Stevo985 Posted August 24, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted August 24, 2015 (edited) Again, had Sherwood underperformed last season I'd be one of the first to call him on it. If you can't see the improvement in the team between Paul Lambert leaving and the end of the season then I'm astonished. I'd be more inclined to say you were being deliberately critical to cause an argument. What were the results Palace away, Utd at home last season ? How many points did we have after 3 games last season ? Wheres the evidence that TS can take us forward ? - Most people are seeking comfort in the fact that the manager and players are all unknown to us - I don't see a jot of evidence that we won't be down the bottom this season ? Those are astonishing benchmarks to use for judging a manager, especially after 3 games. Are you really using our points tally after 3 games last season as evidence we haven't improved? I mean REALLY? As in you actually believe that is a valid comparison? What about our points total after 20 games? Why not compare last season to this season, when we get there, and form a more valid opinion. We might well be down the bottom this season, I don't think anybody is challenging your right to hold that opinion. What people are opposing is you writing off manager and players after 3 games of the new season. Edited August 24, 2015 by Stevo985 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VILLAMARV Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 How long can we defend a manager who seems to get most things wrong ? He signed Ayew \ Gestede - for a combined £15m , would this not have been better spent on one decent striker ? - ie Charlie Austin Only once CB signed, with Clarks form dipping we look short in this area His cavalier style of play, is costing us point after point The cavalier style isn't really generating that much in front of goal Despite his new defence - the errors continue, this seems more a coaching than personnel issue I think we all need to wake up, another season of struggle is looming, and this time we don't appear to have the players to get us out of the mire... 1. Well considering I was still backing Lambert even after the Hull game WE can back him alot more than this 2. No 3. MON didnt like short CB's either (ba dum cha!) 4. What cavalier style of play? what points has it cost us? 5. What cavalier style? I agree we're not creating much. 6. New CB and LB maybe. as for the errors - same players, same shit (i.e Clark being too tight and being outmuscled). Maybe it is a coaching issue, maybe they're just old dogs though. 7. Waking up is good. another season of being in the bottom 6 is just being realistic as far as Im concerned. I wont see scraping survival as underacheivement, its going to happen. We have a whole new side of players to settle in, so jury's out on that one. Its all been a rollercoaster of emotions this summer. Hopes have been raised. Still 5 players away from being a really good side imo. 6/7 from having a great squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piav_k4 Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Is Hippo a troll? How many points after 3 games last season? How many points v the same opponents last season? If you aren't a troll then can you please explain exactly what relevance that has? You can have 9 points after 3 games and still have 9 after 38... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duck Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 I really don't understand some of the criticism on here. It's three games in ffs. At the end of last season if you'd seen our opening fixtures... (Bournemouth - newly promoted, point to prove, away) (United - a team we've struggled against for years) (Palace - a team invigorated by pardew, with decent new signings and likely to be top 10) If you'd seen those and been promised one win and the others being tight losses, with the performances we've seen from amavi and Adama, you can't say you'd have been disappointed. We haven't been demolished by anyone, for once were scoring goals (not many, but more than we would under lambert). Anyone thinking we were in for a top 6 finish is deluded beyond belief, we're in for a long season, and three games in is not the time to be giving the manager grief Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Again, had Sherwood underperformed last season I'd be one of the first to call him on it. If you can't see the improvement in the team between Paul Lambert leaving and the end of the season then I'm astonished. I'd be more inclined to say you were being deliberately critical to cause an argument. What were the results Palace away, Utd at home last season ? How many points did we have after 3 games last season ? Wheres the evidence that TS can take us forward ? - Most people are seeking comfort in the fact that the manager and players are all unknown to us - I don't see a jot of evidence that we won't be down the bottom this season ? I can't believe you're actually trying to make a serious argument by comparing the same fixtures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Again, had Sherwood underperformed last season I'd be one of the first to call him on it. If you can't see the improvement in the team between Paul Lambert leaving and the end of the season then I'm astonished. I'd be more inclined to say you were being deliberately critical to cause an argument. What were the results Palace away, Utd at home last season ? How many points did we have after 3 games last season ? Wheres the evidence that TS can take us forward ? - Most people are seeking comfort in the fact that the manager and players are all unknown to us - I don't see a jot of evidence that we won't be down the bottom this season ? I can't believe you're actually trying to make a serious argument by comparing the same fixtures. No be stupid wouldn't it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 24, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted August 24, 2015 Again, had Sherwood underperformed last season I'd be one of the first to call him on it. If you can't see the improvement in the team between Paul Lambert leaving and the end of the season then I'm astonished. I'd be more inclined to say you were being deliberately critical to cause an argument. What were the results Palace away, Utd at home last season ? How many points did we have after 3 games last season ? Wheres the evidence that TS can take us forward ? - Most people are seeking comfort in the fact that the manager and players are all unknown to us - I don't see a jot of evidence that we won't be down the bottom this season ? I can't believe you're actually trying to make a serious argument by comparing the same fixtures. No be stupid wouldn't it. At this stage of the season, yes it would. Really really **** stupid. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG_Villa_Fan Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Is Hippo a troll?How many points after 3 games last season? How many points v the same opponents last season? If you aren't a troll then can you please explain exactly what relevance that has? You can have 9 points after 3 games and still have 9 after 38... If you go back a year or two you'll find countless of posts discussing and comparing these. It was sort of a major thing on VT to show Lambert's progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 24, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted August 24, 2015 (edited) Is Hippo a troll?How many points after 3 games last season? How many points v the same opponents last season? If you aren't a troll then can you please explain exactly what relevance that has? You can have 9 points after 3 games and still have 9 after 38... If you go back a year or two you'll find countless of posts discussing and comparing these. It was sort of a major thing on VT to show Lambert's progress. It's a relevant comparison when you've played a few games. 3 games isn't enough of a sample to do that. Especially when a third of the sample is incomparable given the opponents weren't in the league last season. You could easily sub Bournemouth with Hull, because they were a team that went down, and suddenly it doesn't look too bad. Edited August 24, 2015 by Stevo985 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Richard Posted August 24, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted August 24, 2015 Look here's my two pennyworth. Sherwood I'm not sure about (still). So from my perspective (not saying I'm prejudiced) but I'm always likely to be more negative towards him so as inwardly to prove my point to myself. I know that sounds awful and it's an admission but I think it's human nature to a degree? He'll have to be doing very well for me to look for the positive. So since he took over.... Kept us up - well done and I know some said Lambert would have taken us down and maybe he would but who knows, he kept us up the other seasons and maybe he would have done so again but credit where it's due Sherwood was the manager to keep us up with players he hadn't signed fair play FA Cup - black mark here for me, losing to a team like Arsenal no shame but for me we just didnt turn up, we didnt go down fighting. Really disappointed Summer transfers - never had a transfer window to work with and needed to replace a heap of players. Not only good ones but shite that we needed to ship out. He's done really well so far and utilised his links and knowledge gained at Spurs. Some really good signings made . Im happy with all of them. Some really shite players shifted too. It's 8 out of 10 for me as to be perfect he'll need to be shifting a few others and make two key signings in the next week so we'll see so can't criticise transfers really happy with what he has done with the shite net spend he has been given Results / performances this season - really what to expect, new team, 3 games in, tough opposition aside from Saturday which is raw and still hurts (still not sure he can be blamed for it) I'm fairly comfortable with it. So all in all even a Sherwood negative like me is saying he needs bloody time and isnt doing a bad job so far! 16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villaglint Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 I'm still positive with so many changes it was always going to be a scrathy start. So far we've played crap and got a result against a bouyant team still with the momentum after coming up, FWIW I think Bournemouth will comfortably stay up this year. I didnt think we were that bad against a top 4 team. Little threat but equally I thought we were always in the game. 1st half I thought was pretty even against Palace, it was a dissapointing second half all round. We need to start building some momentum of our own, hopefully we can start that with two home wins this week! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Agree entirely with Richard. I am more positive ( but not sure) about Sherwood, and probably likely to give him more leeway, but think his post says it all. Maybe all I'd add is against Liverpool and Southampton we have seen two extremes of what Sherwood could give us, so it would maybe make sense give time to see which of those we tend more towards. At present, were it a see-saw, we are pretty much in the middle IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VILLAMARV Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 I like fairly reasonable happy Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villarocker Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 We all need to remember that Sherwood is new to this game too. He is now managing a squad that has been ripped apart and that will take time to gel. The club is in yet another transitional period - even the backroom staff have changed! - and needs time. We gave it to Lambert and we need to also give it to Sherwood. in fact, I would argue that Sherwood deserves it even more than Lambert given the fact he (Lambert) had been a well established manager before he came here! I wrote off the first 8-10 games of this season. I wouldn't be surprised to see us in the bottom three after 8, 10 or even 12 games but, given time and with the fans remaining calm and patient (a lot to ask, I know!), I believe that we will see a much better team in the last two thirds of the season, when everyone has gelled and settled down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nazvfc Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Is Hippo a troll? How many points after 3 games last season? How many points v the same opponents last season? If you aren't a troll then can you please explain exactly what relevance that has? You can have 9 points after 3 games and still have 9 after 38... Nah - last time I looked Hippo's live in Africa and wallow in Mud - has a huge mouth and does **** all all day except eat and shit! (in this case talk shit!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 It will take time for this team to gel and get into shape and form with players getting used to the league and new teammates. I think we all know this. Still think we need 2 or 3 new signings (RB, CM and Striker) to have a complete starting 11 but not sure this rebuild can be done under just 1 transfer window. One positive this season so far is that Tim has refrained from using that suicidal high line defending he used last season. Dropping Gabby will be another big step towards us finding a functioning starting 11. I still doubt have my doubts about Tim, but it's still way to early to tell and I will obviously give him more time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 We all need to remember that Sherwood is new to this game too. He is now managing a squad that has been ripped apart and that will take time to gel. The club is in yet another transitional period - even the backroom staff have changed! - and needs time. We gave it to Lambert and we need to also give it to Sherwood. in fact, I would argue that Sherwood deserves it even more than Lambert given the fact he (Lambert) had been a well established manager before he came here! I wrote off the first 8-10 games of this season. I wouldn't be surprised to see us in the bottom three after 8, 10 or even 12 games but, given time and with the fans remaining calm and patient (a lot to ask, I know!), I believe that we will see a much better team in the last two thirds of the season, when everyone has gelled and settled down. Fair enough - buit what are you basing that on ? blind faith ? - where do you see the goals coming from ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gharperr Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 (edited) Hippo. Google the term "variance", learn about it. And never compare the same two full time result stat ever again to decide if we have improved or not. Oh learn about sample size aswell. But im sure part of variance will teach you about that Edited August 24, 2015 by gharperr 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Hippo. Google the term "variance", learn about it. And never compare the same two full time result stat ever again to decide if we have improved or not. Oh learn about sample size aswell. But im sure part of variance will teach you about that Variance ? - damm good Calor gas heaters ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Is Hippo a troll? How many points after 3 games last season? How many points v the same opponents last season? If you aren't a troll then can you please explain exactly what relevance that has? You can have 9 points after 3 games and still have 9 after 38... Exactly. We had 10 points after 4 games. 9 games later we gained only 3 more points (PL 13 P 13), almost the exact opposite of points to games played. The irony is of this ridiculous argument is if anything, using last season as a benchmark proves that it is way to early to judge after 3 games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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