MakemineVanilla Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Interesting Paradox in the last game (bravely assuming that Italy will beat Costa Rica tonight): We will be relying on Italy to beat Uruguay, but Uruguay will be relying on us to get something out of the Costa Rice game. Should it look like Uruguay are going to triumph against Italy, then we should throw the game against Costa Rica. That'd wipe the smile from Suarez's face. (I'm not actually bitter about Suarez at all, fair play to him, that was some performance). Don't blame Suarez, blame The Sun for winding him up. No I don't blame Suarez, if anything my estimation of him has gone up slightly. It is hard to think of a player who enjoyed scoring more than he did. I wondered whether that joy was in any way added to by how he felt he was treated during his various controversies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Chiles yesterday was abominable. Especially that Honest Engerland shite. Good honest England. Honourable England. Noble England. Don't cheat, don't dive. It isn't in England's noble blood to dive and cheat and con the ref. No sir. Honest England play it fair. Those damned foreigners, on the other hand - Cheats. Poor Honest England. Maybe Honest England should cheat more often. Maybe then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Thing is, people's criticisms of him still stand. Nobody has tried to claim that he isn't a good footballer player. What people have said is that he's got a wild temperament that can sometimes get him into trouble. Personally I don't think it'll be long before he puts his foot in it yet again. Great player but still scum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coda Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 I blame Italy and Uruguay for scoring more goals than us. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lapal_fan Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 I'd rather players snap out in fustration because they care then have a 34 year old captain who tells the younger lads in the camp how shit it feels to be dumped out of a world cup early - and then that player being by far the worst on the pitch.. looking completely sorry for himself at the end of the game. What a leader. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhan_Zhuang Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Anyone else think the referee had a complete stinker of a match? I mean Lugano should have gone for a second yellow after what 25minutes, in other matches elbows have all been given yellow cards. I thought before the match he'd let them off for a few things differently to a northern European referee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakemineVanilla Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Chiles yesterday was abominable. Especially that Honest Engerland shite. Good honest England. Honourable England. Noble England. Don't cheat, don't dive. It isn't in England's noble blood to dive and cheat and con the ref. No sir. Honest England play it fair. Those damned foreigners, on the other hand - Cheats. Poor Honest England. Maybe Honest England should cheat more often. Maybe then... England definitely cheat but they are disappointingly poor at it. Cheating is integral to the game and good teams just seem better at making the cheating part of their strategy, while England just waste their opportunities in niggly acts of revenge or frustration, which serves them badly. Example: Last night the defender hitting Sterling around the face, to try and provoke him, versus Gerrard tackling too hard, when it served no purpose, and which got him booked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lapal_fan Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 The ref ruined any flow of play. He didn't give cards when he should have, and he gave cards when he shouldn't have. I'd say only 60% of his calls were any good. I don't know where he is from, but he seemed like a Portuguese kind of ref - niggily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted June 20, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted June 20, 2014 The foreign player argument isn't xenophobic. It's just completely inaccurate and based on more or less zero evidence. It's just an easy line to spout. If the Premier League was 100% English our national team would be considerably poorer. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaw_nuff Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 The foreign player argument isn't xenophobic. It's just completely inaccurate and based on more or less zero evidence. It's just an easy line to spout. If the Premier League was 100% English our national team would be considerably poorer. You're right to a certain degree. The real problem is that we don't have many players in other leagues - is it because they are technically inadiquate or too expensive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bradd92 Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 (edited) Anyone listened to Chris Waddles rant? Spot on imo. Said what we all think pretty much, we select players on the team they play for instead of how well they will complement each other. Edited June 20, 2014 by Bradd92 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted June 20, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted June 20, 2014 Interestingly, we've just had a presentation at work from Greg Searle (Olympic gold medallist at Barcelona and part of the 2012 team) He made a point that a huge approach from the Olympic team, not just the rowers, was to listen to the youth and emphasise your goals and successes, not past misery or failure. He specifically said when he'd heard that Gerrard had spoken to the England team about how crap it was going out of the world cup in previous tournaments, he said it was pretty much the worst thing they could have done, in his opinion. The emphasis should have been on how they succeed and how they win, not how NOT to fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 The foreign player argument isn't xenophobic. It's just completely inaccurate and based on more or less zero evidence. It's just an easy line to spout. If the Premier League was 100% English our national team would be considerably poorer. Doesn't it stand to reason that the smaller the pool of players we have to choose from the less likely we are to succeed at international level? I think playing with players like Suarez, Aguero, tourre, RVP raises the level of our game but then you have the likes of Tonev and Luna who offer nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted June 20, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted June 20, 2014 (edited) The foreign player argument isn't xenophobic. It's just completely inaccurate and based on more or less zero evidence. It's just an easy line to spout. If the Premier League was 100% English our national team would be considerably poorer. Doesn't it stand to reason that the smaller the pool of players we have to choose from the less likely we are to succeed at international level? I think playing with players like Suarez, Aguero, tourre, RVP raises the level of our game but then you have the likes of Tonev and Luna who offer nothing. We have exactly the same pool of players to choose from that we would have if there were no foreigners. If the English players aren't good enough to keep their place ahead of Luna and Tonev, then they're not good enough to play for England. Edited June 20, 2014 by Stevo985 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 The foreign player argument isn't xenophobic. It's just completely inaccurate and based on more or less zero evidence. It's just an easy line to spout. If the Premier League was 100% English our national team would be considerably poorer. Doesn't it stand to reason that the smaller the pool of players we have to choose from the less likely we are to succeed at international level? I think playing with players like Suarez, Aguero, tourre, RVP raises the level of our game but then you have the likes of Tonev and Luna who offer nothing. We have exactly the same pool of players to choose from that we would have if there were no foreigners. If the English players aren't good enough to keep their place ahead of Luna and Tonev, then they're not good enough to play for England. True but we have some talented kids at Villa who have been held back by the Tonevs and Luna's. I can see your point but some youngsters don't get the opportunity if they don't look exceptional. Would someone like David Platt have succeeded in this era? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voinjama Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Anyone else think the referee had a complete stinker of a match? I mean Lugano should have gone for a second yellow after what 25minutes, in other matches elbows have all been given yellow cards. I thought before the match he'd let them off for a few things differently to a northern European referee. I agree with your general point. But surely you mean Godin and not Lugano? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted June 20, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted June 20, 2014 (edited) The foreign player argument isn't xenophobic. It's just completely inaccurate and based on more or less zero evidence. It's just an easy line to spout. If the Premier League was 100% English our national team would be considerably poorer. Doesn't it stand to reason that the smaller the pool of players we have to choose from the less likely we are to succeed at international level? I think playing with players like Suarez, Aguero, tourre, RVP raises the level of our game but then you have the likes of Tonev and Luna who offer nothing. We have exactly the same pool of players to choose from that we would have if there were no foreigners. If the English players aren't good enough to keep their place ahead of Luna and Tonev, then they're not good enough to play for England. True but we have some talented kids at Villa who have been held back by the Tonevs and Luna's. I can see your point but some youngsters don't get the opportunity if they don't look exceptional. Would someone like David Platt have succeeded in this era? Then they're not good enough. It's not like we're scraping together 11 players for the national team is it? It means the players that make it in the premier league are better. They need to be better, they play with better, they learn from better. If they're not good enough then they play lower down the leagues. They're still there, available for selection. If the league was entirely English then players wouldn't have to be as good to play at the top level. Edited June 20, 2014 by Stevo985 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 The foreign player argument isn't xenophobic. It's just completely inaccurate and based on more or less zero evidence. It's just an easy line to spout. If the Premier League was 100% English our national team would be considerably poorer. Doesn't it stand to reason that the smaller the pool of players we have to choose from the less likely we are to succeed at international level? I think playing with players like Suarez, Aguero, tourre, RVP raises the level of our game but then you have the likes of Tonev and Luna who offer nothing. We have exactly the same pool of players to choose from that we would have if there were no foreigners. If the English players aren't good enough to keep their place ahead of Luna and Tonev, then they're not good enough to play for England. True but we have some talented kids at Villa who have been held back by the Tonevs and Luna's. I can see your point but some youngsters don't get the opportunity if they don't look exceptional. Would someone like David Platt have succeeded in this era? Then they're not good enough. It's not like we're scraping together 11 players for the national team is it? It means the players that make it in the premier league are better. They need to be better, they play with better, they learn from better. If they're not good enough then they play lower down the leagues. They're still there, available for selection. Fair enougn, we do have some good young players coming through. Its time to forget the older players now and invest in youth for the euros.....If Gerrard is still playing in the qualifiers then I will dispair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted June 20, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted June 20, 2014 I think old players have their place. What we need to stop is having old players in there because of who they are. Gerrard is there because he's Steven Gerrard. If he was a 21 year old playing in his first tournament then he'd be dropped for the Costa Rica game. BUt he won't be, because he's Gerrard and he's captain. I do think Roy has tackled this somewhat. But clearly not completely. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Rev Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 I think Rev will be glad to hear you won't be wiping your arse with his phone. In my defence, it's not my phone. I've an Android phone. I saw the picture on Twitter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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