limpid

There's no-one else to instance with, they're all back into their gear hunt now. Might go back to levelling the hunter until I get my laptop's system disk upgraded for Vanguard.

I can't play in the week. And after the excitement of no social interaction all day on Sunday, it might take me a while.

I was watching the Fêar video the other day. His wedding dress is made by Frostbaal...

by OutByEaster? There has been a fair amount of talk lately about the North Stand and its future. With Randy Lerner describing it as his "least favourite stand". I don't know of anybody that seems to hold a lot of love for it and it seems that change at the very least is imminent for this part of Villa Park. Earlier this week an American Villatalk member asked why stadia in the UK were such a hotchpotch of buildings compared to the swanky super-stadia of the US. In explaining our strange footballing Arenas, a number of people found themselves resorting to a language of emotion, not architecture. For an English football ground, the fact that each stand is different means that each stand takes on its own character, we impart upon them a soul and they mean something to all of us. Villa Park is certainly no different; the obvious example is the famous Holte End. Can any of us say that we don't feel a frisson of excitement as we approach those imposing stairways? The Holte can lift a game, make a career, it has wit, it has scorn, and it has a roar that can raise the hairs on your neck. It's a living-breathing thing. The Trinity Road Stand too is an emotional subject for Villa fans, for the first few years of its life it's been nothing more than the symbol of commerce overtaking beauty. Its own values ignored in favour of our scorn at what might have been. The old Trinity Road stand was Aston Villa. The new one is only just being forgiven but given time I'm sure it will gain its own character. As for the Doug Ellis stand, well the stand itself is reasonably non-descript, but the name; mention it, and the reaction you'll get tells you everything you'll ever need to know about how we feel about Villa Park, and what these building mean to us. Then there's the North Stand, sat at one end of the ground, its cargo a strange mixture of kids and opposition fans. It's not an attractive building, and despite the fact it is still quite young it is now the oldest part of Villa Park. When I look at it, it doesn't particularly inspire any reaction, I don't have great memories of the North Stand, nor has it ever seemed to me to be the part of the ground that inspired or lifted or created. It's just sort of 'there'. The North Stand was born on January 19th 1977, and opened on August 27th of the same year for a game against Everton that we lost 2-1. Elvis had just died, inflation was at a dangerously high level and denim flares were much more popular than should ever be considered decent. The offices and suites at the rear of Villa Park didn't open for another three years, and when they opened, they were considered to be at the cutting edge of stadium hospitality design. Two layers of boxes and a lavish interior that rivalled anything football had seen, it is difficult to look at it now and think that it was once considered to be one of the finest most futuristic stands in Britain. So, the early Eighties, a time to revel in the glories of England's finest team playing in front of England's finest stand? Well, almost. In the Eighties, the North Stand was to have an impact on Villa Park that was to help shape the clubs history for the next 20 years. The Chairman at the time the stand was built was William Dugdale, but he'd departed almost as soon as it had been completed to be replaced by Harry Kartz, and then by Ron Bendall, the man who alongside his son Don would preside over some of the greatest years of our history. A glorious time, but the memories were soured by the influence of the North Stand. It was Ron who oversaw the completion of the suite of offices in the North Stand with stadium manager Terry Rutter overseeing the works. It seemed there was plenty of work to be done, and no expense was spared as costs spiralled and the club dropped into debt. The stand had cost a million pounds to build; these fittings and alterations came to £1.3 million. An internal audit found that half of this money couldn't be accounted for, and whilst this figure was later found to be incorrect, it soon became clear that all was not well with the running of the football club. The police became involved, and the Bendall family ended its connection with Aston Villa Football Club as it became clear that Ron Bendall had conspired with members of his own staff to obtain money by deception from the Football trust. Terry Rutter was jailed, a fate that Ron escaped. He died in 1983. So, from the best team in England playing in front of the best stand, we quickly became a debt ridden company, playing in the shadow of the building that had come to represent our own complicity in our downfall. The true cost of the North Stand it would seem was the collapse of the team and board that had taken us to our greatest successes. There are many older and wiser than I who can explain more clearly the events of this whirlwind period in our history, my apologies if I've misrepresented any of the players, or if my facts are inaccurate. I was only ten at the time. What now for the club and the North Stand? Well, both were in new ownership, and the Bentley outside could only mean one thing. Herbert Douglas Ellis was in town. In the twenty-five years that Doug owned the North Stand, Villa Park undertook enormous changes, with every other stand being rebuilt. The North stand also saw changes, the cavity at its rear was filled in for more suites, the lower tier had seats added following the Taylor report and a hospitality section was added in the centre of the upper tier. Over that time, and with fresh new siblings now all around it, the North Stand began to appear progressively more grubby, its seventies styling looking out of place, and its size increasingly becoming an issue. Doug responded by getting planning permission for a grand new stand, although whether he ever intended to complete this project we'll never know, and in many ways the only stand that stayed with him for the whole of his second tenure at Villa Park is a much more fitting monument to his stewardship than the one he named after himself. Once ground breaking and innovative, it had become a fading anachronism, which now looked out of place in the modern football world. Time for change. Step forward then Randy Lerner, the latest owner of the club and its least favourite stand, this week Randy spoke about his desire to update the stadium, and to change a number of areas. Of the North Stand he said: "When we get to the North Stand we may look at something more progressive architecturally - going from the deeply historical to the current." I guess that means he has in mind something a lot more modern in its design than some of the other aspects of Villa Park. I'm not sure if this means a new stand or an update of the current one. Let's see what he's got to work with: [*:552790b17a]The North Stand holds 7,360 supporters including its boxes. That's less than the 7,750 that can be housed in the lower Holte End. [*:552790b17a]Structurally its 'goalpost' style roof support means that it's very difficult to extend the stand around to fill in the corners. These supports will always be in the way, so in order to update what is already there, you'd need to first completely remove the roof and add in an alternative method of support for the new roofs structure. [*:552790b17a]The Stand houses many of the clubs offices and a good amount of hospitality facilities. [*:552790b17a]Behind the stand is the only real area of space at Villa Park; it allows room for designs to match the loftiest of ambitions. General Krulak says: "Redevelopment of the North Stand. The long-range plan (or our current vision) would have a major piece of work done... to include a major restructuring of both inside and out... expanding capacity and functionality. It would be nice to eventually have a brand new store in the stand... a mega-store capability." Interesting that this suggests a re-structure rather than a re-build, especially difficult if the club plans to house a mega-store within the structure. From a personal standpoint, I think that Villa Park is a ground with its history in brick, and I'd hope that any new North Stand would take advantage of the space to its rear to reflect the style of the old Trinity Road Stand. I'd like to think that the architectural keys in the Holte Hotel, echoed in the rear of the Holte end, and to a lesser degree at the rear of the Doug Ellis Stand will become the signature of our stadium. It's this that makes us special; I'm not a big fan of glass and steel, and I've never been a fan of brushed concrete, even if it has just been cleaned. I wonder to what extent season ticket sales this summer will influence the changes made to the North Stand, and I'm hoping that the rumoured Olympic games grant will also be able to make a positive impact. Whatever Mr Lerner decides to do with the North Stand, he's shown a desire to things the right way so I'm sure it will be something we can all look forward to and hopefully something that quickly takes on its own character, something with a soul. As we approach its final years, I would hope that the North Stand will be remembered, its days are numbered but it has seen good times and bad, seen off two Chairmen, numerous managers and been visited by almost every team in the league. It won't be eulogised for its beauty like the old Trinity Road Stand, nor for the memories of all our childhoods like the old Holte End, but I for one am hoping it will be remembered fondly. It lived in interesting times.

Most boring night ever. Nothing social, just playing against the computer.

meh, my CoC hits for nearly that and I'm still a lowbie with magically vanishing gear.

If you would like to chat about famous fans, please could you start a new thread.

I miss raiding, but no-one's available when I am.

If you would like to discuss smoking in the ground, please start a new thread.

by drat01 Inspired by 2 excellent news articles, a story from a proud grand dad. Just over 12 months ago now I got the phone call we in the family had all wanted. It was from my son and he said “Dad, Welcome Joseph Harry to the family”. I had become a grand-dad, people who have met me will now be going “No way you are far too young!”, but no we had a new addition not only to our family but also to the Villa family. I was prepared for this, Werthers originals in my pocket, a new cardigan and slippers for me and for the boy obviously a brand new Claret and Blue scarf. Despite living some way from Villa Park there was never any question, this lad was to grow up as a Villa fan. But!, like any parent or grand-parent you want the best for your family and the club that was hopefully going to be part of Joe’s life from now on was not a pretty one. I’d seen the glory days and nights of Rotterdam and Highbury etc, even Joe’s dad had seen them winning trophies at Wembley, but the way the club was at this time it looked as though Joe would have to wait a very long time before he saw his grand-dad drunk celebrating another Villa trophy win. Add to this, things we saw and heard about the way the club was run, something that had been building over a period of years from fans protests, manager comments, players wanting away because of lack of ambition, players being chastised in the press for things that on the surface were not true. The club had no ambition, kits and sponsors were not in the premier league, Joe would never be able to go to the local shop as he grew older and buy the new Villa shirt. Frankly Villa had become something that was heading in only one direction and that wasn’t upwards. Half way through this first year though, things were about to change at Villa Park. Enter Randy Lerner and his team. Randy who? There was scepticism from certain quarters that this Yank was in it not for the right reasons. It was another Man Utd takeover, “what does he know about running a football club?”. With Randy though came a team of people including the main focus, Martin O’Neill. I’ll leave it to the others to, rightly, sing the praises of that man because as “fans” of VillaTalk will know if they haven’t become too bored with my waffle, I like to look at the bigger picture. What Randy started virtually straight away was to introduce change into areas of the club that had seldom seen any for far too many years. The stream of positive initiatives for fans, from laying on of coaches to Chelsea for 6,000 to the establishment of fans forums. VillaTalk and other web forums had a senior member of his team posting on here, absolutely amazing. Virtually straight away player’s quotes showed that they were happier with how things looked at the club, new training facilities being built, player’s injuries being dealt with by the top people, contracts being negotiated behind the scenes rather than through the press. Ron Saunders coming back to Villa Park. Work commencing on what had become a eye-sore, the renovation of the Holte Hotel, and many many more. Randy is by all accounts a quiet man, the lack of quotes in the media backing this up. What he does know obviously though is what is important to getting a successful football club. For the first time in many a long year, we have square pegs in square holes, star pegs in star holes and striped pegs in striped holes (see what I did there?). All of this will enable Martin and his team to provide hopefully the main success on the pitch. It’s not an overnight process and it’s a bit like little Joe as he grows up. Now 1 year old he can walk, albeit at time’s he has a little stumble. He understands instinctively who are the people who will provide for him and he looks and listens to them. There will be a few tears no doubt but as we progress these become less and less to be replaced by genuine smiles. Mr. Lerner on behalf of 3 generations of Villa fans we salute and thank you.

Preparation time was as long as it took to type the above two sentences.

Please keep all transfer rumours in this thread. Any threads left from the January window will be closed shortly.

But at least as a priest, you can just play on weekends and will get invited to raids. I don't think that applies to any other class.

and you have an Orange mobile, must have been truly awful...

To reinforce Ali, this was a piece about the author's opinion, not the author. It is not acceptable to post about the poster.

Please feel free to post your own front page article on your position and don't post about posters.

Try clicking "VillaTalk Village" at the top left of the page...

Cheers Nays, got that down at better than 1MB/s

It's just bittorrent. Blizzard don't know how to seed properly.

by PB The direction of the new look Aston Villa Football Club was unveiled by new Chief Executive Richard Fitzgerald yesterday. PB was taking notes. Aston Villa will be competing in the Champions League in five years time. So says the new man in charge of day to day operations at Villa Park Richard Fitzgerald. Richard, who joined the club on January 1st, was formerly a big cheese at marketing giants IMG alongside fellow director Bob Kain and it will not be a surprise to you therefore to hear that marketing, both locally and globally forms a key part of the plan to take Villa forwards. “What’s new?” I hear the ever sceptical Villa fans say, “Villa has always talked about qualifying for the Champions League, always talked about Jam tomorrow. This is just more of the same”. In one respect they are indeed correct, as was posted on the message board yesterday Doug Ellis indeed always had a 5 year plan. That plan largely involved him staying in control and talking about the Champions League while not actually having much of a clue how to achieve such an aim. Actions, they say, talk louder than words, which is why you want the first thing your new CEO to say is: “Actions speak louder than words but the board is committed to developing the club and providing the platform for Aston Villa to compete at the highest level of the Premier League and in Europe.” Yeah yeah, jam tomorrow, heard it all before Richard. Tell us something we don’t know. "In a year's time, we would like to see an infrastructure being built to support a club competing for top honours, competing in the top half of the Premier League and for a European place.” So what? We have often competed in the top half of the table, often qualified for Europe. It’s all the same as before. Given the amount of money Martin O’Neill has just spent we had better be in the top half of the table next season... “In five years time, we aim to compete in the Champions League” Well, we’ve heard it all before. Lets see the plan, how, exactly, do you intend to take this rather mediocre mid table club to the point where it can successfully compete with Chelsea, Arsenal, Manchester United and Liverpool, because in order to even qualify for the Champions League we will need to finish above one of these four for the first time in quite some years. “My brief from the board is clear - to fill the stadium week in and week out; create an infrastructure to support a top club. We are very aware the local population of 5.3million is a vast potential supporter base and we will focus the core of our commercial ambitions here. "And, although the global growth of our fan base is not presently the club's most urgent priority, it is nevertheless of strategic importance to the long term. We will potentially look to the United States as we deem it a fast growing soccer market. Our US connections make it more achievable. "There are also a lot of opportunities around Asia, particularly for the bigger clubs. The Premier League is incredibly popular. But international expansion at this moment will require strong partners that we do not currently have for it to work effectively - and a winning team." Well, as the man says, actions speak louder than words. It all sounds very plausible and sensible, and the track records of all of these people suggest strongly that they know how to succeed. At the end of the day though they will not be judged on their plans, on their words, they will be judged by a supporter base that has seen more false dawns than you can imagine on results, ultimately on what the team does on the pitch. It is reassuring to know that we have people like this in the background creating the right infrastructure as if you believe for one minute that success can be built without everything being in place off the pitch then you are living in the past. So, I’ll see you all at the Nou Camp in 2012 then? Looking forward to it already. PB.

by PB The transfer market has finally come to life for Villa, writes PB, as Norwegian hard man John Carew trades places with Milan Baros. So, Martin O’Neill pulls another rabbit out of the hat, as he manages to get rid of a “problem” player in the shape of Milan Baros and replaces him in the same bit of business with a guy who looks very much like he should be able to have an instant impact on the Premiership. Villa fans have always liked their centre forwards to be the kind of lads that won’t take any nonsense and know how to rough up a defender or two. The old ‘urns will tell you all about Andy Lockhead and how he led Villa’s heroic charge to the 1971 League Cup Final as a third division side, beating Manchester United en route. The slightly younger ones like me remember Andy Gray before he wore sharp suits in a TV studio; back in the late 70’s when Andy’s bubble-permed head was wherever the ball happened to be. While the 6’3” Carew doesn’t exactly have that kind of scoring record, I have a sneaky suspicion that we might just have a cult hero here. (Yes, I know I said that about Baros, but I was wrong, OK?) He is big, he is strong, and he is the kind of player with a real physical presence to make defenders work for their money. Vastly experienced, with loads of Champions League experience with Rosenborg, Besiktas, Valencia and Lyon, Carew will give the Villa front line exactly what it has been missing – muscle. The Norwegian heavyweight will be a real favourite of the Holte End I am sure. In the same breath of course we bid farewell and “bon voyages” to the sadly indifferent form of Czech striker Milan Baros. O’Neill has a reputation that says that he will not stand for people that give less than 100%, and you’d have to be a pretty blinkered fan of our Milan to believe he always tried his hardest. Too many shrugs, too many dives, too many invisible performances in a Villa shirt masked a talent that is, when the lad can be bothered, one of the brightest in the world. I wish him all the best at Lyon, where I trust the slower pace of Le Championnat (or Ligue 1 or whatever we're supposed to call the French league these days) will be more suited to his often languid style. What a shame. Anyway, I believe that this deal is really quite extraordinary, as it offers pretty much everyone exactly what they want. Baros gets to play on the big stage again, Carew gets to play week in and week out, Lyon get shot of an unhappy squad player as do we. Once again, congratulations to all concerned. What a smart bit of work Mr O’Neill! PB