Chindie Posted June 7 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7 Sunak is a word removed but he's not an idiot, he knows he's lost, and he's no good at this shit anyway, so he's phoning it in, going through the motions. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trekka Posted June 7 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7 4 minutes ago, Chindie said: Sunak is a word removed but he's not an idiot, he knows he's lost, and he's no good at this shit anyway, so he's phoning it in, going through the motions. I beg to differ . The man doesn't know how to use a hammer, fill up a car with petrol or pay by contactless card. He might be well educated and have oodles of money (largely thanks to his wife) but the man is a fool if we're talking about like, you know, usual things people deal with on a day to day basis. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sid4ever Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 Has his blind hedge fund got an insider tip/spread bet on how many MP’s in the new parliament will wear a blue rosette? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted June 7 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7 44 minutes ago, trekka said: I beg to differ . The man doesn't know how to use a hammer, fill up a car with petrol or pay by contactless card. He might be well educated and have oodles of money (largely thanks to his wife) but the man is a fool if we're talking about like, you know, usual things people deal with on a day to day basis. I agree. He's not a normal person, which is why he's like an alien who read the human handbook once whenever he encounters someone or something normal. He's not an idiot insofar as he understands he is losing the election, he knew he was losing it months ago, he knew as he called it he was losing it. He won't lose it as bad as the polls say, this country likes voting Tory and there's too many places that would vote Tory even if their star policy included forced eating of every first born and the eradication of dogs, but he won't win, and he doesn't particularly care as an obscenely rich man, he's going through the motions because there's no point doing more. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 7 Moderator Share Posted June 7 24 minutes ago, Chindie said: He won't lose it as bad as the polls say Correct, right now it's likely to be worse, much worse 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted June 7 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7 An appalling amount of time to get that open goal. Really disgraceful. But regardless of the gag, we all know they'll do better than the polls, no matter how much pulling off of cocks the thought may raise. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 7 Moderator Share Posted June 7 34 minutes ago, Chindie said: An appalling amount of time to get that open goal. Really disgraceful. But regardless of the gag, we all know they'll do better than the polls, no matter how much pulling off of cocks the thought may raise. 1) it wasn’t a gag 2) You’re wrong 3)You are witnessing the end of the Conservative Party, I've said it for a while but the process has accelerated beyond what anyone could have imagined 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted June 7 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7 Up the whigs 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted June 7 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7 1 hour ago, bickster said: 1) it wasn’t a gag 2) You’re wrong 3)You are witnessing the end of the Conservative Party, I've said it for a while but the process has accelerated beyond what anyone could have imagined Ah, I had too much faith in you. Silly me. You're wrong. The conservative party isn't coming to it's end, no matter how much you say it, no matter how much you want it, no matter how much you think you're right. They're going to get a shoeing in the polls, maybe a historic one, but they'll be back. Their fundamental existential touchstones aren't going away (if anything a number became unassailably engrained, hence why the Labour party agrees with them on so much). They'll spend their decade in the cold, they'll reinvent again, Labour will shit themselves, gorge too much, the narrative on what they are will flip, Tories come back with some new curtains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 8 Share Posted June 8 5 hours ago, bickster said: 1) it wasn’t a gag 2) You’re wrong 3)You are witnessing the end of the Conservative Party, I've said it for a while but the process has accelerated beyond what anyone could have imagined I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted June 8 Moderator Share Posted June 8 I'm old enough to remember when the Conservatives were evil but competent. This version is much more fun. As an election campaign, it's hard to imagine a less competent way to go about this. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panto_Villan Posted June 8 Share Posted June 8 8 hours ago, Chindie said: Ah, I had too much faith in you. Silly me. You're wrong. The conservative party isn't coming to it's end, no matter how much you say it, no matter how much you want it, no matter how much you think you're right. They're going to get a shoeing in the polls, maybe a historic one, but they'll be back. Their fundamental existential touchstones aren't going away (if anything a number became unassailably engrained, hence why the Labour party agrees with them on so much). They'll spend their decade in the cold, they'll reinvent again, Labour will shit themselves, gorge too much, the narrative on what they are will flip, Tories come back with some new curtains. So I think this view is correct in most cases, but part of the reason for this is that there’s never really been any significant party on the right that might displace them. A lot therefore depends on how well Reform does. The tories have historically been able to ignore parties like UKIP because their vote share and number of seats has been so much higher, but Reform doing well at the same time as the Tories doing very badly might shift that balance. Given FPP that’s a slim chance, admittedly, but I think it still makes this election unusual. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted June 8 Share Posted June 8 Money and land needs a natural home it can trust, fundamentally. Reform Ltd., can’t be that home it is controlled by one man prone to chasing the populist vote. Yes, he might divi up the NHS for them, but next year he might suddenly be in to rent reform or clamping down on business fraud. They may well need to co opt the appealing ideas in to Toryism, but they certainly won’t be deciding to disband. The tories are being taught a lesson by the binary thinkers. It’ll all be to play for in 5 years time with people telling us to vote Labour again as they will be drifting slightly left if they win a second term. They’ll be the middle ground, between the bring back hanging and machines guns at Dover of Reform. Or the no hand outs, BUPA NHS, running the country like my toolmaker dad ran the household economy Labour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panto_Villan Posted June 8 Share Posted June 8 11 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: Money and land needs a natural home it can trust, fundamentally. Reform Ltd., can’t be that home it is controlled by one man prone to chasing the populist vote. Yes, he might divi up the NHS for them, but next year he might suddenly be in to rent reform or clamping down on business fraud. They may well need to co opt the appealing ideas in to Toryism, but they certainly won’t be deciding to disband. The tories are being taught a lesson by the binary thinkers. It’ll all be to play for in 5 years time with people telling us to vote Labour again as they will be drifting slightly left if they win a second term. They’ll be the middle ground, between the bring back hanging and machines guns at Dover of Reform. Or the no hand outs, BUPA NHS, running the country like my toolmaker dad ran the household economy Labour. People said this about Trump in a country where money buys more political influence than anywhere else. I mean - if business always got their way, we wouldn’t have had Brexit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mozzavfc Posted June 8 Share Posted June 8 Latest Led By Donkeys billboard is a cracker 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted June 8 Share Posted June 8 28 minutes ago, Panto_Villan said: People said this about Trump in a country where money buys more political influence than anywhere else. I mean - if business always got their way, we wouldn’t have had Brexit. Just checked, yep the Republican Party still exists.I haven’t said business always gets its way, there will always be single issues where there are winners and losers. I guess the one thing with this question, the death of the tory party, we can all check back in three or four years from now and see if they’ve gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panto_Villan Posted June 8 Share Posted June 8 8 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: Just checked, yep the Republican Party still exists.I haven’t said business always gets its way, there will always be single issues where there are winners and losers. I guess the one thing with this question, the death of the tory party, we can all check back in three or four years from now and see if they’ve gone. What argument are you making? In the US there’s no longer a party where money and land has a natural home it can trust, because the Republicans are controlled by one man chasing the populist vote. That’s exactly the scenario you said business wouldn’t allow to happen, isn’t it? I don’t think it’s that likely the Tories are wiped out; I think worst case for them is probably a merger with Reform. I just don’t think business has the power to stop populists taking over like you seem to be suggesting. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaoDeMings Posted June 8 Share Posted June 8 45 minutes ago, Panto_Villan said: People said this about Trump in a country where money buys more political influence than anywhere else. I mean - if business always got their way, we wouldn’t have had Brexit. The thing that I think makes Farage/Reform a threat to the Conservative Party is that fundamentally they all share similar interests. As with Trump and the Republican party, if it appears that Reform is galvanizing support better than the Conservatives, the Tories will all happily jump ship as the next best thing that protects their own interests. As much as many Tories like to parrot ideas of 'tradition' and 'heritage', really what they're interested in is money and power. If it looks like Reform offers the best chance to keep themselves and the rest of the wealthy classes happy and in control then I don't think they'd hesitate to let the Conservative Party crash and burn. I do find it hard to imagine the Conservative Party dying entirely, and I think it probably won't ,but as you said, the possibility does make this election interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted June 8 Share Posted June 8 Farage is holding a gun to their head - If they look like they are going to be wiped out, at the very last moment they will give Farage what he wants and Reform will stand down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 8 Moderator Share Posted June 8 3 minutes ago, Jareth said: Farage is holding a gun to their head - If they look like they are going to be wiped out, at the very last moment they will give Farage what he wants and Reform will stand down. That doesn’t appear to be Farage's game right now that would be tactically bad for Reform Farage right now holds the cards, He’s in a much better position to “control the right wing” as he sees it after the election not before it. I can’t see Reform standing down, he really wants to kill the Tory Party 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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