hippo Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 Does seem a willingness by the Tories - that the Johnson years were bad ones - and any new leader will represent a fresh start (probably not a radical shift in policy though) I think that puts Truss, Baker and Patel (not that she will stand) at a disadvantage - maybe even Zahawi/Sunnak who both come with a bit of baggage - normally that wouldn't disadvantage them - but that last the Tories want come October is some reveal about past dodgy dealings. When the last 2 going to membership for the final vote - I think a non white skinned person would be at a disadvantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 What about Ben Wallace, surely he ticks most of the boxes need to win? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 6 minutes ago, Genie said: What about Ben Wallace, surely he ticks most of the boxes need to win? Yeah - he fits the bill right now. The tory leadership seems to favour those with the least enemies - a bizarre selection process Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 Pri Patel considering standing - Gulp ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted July 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted July 8, 2022 42 minutes ago, Mozzavfc said: Rees-Mogg himself said the benefits won't be seen for 50 years and he's the minister for Brexit opportunities So he 100% lied then. They said we would reap the rewards, not our ancestors would reap the rewards. 50 years from now is nonsense, nothing they do connected to being in or out of Europe will matter over that lenght of time, the world will be a totally different place by then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 The problem is, the tory trick is to change the leader and then refer to ‘the previous government’. Johnson was always going to be binned before the next election, they’ve just had to go a little earlier than many of them wanted. But you can guarantee, the next tory PM will refer to previous governments when explaining away their record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straggler Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 22 minutes ago, hippo said: Pri Patel considering standing - Gulp ! F me, I hope not. Don't need anyone with that much hate in them given any more power. She will have goose stepping military parades through London, proper little Fascist that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StanBalaban Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 5 minutes ago, Straggler said: F me, I hope not. Don't need anyone with that much hate in them given any more power. She will have goose stepping military parades through London, proper little Fascist that one. She will make disagreeing with her illegal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakemineVanilla Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 Johnson abandoned a sinking ship and it is difficult to see the remaining rabble changing much. Johnson's courting of Labour voters and all that 'red wall' bollocks has left the party in a state of being neither one thing or another. There doesn't seem much evidence that the Tories are a party of the right, as they have abandoned every policy associated with old Tory values. They have ceased to be the party of law and order, and crimes against property have either been given a threshold to avoid prosecution (shop-lifting) or are not investigated (burglary). Traditional freedoms have been eroded and control of education is to be centralised. They make speeches about controlling immigration and then do nothing about it, except invent barmy schemes which actually do the opposite to what they claim they will. They are willing to waste billions on HS2, when the money would be better spent on building houses. After years of preaching about the 'money tree' they have embarked on an experiment in MMT, and chopped the whole forest down. They virtually endorse some forms of civil action and clamp down on others. They have an identity crisis and are still trying to emulate New Labour, which might have been successful at the poles, but was a disaster for the country. Sadly, Johnson was not the only liar on the Tory benches and most of them are still part of the government. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 5 minutes ago, MakemineVanilla said: Johnson abandoned a sinking ship and it is difficult to see the remaining rabble changing much. Johnson's courting of Labour voters and all that 'red wall' bollocks has left the party in a state of being neither one thing or another. There doesn't seem much evidence that the Tories are a party of the right, as they have abandoned every policy associated with old Tory values. They have ceased to be the party of law and order, and crimes against property have either been given a threshold to avoid prosecution (shop-lifting) or are not investigated (burglary). Traditional freedoms have been eroded and control of education is to be centralised. They make speeches about controlling immigration and then do nothing about it, except invent barmy schemes which actually do the opposite to what they claim they will. They are willing to waste billions on HS2, when the money would be better spent on building houses. After years of preaching about the 'money tree' they have embarked on an experiment in MMT, and chopped the whole forest down. They virtually endorse some forms of civil action and clamp down on others. They have an identity crisis and are still trying to emulate New Labour, which might have been successful at the poles, but was a disaster for the country. Sadly, Johnson was not the only liar on the Tory benches and most of them are still part of the government. Yeah clearing the deficit and paying back furlough have long ceased to be problems. Now if the money was there for furlough without ever being repaid - stop dickin about with NHS funding - its political choice to under fund it - as they don't like non profit things thriving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 Obviously they'll get a bounce when the new crook takes charge, but even so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted July 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted July 8, 2022 The biggest issue the Tories have, and it's highlighted by the headbangers, is that they've now directed linked true conservatism to being pro-Brexit. Courting a whole potential 52% of voters but losing a hell of a lot more potentially. Brexiteers are fed up with them, remainers mostly hate them now, and this is reflected in their tumbling poll numbers. Appoint a hard brexit headbanger or a more EU friendly, moderate and either way they lose voters. Not that Labour are in a better position. Brexit truly **** up the political landscape. Thanks Dave 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted July 8, 2022 Moderator Share Posted July 8, 2022 Another poll fieldwork yesterday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted July 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted July 8, 2022 14 minutes ago, Genie said: Yep, it needs to be dressed as a special deal where we won against the EU. Yep, we triumphed against them so now we have more freedom of movement of goods, less tariffs and no need for that pesky Irish border. In short delivering the promises the Brexiteers made in their campaign because they promised none of these things would exist. Most people who voted for Brexit seem to spout immigration and being told what to do by Brussels. I don't think most of them even gave a second thought to trade deals anyway. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fun Factory Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 In the last 30 years we are now having a 8th change of prime minister. And yet only 2 of these have come through the ballot box. It can't be good for democracy for a small unrepresentative sample of the population to have the power to select the leader of the nation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted July 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted July 8, 2022 2 minutes ago, The Fun Factory said: In the last 30 years we are now having a 8th change of prime minister. And yet only 2 of these have come through the ballot box. It can't be good for democracy for a small unrepresentative sample of the population to have the power to select the leader of the nation. You vote for a party, not a prime minister. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 1 minute ago, sidcow said: You vote for a party, not a prime minister. In strictness you vote for your local MP. - who could be independent of any party. We get our chance in 2024. - if not before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 it's not new, it happened only 3 years ago. Our system is broken and the media are so used to treating the PM as a President detached from party politics. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 Just now, Rodders said: it's not new, it happened only 3 years ago. Our system is broken and the media are so used to treating the PM as a President detached from party politics. Agree system is broken needs political reform Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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