Mantis Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Of course stats don't tell the whole story but doesn't look like there's much of a case for not deserving to lose, I know who I would have guessed won. Just goes to show that stats can be very misleading. Watching the game there really wasn't much in it until the last 10 minutes or so. Even then, Newcastle only had a couple of clear cut chances, one of which they took. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Of course stats don't tell the whole story but doesn't look like there's much of a case for not deserving to lose, I know who I would have guessed won. Just goes to show that stats can be very misleading. Watching the game there really wasn't much in it until the last 10 minutes or so. Even then, Newcastle only had a couple of clear cut chances, one of which they took. Are you sure you watched the same game? They had the best chance of the first half and in the 2nd missed an open goal, could have had a pen and eventually scored. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted February 23, 2014 Moderator Share Posted February 23, 2014 I agree with the first part about us simply not being good enough, but I hate how all our wins just seems to get waved away like this. When we lose we're shit, when we win we're just lucky it seems. I genuinely believe we're that bad that when we win it's because we've got lucky. Somebody else said that Arsenal away we were good value for the win. I think I'd agree with that. Tactically we got it spot on. Our other wins though? I'd say we've been lucky. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 I don't think we've been lucky we've just produced quality moments. The problem is you just can't rely on that to get you points on a regular basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted February 23, 2014 Moderator Share Posted February 23, 2014 Quality moments, or lucky moments? I can't think of too many moments of top quality skill this season. Last season you could at least point out Lowton's goal, Weimann's at Anfield, any one of a few from Benteke. I'm struggling this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyAnty Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 In isolation, today's performance was "ok". We threatened a fair bit for 20 mins in the first half, and Newcastle only looked dangers in the last 10 mins. But you can't look at league matches in isolation. You have to look at them in context, but all these league matches add up. And in the context of the season (and last season) we just weren't good enough yet again. I can't remember the last time we properly beat a team. I know we've won matches, but the opposition in those games could easily feel hard done by as we've not really looked dominant. Look at Hull yesterday, even Norwich today. Really good value for their wins. We seem to just scrape through when we do win a match. It's horrible. We're absolutely bloody awful. I agree with the first part about us simply not being good enough, but I hate how all our wins just seems to get waved away like this. When we lose we're shit, when we win we're just lucky it seems. We're where we deserve to be in my opinion. We've had a few games where we've got a bit less/more than we probably deserved, eg Chelsea away, Man City at home, but overall we've just been utterly horrible to watch. Failing to score in more than 10 matches, and nearly always playing the sort of abject, pathetic excuse for football that we saw today. The only real reason I can come up with for sticking with Lambert is that I wouldn't trust Lerner and Faulkner to pick a raffle ticket at a village garden party, much less yet another manager, but what a miserable defence of Lambert that is. Crap football, crap tactics, crap subs, crap results and crap players, but we're too scared (and probably, too poor) to sack him. I'm getting to the point where I'm thinking of letting my kids support who they want. My son started watching the match today with me, but quickly lost interest, and who can blame him. Its getting to that stage. There are 10-12 teams in prem league who are just wanting to survive every year. They set out to put everyone behind the ball and counter attack. Hopefully grabbing a 1-0 win or even a 0-0 isnt bad. Things aren't going to change. Unfortunately money has destroyed football. Right through from the bosman free to the billionaires looking a cheap insurance policy. I say, how many years are fans going to put up with the scraps been fed from rich boys table and pay not to be entertained. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Of course stats don't tell the whole story but doesn't look like there's much of a case for not deserving to lose, I know who I would have guessed won. Just goes to show that stats can be very misleading. Watching the game there really wasn't much in it until the last 10 minutes or so. Even then, Newcastle only had a couple of clear cut chances, one of which they took. Are you sure you watched the same game? They had the best chance of the first half and in the 2nd missed an open goal, could have had a pen and eventually scored. Yes. As hard as it may be to believe, some people have different opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electric Avenue Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Rumours going round there was a bust up between the Villa players in the tunnel after the game. Is there anything on here about it? Think Lambert and the players may be had a go at each other ? Lambert went off without even acknowledging the away support i think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Quality moments, or lucky moments? I can't think of too many moments of top quality skill this season. Last season you could at least point out Lowton's goal, Weimann's at Anfield, any one of a few from Benteke. I'm struggling this season. Bacunas free kick against city and delph against Southampton are 2 quality moments that helped us get 6 unexpected points. Don't get me wrong, the performances have been abysmal and like its been previously said we haven't managed more than one victory where you thought that we really did deserve it for the whole game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Of course stats don't tell the whole story but doesn't look like there's much of a case for not deserving to lose, I know who I would have guessed won.Just goes to show that stats can be very misleading. Watching the game there really wasn't much in it until the last 10 minutes or so. Even then, Newcastle only had a couple of clear cut chances, one of which they took. Are you sure you watched the same game? They had the best chance of the first half and in the 2nd missed an open goal, could have had a pen and eventually scored. Yes. As hard as it may be to believe, some people have different opinions. It is hard to believe anyone thinks we didn't deserve to lose today's game. What's changed for you this season? We're not doing any better than when you wanted him sacked last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffy Biro Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Were stuck between a rock and a hard place really, sacking him would be hasty right now even thought theres a very legitimate argument for doing so and if we stick with him we'll continue to get the same dire football and results. Must admit hes managed to completely change my mind in like 2-3 weeks, gone from a new contract being a good idea to me now thinking we should cut our losses in the summer. I just don't see how they could possibly give this man a new contract for the job he's doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Of course stats don't tell the whole story but doesn't look like there's much of a case for not deserving to lose, I know who I would have guessed won. Just goes to show that stats can be very misleading. Watching the game there really wasn't much in it until the last 10 minutes or so. Even then, Newcastle only had a couple of clear cut chances, one of which they took. Are you sure you watched the same game? They had the best chance of the first half and in the 2nd missed an open goal, could have had a pen and eventually scored. Yes. As hard as it may be to believe, some people have different opinions. Ok Mantis we didn't play to bad against Newcastle, first half especially. But to be fair they were rubbish and there for the taking. You cant tell me they played a great game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunnski Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 I don't think we've been lucky we've just produced quality moments. The problem is you just can't rely on that to get you points on a regular basis. Yeah you rely on strikers scoring goals to get you points and a decent defence. In the last 3 games we could of had 2 or 3 goals in each of them if our strikers were playing anyway decent. The decision making by Gabby,Benteke and Weimann has been terrible and some of the chances they have missed has been woeful. That's as big a reason as any as to why we have only picked up 1 point in our last 3 games and its been happening all season long. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romavillan Posted February 23, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23, 2014 I know it's ifs and buts etc but still if you go to the match thread and see the comments from the first half, there's a lot of stuff about how well we played. Lot's of people questioning why we can't play like that all the time etc. If it werent' for the knock to Westwood I don't think we'd have lost today, or at least not imploded so spectacularly. I think Lambert will be as pissed off as the rest of us about losing. I think he set his team up well today, not his fault that Westwood got a knock, that Benteke had a very bad day at the office either. When we were 3 v 2 with Weimann available to the right and Gabby to the left and he tamely poked it at the defender I couldn't believe it. Not Lambert's fault Bertrand lost his cool and went in two footed to pick up a booking... I could go on, but the point is today I think Lambert got it right. As he has done on lots of occasions. Today was about players failing on the pitch to do what they are paid to do. Fair enough Lambert put that team together, along with the academy payers he inherited + Delph and Guzan. I might be in the minority on hear but even after today I have faith in what he's trying to do here. I'd give him this summer to improve the team and see where we are next year, if it's still relegation fights this time next year then we should be looking elsewhere. I seriously doubt it will be if we see out this season without a total disaster. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 (edited) Of course stats don't tell the whole story but doesn't look like there's much of a case for not deserving to lose, I know who I would have guessed won. Just goes to show that stats can be very misleading. Watching the game there really wasn't much in it until the last 10 minutes or so. Even then, Newcastle only had a couple of clear cut chances, one of which they took. Are you sure you watched the same game? They had the best chance of the first half and in the 2nd missed an open goal, could have had a pen and eventually scored. Yes. As hard as it may be to believe, some people have different opinions. It is hard to believe anyone thinks we didn't deserve to lose today's game. What's changed for you this season? We're not doing any better than when you wanted him sacked last season. You'll just have to deal with it. That's life I'm afraid. I see you're bringing this up again. If you can't see what's different now compared to last January then that's your problem. Honestly, you shoe-horning this into conversations is getting pretty tiresome now. It's not even relevant most of the time. Of course stats don't tell the whole story but doesn't look like there's much of a case for not deserving to lose, I know who I would have guessed won. Just goes to show that stats can be very misleading. Watching the game there really wasn't much in it until the last 10 minutes or so. Even then, Newcastle only had a couple of clear cut chances, one of which they took. Are you sure you watched the same game? They had the best chance of the first half and in the 2nd missed an open goal, could have had a pen and eventually scored. Yes. As hard as it may be to believe, some people have different opinions. Ok Mantis we didn't play to bad against Newcastle, first half especially. But to be fair they were rubbish and there for the taking. You cant tell me they played a great game. Of course I can't tell you that. If you actually read my post you'll see that I thought both teams were very poor. Edited February 23, 2014 by Mantis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 I know it's ifs and buts etc but still if you go to the match thread and see the comments from the first half, there's a lot of stuff about how well we played. Lot's of people questioning why we can't play like that all the time etc. If it werent' for the knock to Westwood I don't think we'd have lost today, or at least not imploded so spectacularly. I think Lambert will be as pissed off as the rest of us about losing. I think he set his team up well today, not his fault that Westwood got a knock, that Benteke had a very bad day at the office either. When we were 3 v 2 with Weimann available to the right and Gabby to the left and he tamely poked it at the defender I couldn't believe it. Not Lambert's fault Bertrand lost his cool and went in two footed to pick up a booking... I could go on, but the point is today I think Lambert got it right. As he has done on lots of occasions. Today was about players failing on the pitch to do what they are paid to do. Fair enough Lambert put that team together, along with the academy payers he inherited + Delph and Guzan. I might be in the minority on hear but even after today I have faith in what he's trying to do here. I'd give him this summer to improve the team and see where we are next year, if it's still relegation fights this time next year then we should be looking elsewhere. I seriously doubt it will be if we see out this season without a total disaster. He gets away pretty easily. If the players were doing well he'd be getting praised for his signings, coaching and tactics but when they don't he gets away with it and the players are blamed. Our front 3 look devoid of any confidence, I think that's down to the manager. Our lack of quality on the bench is down to the manager and the owner and let's be honest our awful style of football is a major reason why our players have no confidence on the ball and results are shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunnski Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 I know it's ifs and buts etc but still if you go to the match thread and see the comments from the first half, there's a lot of stuff about how well we played. Lot's of people questioning why we can't play like that all the time etc. If it werent' for the knock to Westwood I don't think we'd have lost today, or at least not imploded so spectacularly. I think Lambert will be as pissed off as the rest of us about losing. I think he set his team up well today, not his fault that Westwood got a knock, that Benteke had a very bad day at the office either. When we were 3 v 2 with Weimann available to the right and Gabby to the left and he tamely poked it at the defender I couldn't believe it. Not Lambert's fault Bertrand lost his cool and went in two footed to pick up a booking... I could go on, but the point is today I think Lambert got it right. As he has done on lots of occasions. Today was about players failing on the pitch to do what they are paid to do. Fair enough Lambert put that team together, along with the academy payers he inherited + Delph and Guzan. I might be in the minority on hear but even after today I have faith in what he's trying to do here. I'd give him this summer to improve the team and see where we are next year, if it's still relegation fights this time next year then we should be looking elsewhere. I seriously doubt it will be if we see out this season without a total disaster. Good post and I agree with alot of it but imo Lambert should of replaced one of the attackers as they were all playing shit. We could of brought on Albrighton and we all know that he would of got us up the pitch and kept the ball better than any of our forwards were doing. We sat back too much and invited pressure on which is not going to work if your forwards cant keep the ball up the other end and give the defence a break. We got what deserved but its never going to be easy when our strikers all look clueless and can't score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deeps Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 This mans a tactical genius. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Do those blaming the players not think that 26 games of playing long ball probably isn't the best way to get players confident, comfortable and more importantly getting our front 3 scoring. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Quality moments, or lucky moments? I can't think of too many moments of top quality skill this season. Last season you could at least point out Lowton's goal, Weimann's at Anfield, any one of a few from Benteke. I'm struggling this season. All 3 of Delph's have been sublime. Bacuna's free kicks. Westwood's equaliser against the Baggies. It's a bit of a weird point really. I'd agree with John that moments of quality see us where we are rather than luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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