Genie Posted April 21, 2023 Share Posted April 21, 2023 I wonder if the resignation was the result of a negotiation between him and Sunak. RS possibly threatened the sack, DR threatened legal or other retaliation so they settled on him resigning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted April 21, 2023 Author Moderator Share Posted April 21, 2023 2 hours ago, NurembergVillan said: If he were sacked, he'd never be able to hold a ministerial position in the future. Resignation, though? See you in the next Tory Government! Unscrupulous words removed. Priti Patel and Gavin Williamson were sacked and got minister job after, didn't they. And I'm sure there are others, too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted April 21, 2023 Author Moderator Share Posted April 21, 2023 4 minutes ago, Genie said: DR threatened legal or other retaliation It's entirely up to the PM who he appoints or removes - there's 0 legal aspect possible to any challenge. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted April 21, 2023 Share Posted April 21, 2023 8 minutes ago, Genie said: I wonder if the resignation was the result of a negotiation between him and Sunak. RS possibly threatened the sack, DR threatened legal or other retaliation so they settled on him resigning. It's none of that. It's nothing more complicated than "look mate, the optics mean that you have to go. It's better for you, me and the Government if you resign rather than me having to fire you. So you get cracking with it". Like about 95% of ministerial "resignations". 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted April 21, 2023 Share Posted April 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, ml1dch said: It's none of that. It's nothing more complicated than "look mate, the optics mean that you have to go. It's better for you, me and the Government if you resign rather than me having to fire you. So you get cracking with it". Like about 95% of ministerial "resignations". I don’t think it’s better for Sunak that he resigns. It makes him look weak. He sacked Zahawi recently. I just feel Sunak didn’t have the stomach for a potential fight if Raab (the bully) was talking about causing a stink if he was sacked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted April 21, 2023 Share Posted April 21, 2023 9 minutes ago, blandy said: It's entirely up to the PM who he appoints or removes - there's 0 legal aspect possible to any challenge. I'm intrigued by the details of this. It's a position that comes with extra pay and other benefits so I'd have assumed it'd have normal employment protections. Which of course means absolutely no protection for anything other than protected classes, as the tories never manage to keep a minister in post for 2+ years it takes to be eligible for unfair dismissal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted April 21, 2023 Moderator Share Posted April 21, 2023 1 hour ago, cyrusr said: Edit: Also, not sure if sacking prevents future ministerial position? Where have you got that from? Oh man, I can't remember. I'm happy to retract if it's wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted April 21, 2023 Moderator Share Posted April 21, 2023 15 minutes ago, blandy said: Priti Patel and Gavin Williamson were sacked and got minister job after, didn't they. And I'm sure there are others, too. I thought they'd been forced to resign. I'm likely to be wrong though. Either way, sorry state of affairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted April 21, 2023 Share Posted April 21, 2023 Just now, NurembergVillan said: Oh man, I can't remember. I'm happy to retract if it's wrong. I think it was one of those pesky conventions which were previously the norm due to integrity rather than an actual rule 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted April 21, 2023 Moderator Share Posted April 21, 2023 Gavin Williamson, twice-sacked minister who oversaw exams fiasco, knighted https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/gavin-williamson-prime-minister-downing-street-sue-gray-marcus-rashford-b2027943.html That's me educated. Ironically. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted April 21, 2023 Share Posted April 21, 2023 Just now, Genie said: I don’t think it’s better for Sunak that he resigns. It makes him look weak. He sacked Zahawi recently. I just feel Sunak didn’t have the stomach for a potential fight if Raab (the bully) was talking about causing a stink if he was sacked. Zahawi is someone that Sunak doesn't give a toss about. He was in a (meaningless) job because he was liked in the party and it was easier for party management to have him inside. But as soon as there was a good reason to get rid of him, he did. Reports at the time also suggest though that he also was given plenty of opportunity to jump before he was pushed. Raab is one of Sunak's closest political allies. He risked his own political career last summer for Sunak by being his main attack dog, briefing to all and sundry how bad Truss was going to be. There wasn't going to be a "stink" caused, because Raab wasn't going to cause one. I promise you, you're reading stuff that isn't there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted April 21, 2023 Share Posted April 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, ml1dch said: There wasn't going to be a "stink" caused, because Raab wasn't going to cause one. He already is (link) Quote Mr Raab took issue with the report, calling the inquiry "flawed" and claiming the conclusions "set a dangerous precedent for the conduct of good government". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted April 21, 2023 Share Posted April 21, 2023 9 minutes ago, Genie said: He already is (link) Not for Sunak, he isn't. Raab whining about the report and the snowflakey civil service doesn't cause any headaches for Sunak at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted April 21, 2023 Share Posted April 21, 2023 12 months of stable, boring, low level competency, that’s all they need to prevent a wipe out at the next election. If I was Raab, I’d start pissing in to the tent, he’s been done wrong and should fight it. This needs a noisy public split in the party. Again. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted April 21, 2023 Share Posted April 21, 2023 Alex Chalk is his replacement as Justice Secretary. No, me neither. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted April 21, 2023 Moderator Share Posted April 21, 2023 3 minutes ago, ml1dch said: Alex Chalk is his replacement as Justice Secretary. No, me neither. It really is amazing how many of them no-one has ever heard of. He's the straw man fwiw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted April 21, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted April 21, 2023 In the ministerial sacking precluding you from holding that position again, I believe as @Davkaussays, it's been a matter of honour/integrity in the position that if you're found to have failed in such a way as to be removed, you shouldn't hold such a position again. Unfortunately like much of the way our government is 'regulated' it's done on honour, precedent and hand shakes, and so once you get people in that don't give a flying **** about that kind of thing it quickly finds itself brushed aside. This version of the Tory party is particularly bad for it. The number of incidents that, in the past, would have seen someone fall on their sword as a matter of course, that quickly got hand waved and moved on from is shameful. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted April 21, 2023 Author Moderator Share Posted April 21, 2023 17 minutes ago, ml1dch said: Alex Chalk is his replacement as Justice Secretary. No, me neither. A pale replacement who crumbles under pressure and leaves no lasting mark - that chalk? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted April 21, 2023 Moderator Share Posted April 21, 2023 Oliver Dowden to be the meaningless Deputy PM. That's three totally meaningless positions he holds now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted April 21, 2023 Share Posted April 21, 2023 46 minutes ago, Genie said: He already is (link) What he actually said he will chin the **** snowflakes who contributed to the report, **** narcs. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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