tonyh29 Posted June 6, 2022 Share Posted June 6, 2022 5 minutes ago, bickster said: Widely acknowledged by who exactly? The WPSU was formed in 1903, Davidson was killed by the Kings Horse in 1913. The WPSU suspended campaining during WW1 and women got the vote (over the age of 30) in 1918, then were given parity with males ten years later Couldn't have set it back much could it? The main voices saying that the militant Suffragettes were setting the cause back were... the less militant Suffragists in an early version of Life of Brian historians rather than people posting on football forums .. It was the suspension of the militant actions for WW1 that you refer to that speed up the process , they suspended / gave up militant activities up and focussed on the war effort , this focus was what turned public opinion in their favour , not hunger strikes and running across the race track at Epsom .. After WW1 a third of men also didn't have the right to vote , Lloyd George's coalition reformed this and women and some men were given the vote for the first time as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 6, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 6, 2022 2 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: historians rather than people posting on football forums .. It was the suspension of the militant actions for WW1 that you refer to that speed up the process , they suspended / gave up militant activities up and focussed on the war effort , this focus was what turned public opinion in their favour , not hunger strikes and running across the race track at Epsom .. After WW1 a third of men also didn't have the right to vote , Lloyd George's coalition reformed this and women and some men were given the vote for the first time as well That doesn't even remotely demonstrate harming the campaign or setting it back years. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted June 6, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 6, 2022 In any campaign for social change you need both moderates and hardcore. If it's just the nutters it gets only bad publicity. If it's only the quiet and reasonable it's too easy to keep putting on the back burner. But when you get both, people tend to sit up and take notice. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted June 6, 2022 Share Posted June 6, 2022 44 minutes ago, bickster said: That doesn't even remotely demonstrate harming the campaign or setting it back years. well it clearly does , but hey ho also , nobody mentioned a time frame apart from you , I stated it set the cause "back " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 6, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 6, 2022 3 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: well it clearly does , but hey ho also , nobody mentioned a time frame apart from you , I stated it set the cause "back " So you appear to be saying that the militant campaigners for women's rights, the WPSU AKA the Suffragettes, who were only founded in 1903, absolutely set the campaign backwards in the 11 years between their formation and their suspension of activity for the war in 1914 So, which year between 1903 and 1914 would have been the year that Women got the vote that the Suffragettes somehow stymied with their militancy? You didn't mention dates, you didn't need to. it is a very specific time frame that your comment can fit into. Just to help you, during that period there was only one party in power, The Liberals with two Prime Ministers, Bannerman and then Asquith, neither was ever going to give women the vote, Asquith in particular was particularly against it, only changing his mind towards the end of the war when he was no longer Prime Minister Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted June 6, 2022 Share Posted June 6, 2022 14 minutes ago, bickster said: So you appear to be saying that the militant campaigners for women's rights, the WPSU AKA the Suffragettes, who were only founded in 1903, absolutely set the campaign backwards in the 11 years between their formation and their suspension of activity for the war in 1914 So, which year between 1903 and 1914 would have been the year that Women got the vote that the Suffragettes somehow stymied with their militancy? You didn't mention dates, you didn't need to. it is a very specific time frame that your comment can fit into. Just to help you, during that period there was only one party in power, The Liberals with two Prime Ministers, Bannerman and then Asquith, neither was ever going to give women the vote, Asquith in particular was particularly against it, only changing his mind towards the end of the war when he was no longer Prime Minister Without world war 1 , there was no way the militant actions were going to get women the vote as quickly as they did .. you appear to be arguing that getting killed by a horse advanced their movement , it quite simply did no such thing to put it into the context of my original point ... what have people gluing themselves to the M25 or tying themselves to Goalposts achieved ? militant action doesn't work .. i'll concede Mikes point though that it does cause people to take notice 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 6, 2022 Moderator Share Posted June 6, 2022 16 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: Without world war 1 , there was no way the militant actions were going to get women the vote as quickly as they did .. you appear to be arguing that getting killed by a horse advanced their movement , it quite simply did no such thing to put it into the context of my original point ... what have people gluing themselves to the M25 or tying themselves to Goalposts achieved ? militant action doesn't work .. i'll concede Mikes point though that it does cause people to take notice Poll Tax riots, that was only 1990 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted June 6, 2022 Share Posted June 6, 2022 2 minutes ago, bickster said: Poll Tax riots, that was only 1990 the riots were March 90 .. The Tories won the election in 1992 , the poll tax was scrapped in 1993 ( though announced March 1991 ) They might have speed up Thatcher's demise , but I'd suggest the opinion poll showing 78% of the population opposed it caused the U-turn more than a few unwashed vandalising McDonalds branches all around the London area Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted June 6, 2022 Share Posted June 6, 2022 14 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: the riots were March 90 .. The Tories won the election in 1992 , the poll tax was scrapped in 1993 ( though announced March 1991 ) They might have speed up Thatcher's demise , but I'd suggest the opinion poll showing 78% of the population opposed it caused the U-turn more than a few unwashed vandalising McDonalds branches all around the London area A few unwashed is beautiful. I know you are in your 50s so you know that it's patently not true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted June 6, 2022 Share Posted June 6, 2022 It needs both. You can be very nice and persistent and write lots of well informed pamphlets but get nowhere. No public awareness. Smash a few windows and you are in the media and therefore on the list of topics for discussion and awareness. Then people read the pamphlet. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted June 7, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2022 15 hours ago, chrisp65 said: It needs both. You can be very nice and persistent and write lots of well informed pamphlets but get nowhere. No public awareness. Smash a few windows and you are in the media and therefore on the list of topics for discussion and awareness. Then people read the pamphlet. I remember when Extinction Rebellion were first rising to prominence, my aunt saying something like "why do they have to cause everyone disruption, why can't they just hand out leaflets or something?" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Zen Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 17 hours ago, tonyh29 said: militant action doesn't work .. i'll concede Mikes point though that it does cause people to take notice So it works, then. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 People that don't ditch bad code, that repeatedly cycle through the same routines of idiocy when it's not a genetic issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted June 7, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2022 Eastenders. Just **** why???????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAuthority Posted June 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 8, 2022 On 06/06/2022 at 09:44, bickster said: .Just to help you, during that period there was only one party in power, The Liberals with two Prime Ministers, Bannerman and then Asquith, neither was ever going to give women the vote, Asquith in particular was particularly against it, only changing his mind towards the end of the war when he was no longer Prime Minister The point is lads ( @bickster @tonyh29 ) what we can all agree on is that it was terrible idea to eventually give 'em the vote. Amirite? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted June 8, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 8, 2022 2 hours ago, TheAuthority said: The point is lads ( @bickster @tonyh29 ) what we can all agree on is that it was terrible idea to eventually give 'em the vote. Amirite? @bickster and @tonyh29 treated as a like-minded team. Now I've seen everything. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post tonyh29 Posted June 8, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted June 8, 2022 2 hours ago, mjmooney said: @bickster and @tonyh29 treated as a like-minded team. Now I've seen everything. we differ on a few things but thankfully we will always have our love of the Beatles to unite us 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshVilla Posted June 9, 2022 Share Posted June 9, 2022 Paying to get your wheelie bin cleaned. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
It's Your Round Posted June 9, 2022 Share Posted June 9, 2022 1 hour ago, JoshVilla said: Paying to get your wheelie bin cleaned. I agree. It seems a good idea for only £4 a week or whatever, but then you never see the guy for weeks until he collars you for £20. If I really want a clean bin now I’ll just pour in a couple of mop buckets of hot water and disinfectant, swill it about with the mop and voila! Clean bin and I can keep my £20. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chine Posted June 9, 2022 Share Posted June 9, 2022 2 minutes ago, It's Your Round said: I agree. It seems a good idea for only £4 a week or whatever, but then you never see the guy for weeks until he collars you for £20. If I really want a clean bin now I’ll just pour in a couple of mop buckets of hot water and disinfectant, swill it about with the mop and voila! Clean bin and I can keep my £20. Lee Hendries dad cleans them round by us , nice chap, wow they turn some dough over . He said they do between 190 -220 bins a day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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