of international football was better then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 I'd take the CBs and cole That's enough, the rest of this current side is good enough Maybe if he did have CBs of that quality he would grow a pair and use the attack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 35 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: Fair, but then that swings both ways. If we can't compare them to the peak years of the noughties squad because of their age, then why would we expect them to do much better? It was just that you mentioned Rice not having CL experience, but he will likely end his career with plenty of CL experience. Rice is the same age roughly as Lampard was when he joined Chelsea, and is a far better player at this point. Mount a similar story. I’m saying they’re already top international players and have whole careers ahead of them. What was interesting about the “golden generation” actually was how many players they had like Rooney, Owen, Joe Cole, who peaked very young. Nowadays I think English players look after themselves a bit better / get better treatment for injuries, and are likely to have longer careers at the top level. I’d be much more confident as manager of this group than of Sven’s squad. Just really screaming out for a great centre back. 7 minutes ago, PaulC said: Scholes and Beckham too. we also have Neville and Cole but Southgate won't pick the best attacking right back in world football so I think a more progressive manager could do better with the crop he has. But that generation failed miserably but at the same time the quality of international football was better then. yep I guess current side is missing a Scholes type to link up the play. I’m not sure Beckham, Neville, Cole would be needed given the quality we have in their positions, but of course they were great players who all won Champions League. In some ways it was Beckham who dictated the shape of the England side because he really was a 4-4-2 wide man who crossed it into a front two who could attack the ball in the air. Not sure he ever looked that great in a different setup. I suppose an interesting question for another thread is what a combined XI of these players would look like. I’d have 4-2-3-1: Pickford TAA, Ferdinand, Terry, Cole Rice, Scholes Foden, Gerrard, Grealish Kane / Rooney So basically half/half from each squad. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted June 16, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 16, 2022 38 minutes ago, PaulC said: Scholes and Beckham too. we also have Neville and Cole but Southgate won't pick the best attacking right back in world football so I think a more progressive manager could do better with the crop he has. But that generation failed miserably but at the same time the quality of international football was better then. Scholes being sidelined, played out of position, was criminal. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a-k Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/61878364 Quote The Football Association has confidence in England manager Gareth Southgate, says its chairwoman Debbie Hewitt. ... "Based on any facts on the pitch, he is the most successful England manager we've had for 55 years," she said. "But the bit people don't see is the culture he's created. "Prior to Gareth being the manager there was not the pride of wearing the England shirt. There was a club rivalry we would read about, players not getting on. "He's changed that beyond recognition and I've seen that for myself. "I've worked in business and Gareth's skills, his high IQ, would make him a chief executive in any sphere. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBlack Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 18 minutes ago, a-k said: https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/61878364 All the good, none of the bad. This accountability she speaks of so highly about Southgate, is not being reciprocated by her. They need to be accountable for the fact the football has always been dire under him, and is now finally resulting in the results we expected. As someone else said, a progressive organisation recognises he's achieved his aim, and got us as far as he can. Time to evolve before we lose the good will he generated in the squad. Of course, we won't. And we will 100% not win the world cup under him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted June 21, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 21, 2022 Sure I imagine he'd be great in a boardroom. Beyond naff on the sideline though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 Don't watch the football Look at his Wikipedia He's going nowhere 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 High IQ? What a weird compliment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted June 21, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 21, 2022 34 minutes ago, Keyblade said: High IQ? What a weird compliment. Years ago I worked with a lad called Stu. I used to call him “pid”. When he asked why I said “it stands for person of intelligent disposition”. He took it as a compliment, and never cottoned on… Anyway, GS, he’s getting an unduly hard time, IMO. Goes with the territory maybe. Seems very harsh to me, given the record of him v his predecessors. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 1 hour ago, Keyblade said: High IQ? What a weird compliment. Should have had Stephen Hawking as manager a few years ago if that is all you need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted June 21, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 21, 2022 2 hours ago, Xela said: Should have had Stephen Hawking as manager a few years ago if that is all you need. He'd have done a better job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mic09 Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 16 minutes ago, mjmooney said: He'd have done a better job. Imagine if the FA programmed his speach machine to say exactly what they want him to say. Actually, it would be exactly the same as now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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