MikeMcKenna

I would be surprised in Paddy Riley and Almstadt are with us in 18 months time if we don't bounce back from the Championship. The club's finances are going to be in meltdown!

No problem mate. Having been involved with various direct action/protests over many years in different areas, I quickly realised there was insufficient interest. No point flogging a dead horse! :-)

Quite honestly I don't give a shit whether they 'Play the kids' or 'Play with themselves'

I don't think a boycott is feasible as a protest. But when we are in the Championship, gate receipts will be much more important. Wolves are a well supported team in the Championdship. Their turnover to year end May 2014 was £32 million. Leeds did £25 million and others get a lot, lot less. I don't know if things of change but Villa will get a parachute payment of £60 million over 4 years. For comparison, we turned over £119 million till May 2014. Our finances are going to take a hammering!!

I have little respect for many of our players and am disgusted with Lescott but they are they are the wrong targets. No amount of abuse so going to make them play better - quite the reverse. For now they actually do represent our club and wear our colours. You and many may wish they didn't but we are stuck with many of them for the foreseeable future. Do you really think that giving them abuse will improve our situation? If you do, please tell me how.

He is finished at AVFC as far as the fans are concerned - clearing in the woods!

Didn't realise you were on personal terms with him. Do tell us what other insights you have gleaned as you're so well informed.

I specifically said 'it will not make Lerner sell...' And went onto to say, that it was to show our disgust at the state on the club. I know it will not make him sell, but would rather this than boo the players on the pitch or flame away online. People will stay away next year and claim their apathy is a protest. It will make not a jot of difference. The one thing Lerner wants is to be out of the spotlight. This would have sent a message. As I said in another post, I will simply join the apathetic. Getting Villa fans to agree on any co-ordinated action is impossible.

Obviously there isn't sufficient support for my idea. But you say the Scousers ONLY got 15K walking out - that was quite a result and days later FSG reacted positively. Anyhow I will return to my bubble of apathy. I don't think anything that requires a major amount of organisation will get off the ground. By it's very definition you cannot harness apathy as a form of protest. The boycott idea was tried before when there was much more passion about and didn't get off the ground. Collymore loves to spout off and be verbally controversial but when push comes to shove he will not get physically involved. Other former players likewise will not get involved. On the way home yesterday listening to the radio, Mortimer was asked who he blamed. His response was 'I don't blame anybody and then he went onto blame the players" Bluntly he would not blame the clubs directors, Lerner etc He and the rest of the former players are not really fans in same sense as we are. They are part of the football establishment and will not risk their free tickets, speaking engagements, hospitality fees etc etc

Unfortunately we may have to fall even further till people stop being apathetic. That said look what happened to Leeds. They just went from one disaster to another with barely a whimper from the fans. I just don't think the passion is there anymore - it is easier for the fans to just walk away. Will be interesting to observe the state of things this time next year.

Exactly he is 'not a motivated seller'. We are stuck with him and need to get use to the idea of AVFC playing in the lower leagues - he is going nowhere :-(

Nope... He will wait. His BoA shares crashed in 2007, 9 years later they are worth nearly 85% less, he still holds the shares. He will never take a 'Championship price' - he doesn't need the money.

I saw/heard all this yesterday. After the 3rd or 4th goal, some people began shouting from above the directors box down towards Fox as were others below in the lower Trinity. Plenty of obscenities from the lower Trinity but I didnt hear any swearing from those above, just angry shouting. Obviously the ones above Fox were too close for comfort to the rarified atmosphere of the directors box and the stewards moved in. Obviously protest of any description is not acceptable. There was also a bunch of people over in the lower Ellis who started chanting - We want Lerner Out. Stewards moved in for some reason - what is that all about?

The reality is that he never was a 'businessman' he was an investor who stumped up a **** load of money, then employed businessmen, managers etc. Most 'investors' are glorified gamblers - especially the very rich ones ones. To put this into perspective, when his father died, the family sold MBNA to the Bank of America for shares and cash. In 2007 those shares were worth over $50, then the crash happened and today they are trading at less than $12. The Lerner family may have sold some shares but my understanding is that they still have a large number. Like many of the super rich, they will not cash all the shares and take the long term view that they will hopefully rise in value. So the BoA shares have been pretty disastrous for the Lerners. However that bitter pill was sweetened when they sold the Browns for $1 Billion - some you lose but others they win. This is exactly his position on AVFC imo..... The 'right owner' will be the one who matches Lerners asking price.

'Also we stand a better chance of being sold in the championship, the price is lower and Randy still wants rid of us' I think you are very wrong. While it is evidently true that he has ordered investment to be cut and to batten down the hatches, what a lot of people don't consider is that Lerner does not need the money! He does want to be rid, but not at any price. He can wait in the hope that we bounce back after a few seasons and buyers will be found. As I said in an earlier post, Lerner does not realise further losses till he sells. His ilk take a very long term term view on "investments' that are in a loss making position - the comment by Fox a year ago that Lerner is 'not a motivated seller' is code for 'Lerner is very rich, don't make any stupid offers, he doesn't need the money and can wait till the right offer comes along'. We are imo stuck with Lerner for years. Being in the Championship will have absolutely no impact on the asking price. Putting Hollis in as Chairman, making King a Director etc basically enables Lerner to distance himself from AVFC and forget about his investment till another mug comes along. Unless a miracle happens and we bounce back quickly, it is going to be a very bleak future for AVFC under his ownership.

I don't know that HH was actually part of any consortium. I only ever heard the rumour that he was a facilitator and even that maybe BS. If true they may not have gone any further because they could not evidence they had the funds. One of the first objectives of the sellers agents is too establish the viability of any interested buyer before even talking about the price.

I have bought businesses before. While the process is different for small businesses, I am certain that for a business of the nature of AVFC it is standard practice that Sellers or their advisers will ask you to sign a confidentiality or non-disclosure agreement before you can access any sensitive or detailed information. They will also ask for details about you and evidence of your ability to fund a purchase before releasing the above. Before they go any further.....

It was rumoured that HH was working with some interested party but I don't know whether it was true or not. If it was, they obviously didn't like the asking price. As regards a 'concerted media effort' - it is also a non-starter - the influential fans with any connections wouldn't stick their heads up again. Apathy rules..........

Before they give you anything, they will ask for evidence of funds. You will get no further information and they will not be prepared to meet if you cannot say where the money would come from. The ideas outlined above or anything like them are not "evidence of funds". Sorry but that is how it works - you will wasting your time.

But there is no point 'wishful thinking'. A boycott protest has never gained any momentum in the past. Season ticket holders paid over there money before the season began and withholding money per se is not the point.

I have said in the past that I would stump up a reasonable amount and I know others would too. But the Ellis part is a complete non starter. Beyond the tens of thousands he put into the Consortium in the late 60s and some loans later which were repaid with interest, he never put another penny into the club. I don't want to rain on your parade and wish something could be done, but..... insufficient fans would contribute the amount of money to make a difference Lerner will want to his full whack There is absolutely no chance Ellis would give anything I would love to be proved wrong and wish anyone who wants to give it a try lots of luck.

I am sure that like many who have suggested any form of protest in past, I will really get some stick for this but **** it, here goes. Although many have already effectively voted with their feet and no longer go to games, based on previous evidence few regular match goers would support a full blown boycott. This idea will not make Lerner sell but it will allow the fans to show him, the directors and the rest of the football world how disgusted we all are with the state of Aston Villa Football Club - OUR club! As our famous club was founded in 1874, to show our disgust with the current regime, does anyone think the idea of walking out on the 74th minute against Everton on 1st March and follow up with another walkout v Chelsea so the protests will have a greater impact that Lerner will hear loud and clear despite being 3000 miles away! We are now well and truly ****** so I don't think leaving 16 minutes early will make any difference to what happens on the pitch! From the third, fourth, fifth goal onwards today thousands walked out - it would be a much bigger statement if we did it en masse. If sufficient numbers think it is worth a shout, we could promote as widely as possible under the heading "OUT THE DOOR on '74" to see if the idea can gain momentum - however realistically there may not be sufficient time to get the word out for the Everton game and it may be better to leave till a later game. Other than VT I am not a member of any other forums so would need others to help canvas opinion on the other forums, Facebook pages, Twitter etc. Maybe some fans here or elsewhere have contacts in the media? For the record, I have supported Villa for 57 years, was brought up three miles from Villa Park but now live in Bournemouth. I travel up to every home game and currently have two season tickets in the Trinity but over the years have had Season Tickets in every stand. I have experienced all the highs and lows, got the t-shirt etc but this time round it seems much worse as I think we could be destined to spend more than a few years down below, especially if Randy Lerner remains. If enough others would help I would contribute financially to an Advert in the Birmingham Mail. If no one is interested, fair enough, but please save the abuse. It was just a thought on this most depressing of days when we experienced our worst defeat at home in 81 years! It may make no difference but I am sure it will help many fans feel better that we left a mark. Please only use this topic to discuss the protest described in the OP. Posts about what protest you'd like instead do not go in this thread. Trying to take this thread off topic will result in a warning.

I really understand your Dads pain. It feels like the heart of is being cut out of our club. After five seasons of absolute garbage and now facing almost certain relegation many are going to walk away and never come back. To the younger generations AVFC are perpetual losers - no wonder so many of them want to support the 'big 4' or cannot be bothered with football. This will be my third experience of a relegation from the top flight. The first two were terrible, but this time round it feels much, much worse. I will see the season out but I don't know if can stand being treated like a **** any more. Despite the ignominy and humiliation of past relegations, I always felt that we would come back and be great again. That was very true in the 70s and in the late 80s and early 90s we very nearly cracked it. This time it is different, I don't know if we will come back again and it really hit home today. Normally I go to the game with a good friend but he couldn't make it today and my son who makes the occasional game and had a weekend free asked if he could come along. On the way up to VP he was really excited as we both talked about the 'glimmer of hope'. Driving home we hardly spoke for three hours - I didn't know what to say him and was almost ashamed. He has never experienced the glorious Aston Villa that I did at his age and I don't think he ever will. The chances of him "keeping the faith" diminished dramatically today :-(

The "stay away" protest will happen automatically when we are relegated. As regards 'him being forced into a sale', I have no idea whether it would be possible by any means but for any campaign to have an impact it would require massive support across the spectrum of support. Unfortunately as the debates on VT and elsewhere show it would be almost impossible to get the required support. All those who campaigned against Ellis received a lot of vitriol, so few if any would be prepared to stick their heads above the parapet again! I hate to say it but there is **** all we can do :-(

In another thread talking about Lerner, yet another person has stated "he wants out...". But does he? Some believe that it is a black and white situation with Lerner saying: "Give me a £150 (?) million and it's yours...." I have now been told by two separate sources that any buyer may have to pick up some debt in excess of the asking price albeit on certain repayment terms. Add this to Fox's statement a year ago that Lerner "is not a motivated seller' and you have to question how much 'he wants out..." As it stands AVFC has a value on Lerners books. Having converted a tranche of £90 Million debt into equity he has already devalued its book value once but I sincerely believe he is not prepared to write off any more of the debt. The asking price may indeed be £150 million, but the buyer may also be required to pick up another £90 million worth of debt, albeit with long term credit and repayment terms. Don't want to depress everybody, but Lerner doesn't need to sell. He can claim on his books that AVFC is still worth (to him) £XXXXXX plus the outstanding debt. He will only realise an even bigger loss if he sells and obviously doesn't need the cash. So when we are relegated he will be even less motivated to sell and be prepared to wait. I believe he is gambling (again) that we will be back in the Premier League within 1/2 seasons, having generated a higher profile and greater appeal to wealthy suitors who are attracted by the massive income potential of an Premier League club. Imo Fox, Hollis et al have been tasked with running AVFC in the championship at breakeven and eventually selling the club on Lerners terms. Despite Lerners massive investment in AVFC, paying off to his ex-wife etc he is still a billionaire having sold the Browns for $1 billion. To those who say, Lerner wants to sell, and isn't the problem, I would respectfully suggest you are wrong - he know that at the price he wants Villa is unsaleable. In his mind he has been benevolent in the past but now it is all about the money! We are stuck with Lerner for years to come!