The Chairman Mao resembling, Monarchy hating, threat to Britain, Labour Party thread

[Rolta]

25 minutes ago, foreveryoung said:

You guys make it sound like the perfect system. Apart from a bit of a back log, what we flapping about?

The flapping is mostly aimed at winding people up and getting a bit of market share when it comes to votes. That's about it really. 

Oh no wait, there's people fleeing war, murder, etc etc just wanting to live somewhere and risking their lives to live and work somewhere who are getting wrapped up in a cynical game of getting votes and, ultimately, power by a bunch of rich people who don't think they should slum it with the common folk, and who find fear mongering about immigrants (or whoever else is flavour of the month – it was benefits claimants back during the 2010 election), all historically a pretty easy and surefire way of getting people to fall for their BS. 

[Genie]

The scrapping of winter fuel payments is backfiring quite spectacularly, the damage is done with the electorate but more embarrassing than that any savings are now being eroded by pensioners realising they are entitled to pension credit which they didn’t realise… and then they also get to keep the winter fuel payment.

Money raised by deleting winter fuel payments could become £0

[ml1dch]

2 minutes ago, Genie said:

The scrapping of winter fuel payments is backfiring quite spectacularly, the damage is done with the electorate but more embarrassing than that any savings are now being eroded by pensioners realising they are entitled to pension credit which they didn’t realise… and then they also get to keep the winter fuel payment.

Money raised by deleting winter fuel payments could become £0

Is that not a fairly good end result? More support now going to the people who need it, rather than the people who don't?

[LakotaDakota]

4 hours ago, bickster said:

So these people in a hotel waiting to be deported came across the channel on a boat classified as small? Do you know the percentage of asylum seekers that get into the country that way? (Answer: it's miniscule)

 

According to the governments own figures it is actually around 30% of people claiming asylum that get into the country via small boat.

"Small boat arrivals accounted for just under one-third of the total number of people claiming asylum in the UK in the year ending June 2024."

Irregular migration to the UK, year ending June 2024 - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

Also not really sure i would call 1000+ people per week miniscule (1,758 last week, 1,384 this week and similar numbers again prevented) and that is just those that are actually physically confirmed and/or intercepted and escorted over.

Edited September 6 by LakotaDakota

[Genie]

17 minutes ago, ml1dch said:

Is that not a fairly good end result? More support now going to the people who need it, rather than the people who don't?

Great for them yes. In terms of raising money to fill this funding hole though it’s likely to do little to nothing meaning cuts elsewhere. 

[tonyh29]

2 hours ago, Genie said:

The scrapping of winter fuel payments is backfiring quite spectacularly, the damage is done with the electorate but more embarrassing than that any savings are now being eroded by pensioners realising they are entitled to pension credit which they didn’t realise… and then they also get to keep the winter fuel payment.

Money raised by deleting winter fuel payments could become £0

People taking up private school places offered usually had a 10-15% decline rate , that’s risen to 27% apparently 

so that’s 12 % more  children going to state school funded by erm fewer people  paying the vat on their private school fee 

Another fail for the politics of envy 

[chrisp65]

2 hours ago, ml1dch said:

Is that not a fairly good end result? More support now going to the people who need it, rather than the people who don't?

Not if Labour were telling the truth about needing to do it to avoid a run on the pound, no.

[MakemineVanilla]

11 hours ago, tonyh29 said:

People taking up private school places offered usually had a 10-15% decline rate , that’s risen to 27% apparently 

so that’s 12 % more  children going to state school funded by erm fewer people  paying the vat on their private school fee 

Another fail for the politics of envy 

Starmer's school became fee-paying in 1976 when he was still there, and presumably as an established student didn't have to pay.

So as the son of a humble toolmaker, if he'd been born a few years later he would have been forced to go elsewhere.

So privilege for me but not for thee!

The question is whether, if his parents had chosen the local Comprehensive for ideological reasons, which some parents did, would he have become PM?

 

[bickster]

2 hours ago, MakemineVanilla said:

Starmer's school became fee-paying in 1976 when he was still there, and presumably as an established student didn't have to pay.

So as the son of a humble toolmaker, if he'd been born a few years later he would have been forced to go elsewhere.

So privilege for me but not for thee!

The question is whether, if his parents had chosen the local Comprehensive for ideological reasons, which some parents did, would he have become PM?

 

What on earth is this argument?

If Starmer had been born later and went to a different school would he still be PM? What?
There’s plenty of things to criticise Starmer for (and I do) but c'mon…..

 

[bickster]

14 hours ago, tonyh29 said:

People taking up private school places offered usually had a 10-15% decline rate , that’s risen to 27% apparently 

so that’s 12 % more  children going to state school funded by erm fewer people  paying the vat on their private school fee 

Another fail for the politics of envy 

How can fewer people be paying VAT when none of them up to this point have been paying it?
It’s also not the politics of envy, it’s the politics of making society fairer. The move is far more motivated by ideology than envy.

And as someone who did send their child to a fee paying school, I can see the point. I’d be quite happy to abolish all fee paying schools as long as they removed religion from all schools and funded state education to appropriate levels.

My criticism of the policy is that they are putting the cart before the horse. Fix state education first then go after the fee paying schools.

Also the idea that fee paying schools are a charity, which is where their VATless state comes from was always a nonsense

[fightoffyour]

2 hours ago, MakemineVanilla said:

So as the son of a humble toolmaker

Really? Didn't know that

[Xann]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx28d72948vo

There's her objective.

[bickster]

12 minutes ago, Xann said:

There's her objective.

Where was she when the Tories were doing it for 14 years

[MakemineVanilla]

1 hour ago, bickster said:

Also the idea that fee paying schools are a charity, which is where their VATless state comes from was always a nonsense

What I understand is that most if not all "public" schools, started out as charity schools endowed for the poor but once the nobs got in they took steps to exclude the poor by changing the rules which the poor weren't able to comply with.

So it seems likely that that is how the charity status was established.

[Follyfoot]

17 hours ago, LakotaDakota said:

According to the governments own figures it is actually around 30% of people claiming asylum that get into the country via small boat.

"Small boat arrivals accounted for just under one-third of the total number of people claiming asylum in the UK in the year ending June 2024."

Irregular migration to the UK, year ending June 2024 - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

Also not really sure i would call 1000+ people per week miniscule (1,758 last week, 1,384 this week and similar numbers again prevented) and that is just those that are actually physically confirmed and/or intercepted and escorted over.

There’s the facts, well researched 

[Jareth]

I think we can all agree Laura Kunssberg is a rabid tory. 

[Follyfoot]

1 hour ago, fightoffyour said:

Really? Didn't know that

I thought that was Alan Shearer

Edited September 7 by Follyfoot

[blandy]

15 hours ago, tonyh29 said:

People taking up private school places offered usually had a 10-15% decline rate , that’s risen to 27% apparently 

so that’s 12 % more  children going to state school funded by erm fewer people  paying the vat on their private school fee 

Another fail for the politics of envy 

I'm not sure I understand the point, or your post. Do you mean that 10-15% (now 27%) of people were declined a place they applied for, or that the number of people in private education is declining faster now?

I guess it's likely that more people will decide on state education if the Private schools pass on the VAT charge to the parents, or they may decide to absorb some or all of it and it'll not have much effect on numbers. Either is possible. We're just at the start of the first school year where this VAT policy could apply, so sample size for your assertion is very small.

I looked at the internet and found this, which doesn't cover the new school term, but shows that numbers have been falling for a decade.

Quote

 

In England, the proportion of school pupils at private schools, while broadly stable for decades, has been declining slowly in recent years, reaching 6.4 percent in January 2021. This amounted to 569,000 pupils.

 

 

[Chindie]

13 minutes ago, Jareth said:

I think we can all agree Laura Kunssberg is a rabid tory. 

Nah, it's just rabid Corby- Starmerites upset she doesn't bow down to the humble toolmakers son from heaven.

[Chindie]

I must admit whenever I hear about private schools there's a near visceral reaction in me of revulsion. I can still recall speaking to a colleague who spent more on school uniforms for their darling privately schooled children than I was paid in a month. Rank.