TRO Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 6 hours ago, BOF said: Yep that's fine jim. It's just that often in here people make long term predictions and then from that point onwards those predictions seem to colour everything that poster says about the player/manager etc, rather than watching to see IF the prediction turns out right. They try to justify it at every turn. Curious. It would be like if you were to constantly badmouth Garde at every opportunity for the next 6 months or refuse or begrudgingly give any credit where it was due, because it might end up weakening a prediction at the end of the season. True....but that is not exclusive to Remi Garde....that is quite a common scenario with all our previous managers on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted December 2, 2015 Moderator Share Posted December 2, 2015 Yes mine was a general point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post thunderball Posted December 2, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2015 (edited) I cannot for the life of me understand any negativity towards Garde? He oversees a solid performance against Man City; gets a stuffing off the form team of the league (away); and a decent attacking display scoring two goals but sadly conceding stupid individual errors (nothing to do with set up). He makes universally acknowledged as sensible team selections, and substitutions. But learns his first lessons on the work rate of our lacklustre players against Everton. He does have to make his own decisions on the side to find out how it will work. Oh, and he loses our most promising players in Amavi. He is measured and level headed, and is happy to impose his discipline [when Jack the Lad takes the piss and is disrespectful to the club and fans, as well as being rubbish and spoilt]. I know this will provoke a response from some on here, but he can't be judged vs Lambert or Sherwood, as it's their legacy minus the quality they had but has now left, and after all, Tim couldn't get them firing, and threw away the one decent performance we put in so far. He has taken over a ship that is well and truly holed and half way sunk already, and frankly, unless he instantly won every match upon his arrival, is on a hiding to nothing. As fans, unless they come from the dark side, we usually give our managers time, but I do know if he is not allowed to find his own feet, and that means making wrong decisions, we as fans will end in a death spiral. Just remember that every failure will be amplified due to our immediate plight, due to the previous incumbents league position that was his to take over. Contrary to Jims view, this does not feel wrong to me, far from it, but respect everyone's opinion, it's only my view. But to be realistic, who else were we going to appoint? - from a position of seemingly being doomed, I think the board have made an calculated risk that may yet prove to be inspired. Edited December 2, 2015 by thunderball 34 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 I cannot for the life of me understand any negativity towards Garde? He oversees a solid performance against Man City; gets a stuffing off the form team of the league (away); and a decent attacking display scoring two goals but sadly conceding stupid individual errors (nothing to do with set up). He makes universally acknowledged as sensible team selections, and substitutions. But learns his first lessons on the work rate of our lacklustre players against Everton. He does have to make his own decisions on the side to find out how it will work. Oh, and he loses our most promising players in Amavi. He is measured and level headed, and is happy to impose his discipline [when Jack the Lad takes the piss and is disrespectful to the club and fans, as well as being rubbish and spoilt]. I know this will provoke a response from some on here, but he can't be judged vs Lambert or Sherwood, as it's their legacy minus the quality they had but has now left, and after all, Tim couldn't get them firing, and threw away the one decent performance we put in so far. He has taken over a ship that is well and truly holed and half way sunk already, and frankly, unless he instantly won every match upon his arrival, is on a hiding to nothing. As fans, unless they come from the dark side, we usually give our managers time, but I do know if he is not allowed to find his own feet, and that means making wrong decisions, we as fans will end in a death spiral. Just remember that every failure will be amplified due to our immediate plight, due to the previous incumbents league position that was his to take over. Contrary to Jims view, this does not feel wrong to me, far from it, but respect everyone's opinion, it's only my view. But to be realistic, who else were we going to appoint? - from a position of seemingly being doomed, I think the board have made an calculated risk that may yet prove to be inspired. Get out. You're far too sensible. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dn1982 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 2 hours ago, KHV said: Houllier didn't have a squad that was a complete bag of wank either Till Xmas it was as most were injured yet Bannan and Hogg out played man united! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanky Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 To be fair, at times, we were as bad defensively as I've seen us in years on Saturday (big claim I know). A stark contrast to the Man City game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozvillafan Posted December 3, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted December 3, 2015 6 hours ago, dn1982 said: Till Xmas it was as most were injured yet Bannan and Hogg out played man united! And another young'un that goes by the name of Clark. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 3, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted December 3, 2015 Jack's questions to Remi in the press conferences are **** awful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 On 12/2/2015, 9:01:14, BOF said: Yep that's fine jim. It's just that often in here people make long term predictions and then from that point onwards those predictions seem to colour everything that poster says about the player/manager etc, rather than watching to see IF the prediction turns out right. They try to justify it at every turn. Curious. It would be like if you were to constantly badmouth Garde at every opportunity for the next 6 months or refuse or begrudgingly give any credit where it was due, because it might end up weakening a prediction at the end of the season. This is such a salient point. It's baffling and frustrating that so many people do this. Stifles any honest discussion. What's the point if the person isn't going to budge regardless? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 Just continuing to do worse than fat Sam is doing with that shit side Sunderland is the barometer for me. Surely they can be no excuses to finish up worse than them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingram85 Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 Right man, wrong time for me. If we go down I won't blame him, literally every manager in the world would struggle with the squad we have and their lack of confidence & belief. January window is the biggest window in our history, if Lerner doesn't pull out all the stops to try and save us then that's it and I wouldn't blame Remi if he walked because the current lot won't stay up. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 9 minutes ago, Ingram85 said: Right man, wrong time for me. If we go down I won't blame him, literally every manager in the world would struggle with the squad we have and their lack of confidence & belief. January window is the biggest window in our history, if Lerner doesn't pull out all the stops to try and save us then that's it and I wouldn't blame Remi if he walked because the current lot won't stay up. Baloney, Sunderland are out of the bottom 3...if he can do it with them then anyone can do it with us. Not casting any aspersions at this point, but if sam continues to get them out of the trouble then any excuses about having a shit team to work with have been truly thrown out of the window...no place to hide. Lots to go yet, and I expect to do at least better than Sunderland end up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 1 hour ago, Neil said: Just continuing to do worse than fat Sam is doing with that shit side Sunderland is the barometer for me. Surely they can be no excuses to finish up worse than them? I think Sunderland played well against Stoke, but they were turgid dogshit against Newcastle (won 3-0) and Palace (won 1-0). I don't think that's the "big Sam" effect, they just got lucky. I hate the way people put barometers on things in such a manner. Football (or any sport, really) just doesn't work like that. "Oh, well if we can't finish above <x> then no excuses". Sunderland could have a strange lucky streak all season and finish 10th. It wouldn't suddenly make them a good side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcTheObsession Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 27 minutes ago, bobzy said: I think Sunderland played well against Stoke, but they were turgid dogshit against Newcastle (won 3-0) and Palace (won 1-0). I don't think that's the "big Sam" effect, they just got lucky. I hate the way people put barometers on things in such a manner. Football (or any sport, really) just doesn't work like that. "Oh, well if we can't finish above <x> then no excuses". Sunderland could have a strange lucky streak all season and finish 10th. It wouldn't suddenly make them a good side. To be honest it is the Big Sam effect, because everything he does is based on clean sheets. Sunderland were able to win at Palace because they had frustrated them for 80 mins, were worthy of a 0-0 draw but then from being in the game they managed to force the mistake from the Palace defender. We aren't getting ourselves into those positions because we can't keep it tight at the back. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 6 minutes ago, AvfcTheObsession said: To be honest it is the Big Sam effect, because everything he does is based on clean sheets. Sunderland were able to win at Palace because they had frustrated them for 80 mins, were worthy of a 0-0 draw but then from being in the game they managed to force the mistake from the Palace defender. We aren't getting ourselves into those positions because we can't keep it tight at the back. OK, true - they've definitely been better at the back since his arrival (6-2 thumping at Everton aside). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 55 minutes ago, bobzy said: I think Sunderland played well against Stoke, but they were turgid dogshit against Newcastle (won 3-0) and Palace (won 1-0). I don't think that's the "big Sam" effect, they just got lucky. I hate the way people put barometers on things in such a manner. Football (or any sport, really) just doesn't work like that. "Oh, well if we can't finish above <x> then no excuses". Sunderland could have a strange lucky streak all season and finish 10th. It wouldn't suddenly make them a good side. There are some 20 odd games or so, if he can't muster a better end to the season that Sunderland...excuses like "Sunderland just went on a lucky streak" won't cut it I'm afraid. And that will be my absolute marker. If he can't fire our players up to have a better end to the season than Sunderland, then what hope do we have in the chumpionship when we'll have quite probably even worse players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHV Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 I think Sunderland have got a better squad than ours Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 (edited) both squads are shit, while we have unproven players that could be good and are not showing much at moment Sunderland have a proven squad of shit players like O'Shea, Cattermole, Larsson and Brown Edited December 4, 2015 by Zatman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHV Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 Just now, Zatman said: Sunderland have a proven squad of shit players like O'Shea, Cattermole, Larsson and Brown That have won 3 out their last 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 Just now, KHV said: That have won 3 out their last 5 doesnt mean they are not shit just lucky, Newcastle and Palace battered them until decisions went their way and Shawcross 2nd yellow he won the ball last week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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