Chindie

It's been a really good watch but it's become increasingly dark, obviously hitting a high point tonight. Lol's dad is incredibly well played, with some very difficult scenes. He has a very quiet menace of the common man who also happens to be unhinged and violent. The final scenes had me struggling to watch, made all the worse by knowing it was coming. The final ep is going to be jam packed, there are so many storylines to tie up.

...**** hell This is England 86 is bleak :|. Brilliant but bleak.

Agreed - it's looking like it's shaping up into a good wee series. Shame it's only going to be 4 episodes though - hope they manage to get a commission for more. Still trying to work out why I fancy Smell though - so wrong :oops: Yeah I would say fancying Smell is a bit wrong, she's not exactly a looker and the New Romantic thing doesn't help. IIRC she got her tits out in the last ep so I'm assuming you were paying very close attention for brief moment . Then again I can't talk, I find Kel strangely attractive in some shots and not so much in others. And the red head who may as well not be there.

Think you'll find I mentioned his success with PSG as well, MWMG. And you needn't worry on the debate side, I'm with you now, I was obviously wrong.

I'd forgotten that one. Fair enough. I look forward to trophies Gerard.

What about the 2000 win? Actually never mind, I'm obviously wrong. Apologies all that I've offended.

Last post I ever reply to you Drat, because I think it's quite clear we've a distain for each other thats barely worth entertaining. I know a lot about players and sides, I don't know that much about managers off the top of my head, bar a few cases. Put simply, I've neither the time nor the inclination to look carefully at the state of world football and say who we should have gotten. And I don't think it's as easy as simply looking at whatever people have won as VCTM wants to do, I think you need to look a lot deeper than that and I won't be doing it, but will say that in all those clubs, there has to be someone we could have took an educated punt on. Instead we played we it cheap imo and played it incredibly safe. Get that into your head. I have never felt that 7th-12th comment was fair, I've explained how before. I've explained the MON stuff above. Now, I think it might be best if we just have a mental block over each others posts.

He beat Manchester United in the Community Shield, a match Manchester United dominated but Liverpools backs to the wall approach won out. He also beat them in the league a couple of times. It wasn't solely luck, he had a good team that was blessed with talents which helped enormously, which imo again doesn't say much for us (we don't have an Owen for instance), but those domestic routes were just pathetic. I'm loathe to mention O'Neill but I will say this for his record - I was more impressed by his work with Leicester than Celtic, and I find his wins with Leicester more impressive than Houllier's with Liverpool, simply because winning something with Leicester is an achievement and a half, winning something with Liverpool is almost expected as one of the countries biggest sides.

I will just pick up on this. Wolfsburg is a very prestigious job, they have a very impressive scouting system built up at the club, they have a fine stadium and are extremely well financed by VW. To say they were stumped as to get is totally wrong. The manager job there is of the most attractive options out there for most managers. Of course following on from Magath you have big shoes to fill, but if they did approach Houllier then it says something about his reputation in Europe. However now they have another excellent manager in McLaren who wasn't short of offers himself. They aren't a big team, but they are a team with massive potential and that is all that matters nowadays. Wolfsburg are the team I favour in Germany, so I know about them. It's not a prestigious job, they're somewhat of a nothing team who happen to be very well backed these days, being effectively VW FC. I wouldn't say it's one of the most attractive options out there by any means at all. Any manager that goes there will have a fair amount of money but sadly, they're Wolfsburg. By German standards they're minnows who are rich. They were stumped as far as my awareness goes as they realised they'd got a bit lucky in poaching Magath (who's swift leaving says as much as you'd like to know about how 'prestigious' the Wolfsburg job is really imo) and would struggle to replace him, turning initially to the former Stuttgart manager Veh, and now finally McClaren who is a burgeoning talent in European eyes but hardly a massive coup again. Wolfsburg might yet become a major player in Germany, though I doubt it simply because of their mall origins, but they aren't yet. Taking over them is a bit like taking over... Spurs say. Might be big some day, and have some money and some success... but not there yet. All off topic anyway. Agree to disagree if you don't follow this train fo thought.

Lyon dominated France for years, because they had the money and they had the players, it wasn't difficult to win things with them. It'd be like a slightly better standard of Scottish football but with one of Rangers or Celtic vanished off the face of the earth. Anyone not incompetent could have won the title with them. It's only as their team has aged, and other clubs have truly gotten their act together, that Lyon have fallen away somewhat. I doubt it'll be too long before they are back. Regardless, winning things from them isn't that difficult. Hence why I quoted Perrin, a man who was woeful at Portsmouth and wasn't exactly amazing in France either, despite being reasonably well held. Le Guen being a failure in Scotland is damning in my opinion - any manager worth their salt should be able to be at least competent with Rangers. Neither were raving successes anywhere but Lyon, and thusly I sincerely doubt the merit of saying 'Oh, Houllier was a success with those giants, Lyon'. I daresay Ian Holloway would be too at that period in time. A club so good he reckons we're 7th-12th material? Hmm... I think it's more likely he's got a somewhat decent ego and fancied having a crack at a good league again, if he genuinely was beating off offers. Your last line is pathetic. My inability to know all of the worlds managers and their current predicaments doesn't by default mean Houllier is the best we could have gotten.

A bit rich that, Drat, as anyone who's read a political thread in OT will attest. Particularly the first line, reeks of hypocrisy.

Being Wolfsburg's first choice doesn't really mean a lot - Wolfsburg, despite being exponentially better over the last couple of seasons, aren't really that big of a team, at all. Houlliers turning them down means about as much to us as them hiring McCLaren does. In fact Wolfsburg going for him probably states that he's not the great catch he's made out to be, Wolfsburg were a bit stumped as to who to get IIRC. Managing Lyon isn't that impressive. Lyon have had some absolute dross manage them over the years and still had that period of being absolutely dominant - Alain Perrin is one of their most successful managers, Paul Le Guen is too, both of which were **** shite in Britain. I really wouldn't quote success with Lyon as a boon for Houllier. Similarly, his Liverpool tenure isn't that impressive. He achieved little with Liverpool that wasn't already par for the course for them in the League (bar 1 season where they finished second, their previous Prem high being a couple of thirds IIRC), he steadily kept them top 4 for most of his tenure, which isn't that difficult really considering the size and finances of Liverpool. His Cup wins aren't without critique either - they fluked the FA Cup final where Owen, at that time a genius, nicked it on his own after complete Arsenal domination. And their course to the final was beyond simple, the draw being very, very kind. The same can be said of the League Cup, where even the final was pathetically easy against Small Heath. Only the UEFA Cup draw saw any difficulty for him, playing the likes of Porto and Barca, but I'm unsure how difficult these teams were in 2001, besides which the competition was a very, very different beast to what it is today, 13 matches to the final (I think) compared to 19 for Fulham last season. And being involved with UEFA technically... well, does that really mean much? It appears he gained the favour of the FFF following his early successes in France (again, with a big team, PSG) and has sort of hung around since. He's never been more than a technical director. He's not a bad manager but I really would stop well short of thinking he's some kind of coup. All of his successes have come with massive clubs, which thusly means little to us with regards success, and he's been out of the managing lark for a while and, for a man who himself said he was hankering to come back to management, doesn't appear to have been beating off offers with a stick, shall we say. I hope he's successful, but I really doubt he will be, he may get lucky in a cup I guess but he's not going to lead us to the CL or anything of the sort simply because, right now, we're Randy Lerner's Aston Villa and he doesn't have to clout to compete with Citeh or Tottenham. It would've taken a lot of luck to take us further anyway, along with careful smaller investment, with any manager, but it now looks decidedly like it's going to be reliant on luck alone, as the soundtrack to the club at the moment appears to be 'Ooooo, that's expensive, best not eh?'. Regardless, I hope he's successful and I somewhat look forward to seeing what he does with us. But we need to stop making out he's some fantastic coup for us, because he isn't. We pinched the French technical director, eventually, a man who had some success with enormous sides that, imo at least, make his CV look better than it really is, and one who's been out of the managerial game for 6 years and left Liverpool as somewhat of a laughable figure.

He's one of my most hated players with ease. Could do with some robust tackles at about knee height coming his way. As for Everton, I really don't think it's any different to their usual slow start. I remember hearing somewhere that they actually do it on purpose fitness wise to have an edge at the end of the season or something, not sure I believe it but hey ho. This season is only different because they've been particularly unlucky, their match against us for instance they should have romped away with, unfortunately for them our backs to the wall stuff worked and nothing fell for them. They'll do their normal thing soon enough and start winning more than they lose.

The past hour or so has seen about 5 large police vans head towards where the Pope currently is, going past our house. And for some reason my brother, who lives closer, has gone down too. Tried to take a photo but his camera is playing up. I have no idea why he wants a picture of the pope because he sure as hell isn't Catholic and isn't even religious, but apparently he does.

Yes.

I haven't got a clue. I lent towards Jol but knew it was unlikely given - Ajax's CL qualification, Ajax's giving into his demands re. players, and the sheer cost of his contract (circa £8m). I'm not sure what that matters though. Because I couldn't think of anyone I would have liked, which says more about quite how much I know of managers on the continent/the lack of thought of I've given it, means I have to like having Houllier? Not sure that follows. Look, I said when we had him, he was the best of the bad bunch we seemed to have placed as front runners. I don't think that necessarily means he's also the best we could have gotten, regardless of me personally being unable to name all the managers in the world that were attainable and better.

Forgive me if I disagree that Houllier wasn't a cheap option - I think a desk job in the backroom of the FFF is probably cheaper than front of house somewhere else. Just a thought. It seems to me as if you're wrong re. just wanting a big risk... I think it's more people wanted us to show some ambition in our hiring, rather than get someone who, imo at least, has a CV that flatters to deceive but is a safe choice, and one who already doesn't think a whole lot of us. Still, I hope he succeeds.

Well it isn't my job to hire the manger or know the state of all the managers in all the leagues in the world but I daresay we could have found someone from a league somewhere who is performing well and would be worth giving a go, who brings something new to the table. Unfortunately we're so risk averse (and/or cheap) that we didn't so we've got Houllier. Besides which my comment isn't entirely about Houllier, only partly. A lot of trouble of getting better in this league is, for want of a better way of putting it, everyone else we can't compete with. Best start just enjoying the ride imo.

Doesn't surprise me, as they said the same more or less last night and it's probably true in all honesty.

I did watch Charlie Wilson's War;). Possibly the least subtle subtle nod to 9/11 ever is present in that film. I noticed that AVP2 was in the TV guide thought since I was taping MOTD anyway I'd hop onto some mindless rubbish first. I'd just forgotten quite how bad it is. Especially as Channel4 seemed to have done a bit of an Alien season this week, showing Alien, Aliens and Alien 3 and now this, they seem like so many of us to be trying to forget Resurrection exists.

On on Channel4 right now is one of the worst films I've ever seen, AVP2: Requiem. I've ranted before on just how bad this film is but I almost want to recommend you tune in if you've nothing better to do. It's been on for half an hour but you'll have missed literally nothing, to say the film has a storyline would be like saying nursery rhymes are worthy of Pullitzers. Or you could catch it on 4+1. Either way, it's crap, but watch it for just how astonishingly bad it is if you've nothing better to do. For a hint of how bad it is, the Predator, one of sci-fi films greatest creations, is reduced to be a clean up man for at least an hour of the film, and not a single one of the cast is likable. Which is lucky, really, because very few make it. In fact, the film seems to know none of the cast is likable, as the ending can attest. Which is itself just gobsmackingly bad.

He possibly could if he had someone with more energy than Stan behind him? Predictable. We're going to have to move to a 3 if we're to have Ireland in there.

I suspected Ireland couldn't hack a proper CM role. I still think he's more technically gifted than that which he replaced but he just doesn't have the nature to impose on a midfield and still get the best out of him. We're gonna need a reshuffle if we want this midfield to perform.

Funny you bumped this Sie, I was sorta interested in it at release but not enough to invest. Over the last few days (coinciding with a Arkham Asylum re-play) I've really hankered for a 3rd person adventure game. And being... ahem... inspired by Zelda is probably another selling point. As is it being cheap. So it's going on my near future purchase list.

I love the assertion of truth in that statement from him, that being godless leads to a lesser man. word removed.