bickster Posted June 17, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 17, 2022 2 hours ago, Jareth said: “Manchester would be the prime example for me there, how well Andy Burnham has managed to capture that identity for Labour,” Drakeford said. “To be Labour, and to live in Manchester are identities that go very closely with one another. Ah there we go again, Mancheter, Manchester, Manchester. He's talking bollocks as well, Manchester has 9 Tory MPs out of 27 Merseyside has 1 in 14. Which do you think is more synonmous with voting Labour? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 The most well known Labour politician for Liverpool in recent memory is that former corrupt mayor though, maybe not the imagery he was trying to conjure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 17, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 17, 2022 Oh and so synonymous with making Manchster Labour is Andy Burnham that since he became Manchester Mayor, Labour has 4 less MPs than they did when he was elected, including the very constituency that used to be his Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 17, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 17, 2022 12 minutes ago, Davkaus said: The most well known Labour politician for Liverpool in recent memory is that former corrupt mayor though, maybe not the imagery he was trying to conjure. Nonsense, The Eagle Sisters, Margaret Greenwood, Alsion McGovern and previously (if we're talking recent) Frank Field, Louise Ellman, Luciana Berger, Steven Twigg. Even my MP Bunggalow Bill keeps getting the odd role here and there. There are actually quite a few first time MPs in Liverpool itself right now, of the Liverpool seats I think there's only Dan Carden that has been elected before Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 17 minutes ago, bickster said: Nonsense, The Eagle Sisters, Margaret Greenwood, Alsion McGovern and previously (if we're talking recent) Frank Field, Louise Ellman, Luciana Berger, Steven Twigg. Even my MP Bunggalow Bill keeps getting the odd role here and there. There are actually quite a few first time MPs in Liverpool itself right now, of the Liverpool seats I think there's only Dan Carden that has been elected before I'd wager I'm more switched on politically than the majority of the electorate, and I've literally never heard of any of those people. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 1 hour ago, bickster said: Ah there we go again, Mancheter, Manchester, Manchester. He's talking bollocks as well, Manchester has 9 Tory MPs out of 27 Merseyside has 1 in 14. Which do you think is more synonmous with voting Labour? Well both really - that's a large majority of 2/3rds in Manchester and given another election I'd expect that number in Manchester to go further red. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 17, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 17, 2022 29 minutes ago, Jareth said: Well both really - that's a large majority of 2/3rds in Manchester and given another election I'd expect that number in Manchester to go further red. Its four less they held than when he came to power, Labour even lost the seat he stood down from, whereas in Liverpool city region Labour retained every seat Andy Burnham is not making Manchester synonymous with Labour which is what the claim was, under his tenure they have less seats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post chrisp65 Posted June 17, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted June 17, 2022 50 minutes ago, Davkaus said: I'd wager I'm more switched on politically than the majority of the electorate, and I've literally never heard of any of those people. Wut? Never heard of Angela Eagle, Steven Twigg or Frank Field? c’mon man 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) Couple of snippets here from an interview with Wes Streeting. He gets what it is going to take doesn't he to get enough votes to win an election and knows the kind of people Labour needs to entice to vote for them. Reminds me very much of how Smith/Blair/Brown understood what Labour needed to do to stop being the also rans shouting from the side lines opposing everything but being unable to change anything as they were under Foot and Kinnock. Edited June 17, 2022 by markavfc40 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 17, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 17, 2022 1 hour ago, Davkaus said: I'd wager I'm more switched on politically than the majority of the electorate, and I've literally never heard of any of those people. Also without looking, how many Greater Manchester Labour MPs can you name off the top of your head, I managed 4, I'd heard of about 3 more when I looked at the list Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted June 17, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 17, 2022 2 hours ago, bickster said: Ah there we go again, Mancheter, Manchester, Manchester. He's talking bollocks as well, Manchester has 9 Tory MPs out of 27 Merseyside has 1 in 14. Which do you think is more synonmous with voting Labour? I don’t think it’s anything to do with the percentage of MPs. I agree with him that Burnham is relatively well known as Manchester’s Labour Mayor, whereas I couldn’t tell you the name of the Liverpool mayor, you’d need to remind me and even then I wouldn’t recognise him/her if I met them. Burnham I could. The other thing is that Burnham seems to work cross party, perhaps because there are more tories in GM. This is a good thing/example in terms of a positive for Labour in demonstrating practical approaches to sorting stuff out. For a variety of reasons Burnham is more high profile and better known, and therefore a better example, IMO. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) 26 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: Wut? Never heard of Angela Eagle, Steven Twigg or Frank Field? c’mon man If I had to guess, I'd have thought they were characters in a children's cartoon, think Angela Eagle was probably in either Peppa Pig or Arthur. Maybe I give myself too much credit, but I'd be surprised if most people have heard of them Anyway, this is all a distraction from the wheelbarrow of salt @bickster needs for the chip on his shoulder Edited June 17, 2022 by Davkaus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 28 minutes ago, bickster said: Its four less they held than when he came to power, Labour even lost the seat he stood down from, whereas in Liverpool city region Labour retained every seat Andy Burnham is not making Manchester synonymous with Labour which is what the claim was, under his tenure they have less seats. Can't see how Andy Burnham was higher up the list of reasons to vote Tory, than Brexit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted June 17, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 17, 2022 23 minutes ago, markavfc40 said: Reminds me very much of how Smith/Blair/Brown understood what Labour needed to do to stop being the also rans shouting from the side lines opposing everything but being unable to change anything as they were under Foot and Kinnock. The tories understand that too, that it’s a danger to them. It’s the reason why Bunter calls Starmer Captain Hindsight. It’s not accurate, but it sticks and makes people think that Labour isn’t an alternative choice, just a bunch of moaners. On Streeting, until recently I’d seen him as a bit shifty and shiny, but lately he seems more genuine. I suspect it’s because he’s more on board with Starmer’s leadership methods, than he was under the previous leader and that belief therefore comes through. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 17, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 17, 2022 12 minutes ago, Davkaus said: If I had to guess, I'd have thought they were characters in a children's cartoon, think Angela Eagle was probably in either Peppa Pig or Arthur. Maybe I give myself too much credit, but I'd be surprised if most people have heard of them Anyway, this is all a distraction from the wheelbarrow of salt @bickster needs for the chip on his shoulder not a chip on my shoulder, I just happen to think Andy Burnham isn't as good as people think he is, I'm glad he's Manchester's Mayor and not Liverpool's. I might be out of a job if he'd have been in Liverpool. It was touch and go whether our company survived the pandemic, with Burnham delaying lockdown is lengthened the time Manchester eventually came out, whereas here, we do-operated with the government and secured the public testing pilot and from that moment Manchester was locked down a lot more and that really was down to Burnham's decision to grandstand with the government and play with peoples lives. Sorry, he got that very important decision wrong, very wrong. Peoples lives should always come first Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 17, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 17, 2022 25 minutes ago, blandy said: I don’t think it’s anything to do with the percentage of MPs. I agree with him that Burnham is relatively well known as Manchester’s Labour Mayor, whereas I couldn’t tell you the name of the Liverpool mayor, you’d need to remind me and even then I wouldn’t recognise him/her if I met them. Burnham I could. The other thing is that Burnham seems to work cross party, perhaps because there are more tories in GM. This is a good thing/example in terms of a positive for Labour in demonstrating practical approaches to sorting stuff out. For a variety of reasons Burnham is more high profile and better known, and therefore a better example, IMO. It's Steve Rotherham. Rotherham secured the public testing pilot by co-operating with government over lockdown (see above) steve Rotherham should be as well known as his mate Burnham, why do you think he isn't? I mean he was the lead Labour MP on Hillsborough for many years (with Burnham playing his part too) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted June 17, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 17, 2022 24 minutes ago, bickster said: steve Rotherham should be as well known as his mate Burnham, why do you think he isn't? Multiple reasons. Burnham was a high profile (for a politician) MP already, so that’s one reason. Another is Manchester generally gets more media coverage locally in the NW and nationally. Another is he’s better at attracting coverage. Another is he gets mentioned as a potential next Labour leader and gets name recognition from that. There’s loads more, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 17, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 17, 2022 Burnham cannot be next Labour leader. He’s the Mayor of Greater Manchester, that role includes Police and Crime Commissioner and you cannot hold that office and any other concurrently. You have to be a Labour MP to be the Labour leader. The next election will come before the end of his tenure and should Starmer lose and resign Burnham cannot be in the running unless of course he randomly stands down and gets elected as an MP In the meantime and the party will not thank him for that and the speculation that goes with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 3 hours ago, Davkaus said: I'd wager I'm more switched on politically than the majority of the electorate, and I've literally never heard of any of those people. Angela Eagle stood against Corbyn following the coup, Berger was the one who left Labour after saying she needed security at the conference cos Labour supporters were antisemitic towards her that left her scared and worried. She left and joined that new central political party which then fell apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted June 18, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 18, 2022 13 hours ago, bickster said: Burnham cannot be next Labour leader. He’s the Mayor of Greater Manchester, that role includes Police and Crime Commissioner and you cannot hold that office and any other concurrently. You have to be a Labour MP to be the Labour leader. The next election will come before the end of his tenure and should Starmer lose and resign Burnham cannot be in the running unless of course he randomly stands down and gets elected as an MP In the meantime and the party will not thank him for that and the speculation that goes with it Aye. I know. Yet that’s a separate point. You asked why Burnham is better known and part of why is because of him being a leading figure in the “race” and the noise around that “race”. https://www.oddschecker.com/insight/politics/20220509-next-labour-leader-odds-burnham-the-favourite-after-beergate-threatens-keir-starmer-position Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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